“Doing” my PPL...
Discussion
This is a bit of a random/broad enquiry, but I’ve recently had a reasonably decent and somewhat unexpected PPI refund from my bank. I’ve been toying with the idea of doing my PPL for a few years now, but I’ve always been put off by the cost. I’m now in a position where I could potentially be able to fund it in one hit.
I know there are a number of exams to take, a medical and a minimum 45 hours flying time (although from what little reading I’ve done so far, 45 hours is the bare minimum and it seems that 55-65 hours is more realistic).
I’ve a few questions and was wondering what people’s thoughts and/or recommendations are, so here we go:
Is it worth going to somewhere with “better” weather, such as the USA, and doing it in one go, over a period of a few weeks? Obviously the downsides to this approach are the additional costs of travel and accommodation, as well as the lack of skills/experience dealing with non optimal weather conditions. Then of course there are the costs of “converting” the PPL from FAA (or wherever) to CAA equivalent.
Would it be worth doing the same thing, ie all in one go, at a flight school here in the UK? If so, what/where would people recommend?
Does anyone have any recommendations for flight schools/instructors/CAA trainers/examiners, in the NW of England - ideally Merseyside/Lancashire/Manchester?
What are the realistic, all-in costs? I have a figure in my head, having spoken to a couple of people, but I’d be interested to hear different views/advice/suggestions (not just on the costs, but in general).
Thanks in advance.
I know there are a number of exams to take, a medical and a minimum 45 hours flying time (although from what little reading I’ve done so far, 45 hours is the bare minimum and it seems that 55-65 hours is more realistic).
I’ve a few questions and was wondering what people’s thoughts and/or recommendations are, so here we go:
Is it worth going to somewhere with “better” weather, such as the USA, and doing it in one go, over a period of a few weeks? Obviously the downsides to this approach are the additional costs of travel and accommodation, as well as the lack of skills/experience dealing with non optimal weather conditions. Then of course there are the costs of “converting” the PPL from FAA (or wherever) to CAA equivalent.
Would it be worth doing the same thing, ie all in one go, at a flight school here in the UK? If so, what/where would people recommend?
Does anyone have any recommendations for flight schools/instructors/CAA trainers/examiners, in the NW of England - ideally Merseyside/Lancashire/Manchester?
What are the realistic, all-in costs? I have a figure in my head, having spoken to a couple of people, but I’d be interested to hear different views/advice/suggestions (not just on the costs, but in general).
Thanks in advance.
There are (from memory) a number of flight schools whom you can get a European / British licence with training/exams conducted overseas.
It used to be a big saving, but with current currency rates, flights and accommodation, probably not a huge saving, but you stand a good chance of doing it in less hours if you make it a flying 'holiday'. Weather in the UK is so unpredictable for flying, that you may well find yourself taking 60+ hours as mentioned, purely down to the fact that you have to go back and revisit lessons you've already done, as it's been so long since you did it.
Staying current, as mentioned is an ongoing issue. So you'll need to factor that in. . . .maybe not in the first year or two - you'll have plenty of takers to come flying with you, but as the years tick by, it'll become more of an issue. It's not a huge problem if you let it lapse, so don't think it's a necessity to stay current.
You'll need to find a club or syndicate who will let you hire their aircraft. Find somewhere local - within 30 mins is ideal. Again, this costs money.
Look at the NPPL - I fly for fun on one of these, and for the sort of flying I want to do (light aircraft, sunny days, UK based) it's ideal.
It used to be a big saving, but with current currency rates, flights and accommodation, probably not a huge saving, but you stand a good chance of doing it in less hours if you make it a flying 'holiday'. Weather in the UK is so unpredictable for flying, that you may well find yourself taking 60+ hours as mentioned, purely down to the fact that you have to go back and revisit lessons you've already done, as it's been so long since you did it.
Staying current, as mentioned is an ongoing issue. So you'll need to factor that in. . . .maybe not in the first year or two - you'll have plenty of takers to come flying with you, but as the years tick by, it'll become more of an issue. It's not a huge problem if you let it lapse, so don't think it's a necessity to stay current.
You'll need to find a club or syndicate who will let you hire their aircraft. Find somewhere local - within 30 mins is ideal. Again, this costs money.
