turbo, supercharged, tuning, please sensible advice
Discussion
Hi all
Advice needed, I have mx5 2.0 2007 and looking to get some tuning work. I've had the car remapped by skuzzel motorsport, (great guy nows his stuff) free flowing exhaust from the main cat back, with a k&n filter, dyno reads 184hp but the main thing car drives aand feels great. Looking to get some more work done, looked in to turbo and supercharging, remember mine is the mk3 engine not the 3.5 engine, different people are saying weak bottom ends, so jumping from 180hp to 250/260 hp will blow the bottom end, look at the trouble mx5 parts had with there mk3. So instead looking at heads, cams, throttle bodies, and racing beat manifold, with remapping, or perhaps last option, 2.5l engine swap
What I'm asking has anyone out the had any of these mods or parts of these mods, what they really had gained in the real world in terms of hp, or any real problems with rereliability, the head and cams would be from ric wood racing, so has anyone had these fitted, the turbo will be from bbr so again reliability, the car is used every day, also track days here and Europe, I also do touring in Europe like the alps and passes in Italy,
I hope this makes sense
At the moment I'm sitting here getting a full gaz suspension fitted and setup by the guy's at bubble and kick racing in Essex,so will let you how all that goes later
Russell
Advice needed, I have mx5 2.0 2007 and looking to get some tuning work. I've had the car remapped by skuzzel motorsport, (great guy nows his stuff) free flowing exhaust from the main cat back, with a k&n filter, dyno reads 184hp but the main thing car drives aand feels great. Looking to get some more work done, looked in to turbo and supercharging, remember mine is the mk3 engine not the 3.5 engine, different people are saying weak bottom ends, so jumping from 180hp to 250/260 hp will blow the bottom end, look at the trouble mx5 parts had with there mk3. So instead looking at heads, cams, throttle bodies, and racing beat manifold, with remapping, or perhaps last option, 2.5l engine swap
What I'm asking has anyone out the had any of these mods or parts of these mods, what they really had gained in the real world in terms of hp, or any real problems with rereliability, the head and cams would be from ric wood racing, so has anyone had these fitted, the turbo will be from bbr so again reliability, the car is used every day, also track days here and Europe, I also do touring in Europe like the alps and passes in Italy,
I hope this makes sense
At the moment I'm sitting here getting a full gaz suspension fitted and setup by the guy's at bubble and kick racing in Essex,so will let you how all that goes later
Russell
I thought the problems with the original supercharger on the Mk3 engine were caused by the tuning/ignition mapping rather than any inherent weakness in the Mk3 engine and that they fixed all those problems. Yes I know the Mk3.5 engine has introduced a forged crank but I don't think that has anything to do with it, they wouldn't do that to help the aftermarket supercharger/turbo suppliers.
Thanks for the reply lazza
I don't think they changed the engine internal for the aftermarket tuning, but another of mx5 tuners have turned round and said that alot of engines of the mk3 have a bottom end weakness, so it would be interesting to find out if there Many mk3s out there with big power hikes to see if they have had any issues
Russell
I don't think they changed the engine internal for the aftermarket tuning, but another of mx5 tuners have turned round and said that alot of engines of the mk3 have a bottom end weakness, so it would be interesting to find out if there Many mk3s out there with big power hikes to see if they have had any issues
Russell
Hi Russ
As per our phone conversation, we have had issues with BBR turbo kits where BBR would not replace warped manifolds
After being used on track, even though every evo pic you see of a Bbr car is 'on track'
My advise is to go for a 2.5 engine conversion......
You won't regret it!!
My demo is available anytime for you to try.
Paul
As per our phone conversation, we have had issues with BBR turbo kits where BBR would not replace warped manifolds
After being used on track, even though every evo pic you see of a Bbr car is 'on track'
My advise is to go for a 2.5 engine conversion......
You won't regret it!!
My demo is available anytime for you to try.
Paul
Paul was dabbling with mk3's while the rest were playing with mk1's.
Was originally going to buy his mk1 turbo till I had a drive of his mk3 race car
That was six years & 40 track days ago.
I bought my latest car from him with many track modifications knowing his warranty is valid for trackdays
Was originally going to buy his mk1 turbo till I had a drive of his mk3 race car
That was six years & 40 track days ago.
I bought my latest car from him with many track modifications knowing his warranty is valid for trackdays
Just to add some balance to this thread - 'Roddo' is Roddisons Motor Sport, a Sheffield based MX5 aftermarket sports tuner. They sell the 2.5 modded engine so clearly have an agenda promoting it on forums like this - so far so good.
What isn't so good, however, is the somewhat sinister way that Roddisons and various 'chums' have tried to systematically discredit BBR's turbo for the MX5 mk3/3.5 - this slick social media program appears on most UK and US forums where people are discussing the turbo.
