Z4MC DMS Remap

[Rich_Alpina]

Currently thinking of remapping the MC and came across these guys.

Has anyone on here used them, and if so, what were the results especially for the s54 engine.

Looking at their website, they claim to extract 29hp from the s54 engine - quite alot for just a remap!!

Edited by Rich_Alpina on Sunday 6th April 15:31

[zmrjason]

I used the guys at www.evolveyourcar.com and couldn't recommend them high enough.
Very knowledgeable and reliable and all done properly on a dyno if you visit them in Luton. Well worth a call!
Its a mod that really sharpens the car nicely particularily when done with a intake i.e. Simota or Gruppe M.
Good luck!
Jason

[Gids]

I believe sixspeed has had his remapped, and I seem to remember he was disappointed with the results.

[GTWayne]

I had my car remapped by Ray West from West Tuning in Thruxton and was pleased with the results; 331bhp before / 352bhp after.

[M5Pilot]

I would love to se the said tuners graphs for pre and post remap on your car.

Sixspeed was indeed dissapointed with the results.

I have yet to see a genuine gain from this engine fitted what that ECU.

I also know the DMS remap made absolutely no increase in power on the same independant rolling road. Exactly the same power with exactly the same graphs, no change anywhere.

Getting power via ECU remap on a Z4M is particularly hard. This is not because the power is not to be had but more to do with the ECU.

If anyone is feeling a difference is more to do with the changes made to the throttle maps which increases response times.

There is only 1 graph I have seen that shows a significant and impossible gain from this engine.

The same remap was applied to sixspeeds ECU and it made nowhere near that sort of increase.

I'd say buy a GruppeM induction kit instead until more genuine work has been done on the Z4M ECU. Atleast we know you'll get a genuine 6-7 bhp and a fantastic noise.

In addition to this, I have yet to see a genuine proper test of any S54 engine giving anywhere near +30bhp. The most I have seen from a remap is around 15bhp. +30bhp is just pure BS.

Edited by M5Pilot on Sunday 6th April 17:51

[GTWayne]

M5Pilot said:

If anyone is feeling a difference is more to do with the changes made to the throttle maps which increases response times.

It is interesting that you should say this as that is EXACTLY how I would describe the feeling in performance terms; Since the re-map the car feels like it has the Sport button depressed ( which as I understand it is also a change in throttle map ) when it doesn't, but is not quite so raged. The rev limit has been raised another 250rpm and the limiter removed to which I can attest
The induction kit is something that I would be willing to try but only if one comes up S/H. Exhaust is something that I will be leaving standard but may go for a pair of 100 cell cats in the future.

[M15ley]

I wouldnt believe any of the 'mappers' exorbitant claims and take everything with a huge pinch of salt. That said reasonable gains have been made with a remap when in conjuction with exhaust mods, particularly 100 cell cats as already mentioned.

[Rich_Alpina]

M5Pilot said:

Getting power via ECU remap on a Z4M is particularly hard. This is not because the power is not to be had but more to do with the ECU.

Edited by M5Pilot on Sunday 6th April 17:51

Thanks for your comments on this.

I've got the gruppe m and love it to bits, just need more power..

Correct me if i'm wrong, but the s54 in the Z4 is exactly the same as that in the m3 which has been around for over 6 years. If tuner's haven't managed to figure a way round the ecu by now, then i guess they'll never do it.

It can't be that complex can it....

[M5Pilot]

GTWayne said:

M5Pilot said:

If anyone is feeling a difference is more to do with the changes made to the throttle maps which increases response times.

It is interesting that you should say this as that is EXACTLY how I would describe the feeling in performance terms; Since the re-map the car feels like it has the Sport button depressed ( which as I understand it is also a change in throttle map ) when it doesn't, but is not quite so raged. The rev limit has been raised another 250rpm and the limiter removed to which I can attest
The induction kit is something that I would be willing to try but only if one comes up S/H. Exhaust is something that I will be leaving standard but may go for a pair of 100 cell cats in the future.

I find it strange that you pay hundreds if not over a thousand pounds for something that by your own words only feels like a permanent sport button but you will only pay for a 2nd hand GruppeM when it actually gives a genuine gain in BHP. There are quite a few tests around to show this.
The combination of throttle response, noise and power are way better value for money than a remap at only £500.

100 Cell Cats are an absolute and utter waste of time and money. If you are going to get an increase in power it's going to be from the likes of the Supersprint ones (even then I'd be surprised!) and not the stty Milltek items which cause so many E39 M5's to go flat as a fart.

[M5Pilot]

M15ley said:

I wouldnt believe any of the 'mappers' exorbitant claims and take everything with a huge pinch of salt. That said reasonable gains have been made with a remap when in conjuction with exhaust mods, particularly 100 cell cats as already mentioned.

The remapping industry has been plagued with BS unfortunately. Claims of 30 bhp on M3's and 50 bhp on M5's just to win business without any dyno graphs whatsoever nor time trials.

I don't blame anyone but the companies that over estimate for the lack of trust.

[M5Pilot]

Rich_Alpina said:

M5Pilot said:

Getting power via ECU remap on a Z4M is particularly hard. This is not because the power is not to be had but more to do with the ECU.

Edited by M5Pilot on Sunday 6th April 17:51

Thanks for your comments on this.

I've got the gruppe m and love it to bits, just need more power..