Look at the NPPL - I fly for fun on one of these, and for the sort of flying I want to do (light aircraft, sunny days, UK based) it's ideal.
If you're doing a PPL and not doing anything more than that, do it in the UK. By the time you've got your license, got there and back, etc you're in it for the same amount of money and you'll find yourself more familiar with the local airspace.
Learning to fly is the expensive bit. Once you've got your license depending on what you want to do - it can get a lot cheaper.
There's a lot of mileage in getting a microlight license. 3 Axis microlights are great fun, fly really nicely, and how often do you need to take more than one person with you.
I own a small share in an aircraft - my flying habit costs me about the same as running a "fun" car (IE, about a grand a year plus fuel). I do about 20yrs a year in my own aircraft and another 20 in other peoples (Motor glider instruction, glider towing, etc).
Learning to fly is the expensive bit. Once you've got your license depending on what you want to do - it can get a lot cheaper.
There's a lot of mileage in getting a microlight license. 3 Axis microlights are great fun, fly really nicely, and how often do you need to take more than one person with you.
I own a small share in an aircraft - my flying habit costs me about the same as running a "fun" car (IE, about a grand a year plus fuel). I do about 20yrs a year in my own aircraft and another 20 in other peoples (Motor glider instruction, glider towing, etc).
As a PPL student who has been training for 18 months, I would say go to Florida and do it there. Weather, instructor availability, aircraft serviceability and a 6 month work trip have stopped me completing mine in the UK. Fingers crossed I’ll have it done by April.
If you go abroad you can come back to the Uk, join a club (I’d recommend this over a share, at least initially), then convert to EASA/UK CAA (Brexit dependent).
Cost wise at a club level you are looking at anything from £100/hr to hire an aircraft such as a PA28.
Despite my setbacks, I love it and am already planning how I’ll be able to go for the CPL and an instructor cert once I have the PPL.
If you go abroad you can come back to the Uk, join a club (I’d recommend this over a share, at least initially), then convert to EASA/UK CAA (Brexit dependent).
Cost wise at a club level you are looking at anything from £100/hr to hire an aircraft such as a PA28.
Despite my setbacks, I love it and am already planning how I’ll be able to go for the CPL and an instructor cert once I have the PPL.
jjones said:
never ever ever pay up front for more than 5 lessons at a time. so many people have lost 45 lessons worth of cash when the company goes bust.
Sorry - this is by far and away the most important thing, regardless of where you do it. Also put it on a credit card if you can so you have some form of protection.Flying schools going pop is mercifully rare, but...
Passed my skills test on the 29th Nov at 47 hours. I was ready at 45 hours but the weather was crap, cancelled my skills test 6 times!! Did 2 hours of keeping my eye waiting for the weather! I’m 33.
I started in February and had a 6 week break in the summer for holidays me and my instructor. Did mine at halfpenny Green. Could have done it quicker but my instructor is a captain for virgin Atlantic so had to fit in with that and my own job.
Weather is a problem in the Uk however you do need to factor in the travel and accommodation going to the US.
One benefit of doing it here is you get used to flying in the UK including the weather! I did 4.5 hours in the week following my skills test and haven’t flown since mainly due to weather.
Cost me £10,340 (£220/hr) for my 47 hours plus £150 for my skills test excluding aircraft Hire. £280 for the 9 exams and course material plus £1000 for my Bose A20 headset. £250 for my radio training/written exam and practical test.
I really enjoyed learning, went solo at 7hrs on the 1st of April. A day you never forget!!
Planning to do my night rating very soon and aerobatic rating when the weather gets better and my stomach can take the G!
Can’t wait to get flying ASAP tbh!
I started in February and had a 6 week break in the summer for holidays me and my instructor. Did mine at halfpenny Green. Could have done it quicker but my instructor is a captain for virgin Atlantic so had to fit in with that and my own job.
Weather is a problem in the Uk however you do need to factor in the travel and accommodation going to the US.
One benefit of doing it here is you get used to flying in the UK including the weather! I did 4.5 hours in the week following my skills test and haven’t flown since mainly due to weather.
Cost me £10,340 (£220/hr) for my 47 hours plus £150 for my skills test excluding aircraft Hire. £280 for the 9 exams and course material plus £1000 for my Bose A20 headset. £250 for my radio training/written exam and practical test.