BBR on the other hand tends to stay out of the fray (probably to its credit but also disadvantage)
The reason for this ongoing campaign against BBR seems to hinge on two things:
- Roddison claiming the use of the BBR turbo it has fitted to customers' cars has shown problems with the exhaust manifold warping under extreme heat on track use
- BBR saying Roddisons does not install kit in a professional way and it's customers have complained about this
(I suspect there is also a lot of jealously in the MX5 tuning world that BBR has enjoyed so much success in the media with its turbo products)
There may be legitimate debate about whether BBR managed its guidance on using the turbo on track properly, and whether existing customers should be offered a free cast manifold upgrade. However, the reality is that the BBR Turbo kit is fantastic for road use and only a few minor cases of manifold failure have come up around track day use. There is also a huge row now between the two tuners about this that does neither of them credit.
I just wanted it post this to try and put some balance on the debate as I personally find the orchestrated smear campaign against BBR by Roddisons not only makes them look unprofessional and unethical, it also damages BBR and MORE IMPORTANTLY does not present a balanced debate on MX 5 3/3.5 tuning options out there.
Having said that Roddisons tuning solutions and engine upgrades are a great option, but, by the same token so are those from BBR.
Hope this puts some context for PHers looking at this thread for guidance on what to consider.
What isn't so good, however, is the somewhat sinister way that Roddisons and various 'chums' have tried to systematically discredit BBR's turbo for the MX5 mk3/3.5 - this slick social media program appears on most UK and US forums where people are discussing the turbo.
BBR on the other hand tends to stay out of the fray (probably to its credit but also disadvantage)
The reason for this ongoing campaign against BBR seems to hinge on two things:
- Roddison claiming the use of the BBR turbo it has fitted to customers' cars has shown problems with the exhaust manifold warping under extreme heat on track use
- BBR saying Roddisons does not install kit in a professional way and it's customers have complained about this
(I suspect there is also a lot of jealously in the MX5 tuning world that BBR has enjoyed so much success in the media with its turbo products)
There may be legitimate debate about whether BBR managed its guidance on using the turbo on track properly, and whether existing customers should be offered a free cast manifold upgrade. However, the reality is that the BBR Turbo kit is fantastic for road use and only a few minor cases of manifold failure have come up around track day use. There is also a huge row now between the two tuners about this that does neither of them credit.
I just wanted it post this to try and put some balance on the debate as I personally find the orchestrated smear campaign against BBR by Roddisons not only makes them look unprofessional and unethical, it also damages BBR and MORE IMPORTANTLY does not present a balanced debate on MX 5 3/3.5 tuning options out there.
Having said that Roddisons tuning solutions and engine upgrades are a great option, but, by the same token so are those from BBR.
Hope this puts some context for PHers looking at this thread for guidance on what to consider.
Edited by Blue One on Saturday 2nd May 13:48
BBR aren't completely innocent either on the media front. Does anyone remember seeing their post on facebook page where they had a customer's car in and changed the Meister R coilovers with their own springs and some other dampers?
They claimed that the Meisters were 'cheap Chinese coilovers'. They ended up having to edit the post as everyone was slating them, saying they wouldn't use them again etc.
They claimed that the Meisters were 'cheap Chinese coilovers'. They ended up having to edit the post as everyone was slating them, saying they wouldn't use them again etc.
Hi guy's this is great for a debate, but it doesn't answer my initial thoughts or worries, if I'm looking to spend more than £6000. On a turbo or supercharger is the mk3 upto the nearly 80hp more with out letting go. There must be people out there who have known of others who run these turbos, if so are they reliable with the engine or any other tuning like I asked heads,cams,throttle bodies.
Many thanks
Russell
Many thanks
Russell
NitrousRuss said:
Hi guy's this is great for a debate, but it doesn't answer my initial thoughts or worries, if I'm looking to spend more than £6000. On a turbo or supercharger is the mk3 upto the nearly 80hp more with out letting go. There must be people out there who have known of others who run these turbos, if so are they reliable with the engine or any other tuning like I asked heads,cams,throttle bodies.
Many thanks
Russell
For a mk3/3.5 and with a GBP6k budget I think a BBR turbo stage one conversion (300bhp) is a no-brainier as I have first hand experience of this. However, if you are a regular 'track dayer' you may want to tread more cautiously but hopefully BBRs new cast iron exhaust manifold addresses any issues that existed. Others may agree or disagree with this view....Many thanks
Russell
Blue One said:
NitrousRuss said:
Hi guy's this is great for a debate, but it doesn't answer my initial thoughts or worries, if I'm looking to spend more than £6000. On a turbo or supercharger is the mk3 upto the nearly 80hp more with out letting go. There must be people out there who have known of others who run these turbos, if so are they reliable with the engine or any other tuning like I asked heads,cams,throttle bodies.
