The £5k mk1, what to expect?

[kuro]

A very low mileage, solid and original s-ltd turned up on ebay last week and after numerous exchanges with the seller I had an offer accepted.

The only issue is that it's a 5 hour train journey for me to see it in the flesh. I've gleaned as much information as possible from him regarding paint condition and he sent me photos of a few superficial scratches which he assures me are the only issues and has described it as being in A1 condition. I'm not that concerned about these but beyond these what else is classed as acceptable on a 24 year eunos at the top end of the price scale?

[kuro]

A few photos


Drivers seat

Edited by kuro on Sunday 14th May 19:36

[NiceCupOfTea]

Go over the sills/arches/front subframe/boot floor with a fine tooth comb for rust.

I would be worried about things going pop as soon as you start driving it regularly...

[kuro]

This guy knows what he is selling. I have no concern over the cills etc. The car is one owner since import, on 55k miles, service history from a specialist. It has never failed an mot and has no advisories for the last 5 years. It was owed by someone who did about 1000 miles per year and it was always garaged.

[kuro]

A couple of photos of the whole car. It does look like a very good one but his phone camera is not great. It had an advisory seatbelt anchorage years ago but thats not been mentioned since. When I quizzed the seller he said it had something to do with a jacking point and not the cill.


One of the underside

Edited by kuro on Sunday 14th May 19:35

[Sad Weevil]

kuro said:

It had an advisory seatbelt anchorage years ago but thats not been mentioned since. When I quizzed the seller he said it had something to do with a jacking point and not the cill.

Thing is, the sill is the jacking point. That advisory nearly always points to rusted out sills, and if it's not shown up on the MOT record for a bit, it must have been repaired. You need to know how good those repairs were, especially as £5k is top dollar for a mk1. On the mk1, there is a rubber bung inside the front part of the wheel arch which can be removed and a scope stuck in, or the plastics on the seat belt tower can be removed and the inside of the sill looked at with a torch and mirror. For £5k, I'd insist on doing this inspection.

[fatjon]

Seat belt anchorage and a jacking point. They both scream rot at me which would render what was at most a 3k car to a 2k car at most.

[AndrewEH1]

You can get a freshly imported one for around the same price:

http://www.goodwoodsportscars.co.uk/gallery_674695...

[NiceCupOfTea]

Agreed: I am well out of the MX-5 scene, I sold my ratty Mk.1 Eunos 5 years ago, and I understand values of decent Mk.1s have risen with rarity but surely at this price you would want a totally original minty mint example, not one that shows evidence of sill rot, repaired or not?

For the rust to have got close enough to a seat belt mount point it must have been pretty bad, mine had rotten sills when I sold it and never got an advisory on it.

[snotrag]

fatjon said:

Seat belt anchorage and a jacking point. They both scream rot at me which would render what was at most a 3k car to a 2k car at most.

Yep.

Thats got rust in it somewhere. It needs thorough inspection on a ramp - I can picture in my head exactly the area that it will be too.

White spray grease all over all the various bolts and fittings, and the underside does not look that tidy to me - I think %k is very optimistic based on those photos.

[kuro]

Sad Weevil said:

Thing is, the sill is the jacking point. That advisory nearly always points to rusted out sills, and if it's not shown up on the MOT record for a bit, it must have been repaired. You need to know how good those repairs were, especially as £5k is top dollar for a mk1. On the mk1, there is a rubber bung inside the front part of the wheel arch which can be removed and a scope stuck in, or the plastics on the seat belt tower can be removed and the inside of the sill looked at with a torch and mirror. For £5k, I'd insist on doing this inspection.

This is the advisory in 2009, "Offside Rear Seat belt anchorage prescribed area is corroded but not considered excessive (5.2.6)", What exactly is this?

I've just sent him a text to clarify as he reckons it had nothing to do with the cill. If there is any rust or sign of bad repair I'm out!

For £5k I would expect no rust or, if there has been, then a repair to MX5 Restorer standard.

[snotrag]

At the rear of the car, there is a 'void' that is inboard of the rear outer sill area - its where the plastic funnel for the roof drain pops out for those familiar with it. The bottom of this section meets the outer sill and the inner wheel arch. Common area for rot, not visible from above or outside the car - you need it jacked up and get your head on the centre line and look out.