I really enjoyed learning, went solo at 7hrs on the 1st of April. A day you never forget!!
Planning to do my night rating very soon and aerobatic rating when the weather gets better and my stomach can take the G!
Can’t wait to get flying ASAP tbh!
Learning to fly these days is only for obsessives!
The money is only part of the equation. It’s massively time consuming. Very hard work and challenging to start with. Keeping currency in training in the northwest is not easy given weather/work etc. But, it is an incredible experience.
Try ravenair at Liverpool for an hour’s trial.
The money is only part of the equation. It’s massively time consuming. Very hard work and challenging to start with. Keeping currency in training in the northwest is not easy given weather/work etc. But, it is an incredible experience.
Try ravenair at Liverpool for an hour’s trial.
I would suggest against Florida - sure it’s easy to learn to fly where the weathers always good and airspace relatively empty - but that’s not what’s going to keep you safe when you get back here when even after a 2 hour flight the airfield you took off from could be a completely different place wind/weather wise.
I’d suggest looking at the NPPL - those little micro lights have come on a long way, fun to fly, usually plenty of syndicates around to join to reduce the cost.
https://www.bmaa.org/information-library/pilot-lic...
I learnt in a C42 and with a 110mph cruise speed and 450mile range did everything I wanted it to.
Eta - as others have said, you really need to commit to it as if you let the license lapse it really is a problem (speaking from experience!).
I’d suggest looking at the NPPL - those little micro lights have come on a long way, fun to fly, usually plenty of syndicates around to join to reduce the cost.
https://www.bmaa.org/information-library/pilot-lic...
I learnt in a C42 and with a 110mph cruise speed and 450mile range did everything I wanted it to.
Eta - as others have said, you really need to commit to it as if you let the license lapse it really is a problem (speaking from experience!).
Edited by Petrus1983 on Sunday 5th January 11:06
I'm a flying instructor.
First thought - learning how to fly is generally lots of fun, and for many people it is the most enjoyable period of their aviation "career". With that in mind it's best not to think off it as a hurdle to be overcome as quickly as possible, but as an experience in itself. Choose your school / instructor carefully and try to enjoy the whole process. I once did an "accelerated" course in Florida and it was many things but "fun" wasn't one of them.
Think about how you are going to keep flying once you have qualified. As previous posters have said, traditional aeroplanes are only one part of the modern aviation scene - have a look at microlights and gyroplanes too. A surprising amount of sport aviation in the UK takes place in homebuilt aircraft operating on a Permit to Fly which really keeps costs down. There are lots of groups about with low cost shares & low hourly rates - generally the best place to find them is on the noticeboards of local airfields. Take a look at the Light Aircraft Association website for more info.
My advise would be to learn locally, fly regularly while training (at least once a week, more often if you can), and plan to fly at least once a month once you have qualified (imagine learning how to drive and then only driving once a month - you'd never get to be any good ....).
As an aside the whole Florida think really doesn't work as well as it did 10+ years ago. The shift in exchange rates means that the cost differential isn't anywhere near what it used to be, and since 9/11 the requirements for Visas and TSA approvals etc are a time consuming and costly PITA.
First thought - learning how to fly is generally lots of fun, and for many people it is the most enjoyable period of their aviation "career". With that in mind it's best not to think off it as a hurdle to be overcome as quickly as possible, but as an experience in itself. Choose your school / instructor carefully and try to enjoy the whole process. I once did an "accelerated" course in Florida and it was many things but "fun" wasn't one of them.
Think about how you are going to keep flying once you have qualified. As previous posters have said, traditional aeroplanes are only one part of the modern aviation scene - have a look at microlights and gyroplanes too. A surprising amount of sport aviation in the UK takes place in homebuilt aircraft operating on a Permit to Fly which really keeps costs down. There are lots of groups about with low cost shares & low hourly rates - generally the best place to find them is on the noticeboards of local airfields. Take a look at the Light Aircraft Association website for more info.
My advise would be to learn locally, fly regularly while training (at least once a week, more often if you can), and plan to fly at least once a month once you have qualified (imagine learning how to drive and then only driving once a month - you'd never get to be any good ....).
As an aside the whole Florida think really doesn't work as well as it did 10+ years ago. The shift in exchange rates means that the cost differential isn't anywhere near what it used to be, and since 9/11 the requirements for Visas and TSA approvals etc are a time consuming and costly PITA.