Many thanks
Russell
For a mk3/3.5 and with a GBP6k budget I think a BBR turbo stage one conversion (300bhp) is a no-brainier as I have first hand experience of this. However, if you are a regular 'track dayer' you may want to tread more cautiously but hopefully BBRs new cast iron exhaust manifold addresses any issues that existed. Others may agree or disagree with this view....Many thanks
Russell
Isn't this engine in Ford flavour the same engine Caterham supercharge up to 300+bhp in their 620? It seems really robust, so 260 should be a doddle.
BBR no longer do the supercharger, if it is still on their site then they need to remove the pages. Interestingly this also had issues at the start as Cosworth did good hardware but the software needed a lot of fine tuning.
It's hard for smaller tuners to so as much stress testing as the major manufacturers of course, and even they can go wrong, Porsche 991 GT3 engine for instance !
It's been going at least a year now the turbo BBR and they seem to have got on top of the one weak spot, so should be a confident buy.
This is great getting some good feedback back on turbo kits and it seems the manifolds have seemed to be sorted, and yes there are lots of different car running this base engine with more power, but have the intinternals been upgraded, do the last two who have commented know of any mk3 running turbos or is it only mk3.5 running turbo's
Russ,
you could also give Blink Motorsport a call - They will give you a very balanced view on tuning the MX5 NC and also have a very exciting performance upgrade for the NC in the 'pipeline'.
They have dynoed some of BBR products (camshafts & re-maps) and found they produce exactly what it says on the tin!
you could also give Blink Motorsport a call - They will give you a very balanced view on tuning the MX5 NC and also have a very exciting performance upgrade for the NC in the 'pipeline'.
They have dynoed some of BBR products (camshafts & re-maps) and found they produce exactly what it says on the tin!
Hi nikpro
Rang blink motorsport they are under the same thought mk3 might not be up it (turbo) it would be better to go for a mk3.5 engine, cams would be OK and another remap with a racing beat manifold. Apparently the mk3 engines don't like to be revd and that's there weak point, even the bbr cam and manifold will only make 200hp at high revs
So it seems there is not much option out there apart from 2.5 conversion with plenty of torque but no high reving unless you start charging cams or a good 3.5 engine then a turbo, they are looking at there turbo own turbo conversion with adjustable boost which sounds great. So if anyone out there know of a really good mk3.5 engine at a good price please get in touch
Russell
Rang blink motorsport they are under the same thought mk3 might not be up it (turbo) it would be better to go for a mk3.5 engine, cams would be OK and another remap with a racing beat manifold. Apparently the mk3 engines don't like to be revd and that's there weak point, even the bbr cam and manifold will only make 200hp at high revs
So it seems there is not much option out there apart from 2.5 conversion with plenty of torque but no high reving unless you start charging cams or a good 3.5 engine then a turbo, they are looking at there turbo own turbo conversion with adjustable boost which sounds great. So if anyone out there know of a really good mk3.5 engine at a good price please get in touch
Russell
nikpro said:
Russ,
you could also give Blink Motorsport a call - They will give you a very balanced view on tuning the MX5 NC and also have a very exciting performance upgrade for the NC in the 'pipeline'.
They have dynoed some of BBR products (camshafts & re-maps) and found they produce exactly what it says on the tin!
Are you not Blink anyway??? you could also give Blink Motorsport a call - They will give you a very balanced view on tuning the MX5 NC and also have a very exciting performance upgrade for the NC in the 'pipeline'.
They have dynoed some of BBR products (camshafts & re-maps) and found they produce exactly what it says on the tin!
g40steve said:
Are you not Blink anyway???
Steve - I am a director at BLiNK Motorsport but whenever I explain products on Pistonheads the posts are removed as someone complains to the Moderators; unlike other posters on this forum who seem to be able to promote their products freely?? - hence the request to make a phone call to the original OP.Russ,
I beleive you spoke to Richard and I hope you found his advice useful & balanced - I did speak to Richard about the conversation and we have had a couple of ideas that may assist if you wish to drop us an email.
HTH clears matters up.
Blue One said:
What isn't so good, however, is the somewhat sinister way that Roddisons and various 'chums' have tried to systematically discredit BBR's turbo for the MX5 mk3/3.5 - this slick social media program appears on most UK and US forums where people are discussing the turbo.
Absolute rubbish. You are welcome to your opinion, but when such a disingenuous posts deserves derision.To try and bring this back on topic again - I have a 2007 NC roadster and looked into the supercharger / turbo upgrade as they were going through some notable failures circa 2008/9 and I was advised by an number of aftermarket suppliers that certain engine components were strengthened and are in models from 2010 onwards. There have been less failures since these engine changes where made and super or turbo chargers have been fitted is my understanding ?
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