This is also the are where the seat belt lower mountings are - hence the advisory. I bet its paper thin.

[kuro]

snotrag said:

At the rear of the car, there is a 'void' that is inboard of the rear outer sill area - its where the plastic funnel for the roof drain pops out for those familiar with it. The bottom of this section meets the outer sill and the inner wheel arch. Common area for rot, not visible from above or outside the car - you need it jacked up and get your head on the centre line and look out.

This is also the are where the seat belt lower mountings are - hence the advisory. I bet its paper thin.

Hmm, This isn’t looking to good. He hasn’t come back yet but from what is being said here I think I’m walking away from this.

It wouldn’t matter if I was just down the road but a 5 hour train journey to find out is just not worth the risk

[kuro]

He came back to me and has said it was surface rust on the chassis rail where the car can be jacked up. He's having it mot'd tomorrow and will send pictures of the underside.

The car has been looked after all its uk life by a specialist, he happens to run said specialsts. I'm not going to mention who it is at this stage but he has a pretty good reputation in the mx5 community

What I don't understand is, I have told him I don't want to proceed but he still seems very keen to sell the car to me. I'm sure if he re-listed it there would be another buyer who would snap it up without giving him the third degree.

[Flip Martian]

kuro said:

He came back to me and has said it was surface rust on the chassis rail where the car can be jacked up. He's having it mot'd tomorrow and will send pictures of the underside.

The car has been looked after all its uk life by a specialist, he happens to run said specialsts. I'm not going to mention who it is at this stage but he has a pretty good reputation in the mx5 community

What I don't understand is, I have told him I don't want to proceed but he still seems very keen to sell the car to me. I'm sure if he re-listed it there would be another buyer who would snap it up without giving him the third degree.

Your last paragraph would certainly make me suspicious. As said elsewhere, 5k really is top dollar and it should be mint for that. This month's Classic Cars mag has a buyer's guide article about the Mk 1 - probably has nothing you can't find on the web but might be worth a read

[kuro]

Flip Martian said:

kuro said:

He came back to me and has said it was surface rust on the chassis rail where the car can be jacked up. He's having it mot'd tomorrow and will send pictures of the underside.

The car has been looked after all its uk life by a specialist, he happens to run said specialsts. I'm not going to mention who it is at this stage but he has a pretty good reputation in the mx5 community

What I don't understand is, I have told him I don't want to proceed but he still seems very keen to sell the car to me. I'm sure if he re-listed it there would be another buyer who would snap it up without giving him the third degree.

Your last paragraph would certainly make me suspicious. As said elsewhere, 5k really is top dollar and it should be mint for that. This month's Classic Cars mag has a buyer's guide article about the Mk 1 - probably has nothing you can't find on the web but might be worth a read

He still won't let go even though the sale was cancelled. Since had loads of photos and to be honest it looks like a good one but not mint so not worth £5k.

[Flip Martian]

kuro said:

He still won't let go even though the sale was cancelled. Since had loads of photos and to be honest it looks like a good one but not mint so not worth £5k.

Probably had little other interest in it then. Which again says something. For 5k it needs to be almost factory fresh really. Is he movable on price?

[bmv6197]

Sold one for 5k a year or so ago - it was a VR Limited which tend to command a reasonable premium as a very popular JDM special edition. It was immaculate, and I say that as someone who is pretty fussy about car condition. Less than 100k (kms) and absolutely original. Everything you've described about the one you looked at makes the voices in my head scream "walk away - you can do far better"... just my two pennies' worth. Good luck with the hunt!

[PartOfTheProblem]

Those rear arches are not original, you can't see the spot welds, and it tapers down too thin on the inner arch. Having been repaired properly is not a problem, but I'd suggest £3k at most if theres good evidence its been done well.

Garath (theMX5restorer) has a great video on how to check these things

https://youtu.be/zYmOogg5qIs

[kuro]

Well I ended up not buying the car. The seller did supply me with a lot of evidence it had not been welded and forwarded me a text exchange between him and the original owner. I don't think it was quite worth 5k but certainly around 4.5k. He's since put a new roof on it and had the paint defects sorted with a new mot and service.

It's back on ebay if anyone is interested. He's a decent bloke and I reckon he would come down on price.