Edited by this is my username on Sunday 5th January 12:21
As has been alluded to above, flying in the UK generally involved crappy weather and congested airspace, so learning under those conditions - and accepting that it will take longer than going somewhere with constant clear blue and unrestricted skies - will stand you in good stead.
The one thing that hasn't been mentioned is that there are a number of Police flying clubs across the country - depending on where you are, it might be worth getting in contact with one of those.
There are more than a few ex-Police officers who have gone on to become flying instructors after they retire from the force.....
jjones said:
this is my username said:
and for many people it is the most enjoyable period of their aviation "career".
agree with that, don't rush it
k it, that’s how they wanted to spend their time so why not! this is my username said:
As an aside the whole Florida think really doesn't work as well as it did 10+ years ago. The shift in exchange rates means that the cost differential isn't anywhere near what it used to be, and since 9/11 the requirements for Visas and TSA approvals etc are a time consuming and costly PITA.
I would definitely agree with that; when I went around 20 years ago to Clearwater, Florida I was paying $38 per hour with no landing charges when the exchange rate was 2-1. I'd started training here in the UK and was paying £100 an hour and £12 per landing (to be fair this was at Edinburgh/Turnhouse). I went solo after 6/7 hours in Florida and racked up a lot of cheap hours mastering handling the plane and repeated touch and go's. It was all a bit more informal back then!Edited by this is my username on Sunday 5th January 12:21
Dibble said:
What are the realistic, all-in costs? I have a figure in my head, having spoken to a couple of people, but I’d be interested to hear different views/advice/suggestions (not just on the costs, but in general).
Mostly what's been said above really, I fly microlights on an NPPL. It took me just under a year and 51 hours to get my licence, cost about £6k I think. As above do consider ongoing costs of keeping it up, I do about 50 hours a year and the advantages of being able to do your own servicing and running on unleaded with sane fuel consumption are quickly apparent.It takes as long as it takes and whilst these things have a minimum number of hours required unless you're really young, very good at learning new things and naturally good at flying it'll take longer (minimum hours for NPPL is 25, it typically takes between 40 and 60 with older students taking longer).
Whilst waiting for the weather is a pain you'll be far more able to cope with less than perfect conditions if that's what you learn in and sometimes a forced break from it is a good thing and you'll figure out a lot of stuff just thinking about it while you're not flying. I aimed to do about three hours a fortnight whilst learning which mostly seemed to work for me.
Zombeh - is yours with a Rotax engine? Certainly servicing those is easy enough.
Also agree that you should aim for good chunks of time or your next lesson will just be a refresher of the lesson before.
I was lucky and hit the minimum times of everything, but had been flying gliders for 6 years from the age of 15 so I guess that’s cheating.
Also agree that you should aim for good chunks of time or your next lesson will just be a refresher of the lesson before.
I was lucky and hit the minimum times of everything, but had been flying gliders for 6 years from the age of 15 so I guess that’s cheating.
Spooky, just booked my eyetest for Wednesday which is the first part of a Class 2 Medical so I can start my PPL.
Had various trial lessons over the years in a PA28, trike weightshift microlight & a glider. I fly models which does help in the sense of knowing some of the aerodynamics, control names etc.
Debate at the moment is whether I do mine at Rochester which is a 30 min bike ride or 15 minutes in the car, but only fly Cessna 152/172s which I think I will struggle to get in/out of due to a stiff back. Also strip is normally closed due to water logging in the winter.
Or Headcorn which is a 35-45 minute drive but flies Robins which will be easier to get in/out of & also doesn't get water logged.
Costs for both are pretty much the same.
Had various trial lessons over the years in a PA28, trike weightshift microlight & a glider. I fly models which does help in the sense of knowing some of the aerodynamics, control names etc.
Debate at the moment is whether I do mine at Rochester which is a 30 min bike ride or 15 minutes in the car, but only fly Cessna 152/172s which I think I will struggle to get in/out of due to a stiff back. Also strip is normally closed due to water logging in the winter.
Or Headcorn which is a 35-45 minute drive but flies Robins which will be easier to get in/out of & also doesn't get water logged.
Costs for both are pretty much the same.
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