Poor brake pedal feel?

[Legend83]

Hi all,

Following on from my 'I crashed my '5 thread', I wanted some advice on my brakes which I feel contributed somewhat to my accident.

Two weeks before the crash, I had all the discs and pads replaced with MX5-Parts aftermarket discs and EBC 'Kevlar' pads.

Now I know they are not the best pads, but surely they must be comparable to Mazda stock.

But since I picked her up from the garage that did the work, the brake pedal has been really spongy, with a lot of travel before I can feel them doing anything.

When I crashed I really had to give them some welly which ultimately caused them to lock.

Do you think I should be suspicious of the fitting, the parts or should I check my brake fluid?

[Red Firecracker]

I would suggest a change of brake fluid obviously followed by a good bleed. I guess you know that none of the calipers are seized as you'd have noticed it when you replaced the pads.

I must say, I'd also change the pads.

[Munter]

1st step for spongy brakes has to be a bleed and flush through with nice new fluid.

How long had you had the disks and pads on the car? I seem to find the 1st couple of days on new disks/pads they are not as effective as I'd like and then they come on better.

[205gtinut]

All brake pads tent to feel 'spongy' when first fitted. They need time to 'bed in'. You should find it will improve with time. I agree, though check the fluid and change if neccessary.......

[Legend83]

Discs and pads have been on the car for 88 miles now, so should be starting to bed in.

Rear calipers were also changed so not sure if this has caused a problem.

Should I flog the 'Kevlars' on ebay and get something better?

[anonymous-user]

I've got those Kevlar pads on mine and they bite really well, much better feel than the standard Mazda pads.

[HRG]

Legend83 said:

Discs and pads have been on the car for 88 miles now, so should be starting to bed in.

Rear calipers were also changed so not sure if this has caused a problem.

Should I flog the 'Kevlars' on ebay and get something better?

IMO they weren't properly bled as the hydraulic system must have been opened up to do it. Sponginess is a result of poor fluid, lack of bite is down to the pads.

[Legend83]

JimSuperSix said:

I've got those Kevlar pads on mine and they bite really well, much better feel than the standard Mazda pads.

There is no reason for them not to be half decent. I am talking a good 3-4 inches of travel before I get any feel (lets not forget the pads certainly bit hard when I slammed them on before ploughing into the back of a Peugeot!).

I will read up on bleeding the brakes tonight and see if I can do it myself - I assume it is a relatively easy for the novice DIYer?

[Legend83]

HRG said:

Legend83 said:

Discs and pads have been on the car for 88 miles now, so should be starting to bed in.

Rear calipers were also changed so not sure if this has caused a problem.

Should I flog the 'Kevlars' on ebay and get something better?

IMO they weren't properly bled as the hydraulic system must have been opened up to do it. Sponginess is a result of poor fluid, lack of bite is down to the pads.

Thanks HRG.

[MX-5 Lazza]

Definitely agree with everyone else. Air/moisture in the fluid will cause spongy brake and long pedal travel.
Another thing to consider is brake lines. If you have original rubber brake lines one of them might be on it's way out...

[Legend83]

Is it likely the mechanic did not adjust the new calipers i.e. forced the old pistons back to remove the calipers, then not wound the pistons in on the new calipers?

[HRG]

Legend83 said:

Is it likely the mechanic did not adjust the new calipers i.e. forced the old pistons back to remove the calipers, then not wound the pistons in on the new calipers?

You can't force the rear calipers back on a MKI MX-5, they have to be wound back

Chances are if the pedal is spongey he didn't get all the air out when he changed them.

[anonymous-user]

Legend83 said:

I will read up on bleeding the brakes tonight and see if I can do it myself - I assume it is a relatively easy for the novice DIYer?

I've not bled the brakes on my Mazda but on my kit car I just started with the brake furthest from the master cylinder - take the cap off the reservoir, get an assistant to sit in the car and press and hold the brake, open the bleed nipple and let some fluid+air out, close the nipple, release the pedal and repeat until no air bubbles are visible, then move to the next closest brake. Check the reservoir level frequently and top it up with fresh fluid to prevent it dropping too far.

I completely changed all the brake fluid in this way - just kept going and topping up the reservoir until each wheel had received brand new fluid and all the old stuff had been pumped out.

It helps to have a small length of clear plastic tube that fits tight onto the bleed nipple and a jar to catch the fluid in - firstly it makes a lot less mess and secondly it makes it much easier to see air bubbles in the fluid when it's inside a clear tube.

Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 28th November 12:56

[HRG]

Eazi Bleed from Gunsons

[MX-5 Lazza]

I tried an Eezi-Bleed but it doesn't come with the right filler-cap cover for MX-5s (I think you can order it) so I did it the old fashioned way as JimSuperSix described instead.

Just make sure you don't get any brake fluid on your bodywork - it'll eat through the paint and into the metal if it's not cleaned off straight away!!!

[Evil Edna]

You don't even need an assistant, you can do the job single-handedly (so to speak).

The secret is to crack the bleed nipple open just enough to be able to push fluid out with the brake pedal but, not enough for atmospheric pressure to push air back in.

Like the others said, use a piece of correctly sized tubing on the nipple and remember to keep topping up the reservoir.

I have done this many times on various of my previous my cars. Also bled the MX-5's brakes, a few months back, using this technique. Pedal is still rock hard and very responsive.

Oh, yeah, nearly forgot...have lots of water standing by in case of spillage onto paintwork.

[anonymous-user]

MX-5 Lazza said:

I tried an Eezi-Bleed but it doesn't come with the right filler-cap cover for MX-5s

I do have an Eezi-Bleed but I hate it - first time I bled the brakes on my kit-car I used a spare tyre to pressurize it as the instructions show, but just as I was undoing one of the bleed nipples the Eezi-Bleed plastic cap exploded off the reservoir spraying the entire contents plus the extra in the Eezi-Bleed all over the nice new powder-coated chassis.

The air in the garage turned blue for quite a while.

Since then it has been in the sin-bin on the top shelf.

[Munter]

Anybody tried these?

http://www.performance5.com/brake_bleeders.asp

[MX-5 Lazza]

I know a few people that use them and are very happy with them. They are on my wanted list and will be fitted next time I bleed the brakes

[skinny]

Legend83 said:

JimSuperSix said:

I've got those Kevlar pads on mine and they bite really well, much better feel than the standard Mazda pads.

There is no reason for them not to be half decent. I am talking a good 3-4 inches of travel before I get any feel (lets not forget the pads certainly bit hard when I slammed them on before ploughing into the back of a Peugeot!).

I will read up on bleeding the brakes tonight and see if I can do it myself - I assume it is a relatively easy for the novice DIYer?

this is a problem i had with the EBC kevlars. they are very difficult to modulate and either give nothing or lock your wheels. to be honest i hated them (they melted at bedford autodrome, 5mm came off in about 2hours of track driving and went right down to the backing plate. and i've heard a lot of varying reports about EBC brakes, some coming detached from the backing, cumbling etc. imo the kevlars are far worse than a decent aftermarket pad like the mintec M1144 or axxiss ultimate (i've not tried geniune mazda pads but i've heard for road use they are fantastic). green stuff or redstuff might be a bit better but i think EBC suffer badly in consistency of quality control.