Correct me if i'm wrong, but the s54 in the Z4 is exactly the same as that in the m3 which has been around for over 6 years. If tuner's haven't managed to figure a way round the ecu by now, then i guess they'll never do it.

It can't be that complex can it....

The S54 is indeed the same engine as in the M3 and Z3M but the ECU is totally different.

On the E46 M3 & Z3M gains of around 15bhp are the most anyone has ever seen on a dyno unless Charlie @ Surrey Rolling Road can confirm otherwise. I'm talking about real tests and not the ones designed for sales and marketing.

On the Z4M this amount of extra power is available but no one seems to have achieved it with the stock ECU.

I know of some experimentation going on soon which involve's after market ECU's and piggyback systems and I am confident the gains will be quite impressive this way. You won't want to know the price though!

[GTWayne]

M5Pilot said:

I find it strange that you pay hundreds if not over a thousand pounds for something that by your own words only feels like a permanent sport button but you will only pay for a 2nd hand GruppeM when it actually gives a genuine gain in BHP. There are quite a few tests around to show this.
The combination of throttle response, noise and power are way better value for money than a remap at only £500.
100 Cell Cats are an absolute and utter waste of time and money. If you are going to get an increase in power it's going to be from the likes of the Supersprint ones (even then I'd be surprised!) and not the stty Milltek items which cause so many E39 M5's to go flat as a fart.

The reason that I went for the re-map first and foremost is that I know that Ray does good work as he supercharged an e34 540 for me some years ago and I was impressed and I trust the mans word. He has a chassis dyno and I have the graphs to prove the power increase and so feel that I did not have money taken from me under false pretenses ( incidentally, it cost me way less than a bag, so I am happy ).
With regards to the induction, what I meant was that should one come along then I may well indulge but for me, this is not a priority. The suspension is the next thing that I want to alter and as far as the modifications have panned out so far, I am happy

[M5Pilot]

Hi Wayne,

is there any possibility you could post up the graphs or give a link to them?

If indeed there is a 20bhp there then Ray will be getting a whole load more customers.

What suspension you thinking of going for?

[Rich_Alpina]

M5Pilot said:

I know of some experimentation going on soon which involve's after market ECU's and piggyback systems and I am confident the gains will be quite impressive this way. You won't want to know the price though!

Thanks - i guess it's bolt on mods until then.

In my view (consumer), for an after market ecu to work commercially it can't be more than £50-70 per hp ratio. Not sure how much they plan to price this product, if it works that is..

[GTWayne]

M5Pilot said:

Hi Wayne,

is there any possibility you could post up the graphs or give a link to them?

If indeed there is a 20bhp there then Ray will be getting a whole load more customers.

What suspension you thinking of going for?

Watcha Sal,
I will try and get something sorted re. the graphs but don't hold your breath, I would have more luck re-mapping my ZM than getting pictures up on the computer
I will be getting KW 3 fitted using Eibach springs. I am also thinking of fitting modified e46 camber plates and although not really necessary for the road, I may be taking the car to the Ring later this year and if my first choice is not ready by then, I will be forced to treat the ZM to a trip to the Fatherland.

One thing worth mentioning is that as I said before about the Sport button etc., when depressed it is noticeably more urgent but twitchy with it, faster but not all that enjoyable. Ray did say that when I take the car for the KW 3 to be fitted, he will have a look and see if anything can be done to smooth it a little but to be honest, I am happy with it and do not really require any more power ( although having said that, if there is any more to be had, I would not say no! ).

[stesrg]

Hmmm my input here !! S50 Engine re- map nearly £300 power gain just a tad under 8BHP Results lumpy idle, uses more fuel, and rev limeter to 8200

OH and still short of 300bhp at the wheels

so think about it

Ste

[markymark34]

dont treat all mappers claims as the same. you cant say that they all dont work. Remapping a diesel car (i had a 330d and a 120d done) makes a massive difference. As for the M3, its such a highly tuned engine you wont get much out of it in a remap. Surely raising the red line is a bad ideea?

My M3 is the first car i havent bothered to have remapped. Emaps who i trust 100% told me that the car would gain a bit but nothing remotely close to what i got out of the 330d so i didnt get it done.

Mark

[sixspeed]

I thought I'd just add my own 2p since I've been mentioned already... I did find the remap underwhelming, and my recommendation would be to spend the money elsewhere first. There's a lot of other, noticeable improvements you can make to the Z4M which will improve the car no end, for the money.

On the day we performed the remap, we saw 5bhp peak over the "standard" runs. However, my car was running flat at the top end for some reason before we even put the new map on. Could have been fuel, could have been the valves (at my Insp1 the other week, all but 1 cylinder's valves were out and I cleared Park Lane BMW's workshop out of shims!)... who knows. But before the remap I only managed 328bhp, whereas 3 months previous at the same rolling road, with the exact same car (no mods inbetween) it pulled a extremely respectible 343bhp. You could see where the graph flattened out early, whereas on the previous RR day it had carried on pulling.

As such, I am still to go back and make some more tweaks to the map with Evo-S, and to try and get a standard Z4M along (no mods) to do some back-to-back runs against, but I've just not had the time and/or been able to find a willing candidate to come along and get some (free!) dyno runs.

The de-limiting part of the map was definately noticeable though on the way to the 'Ring over Easter. Had a run with a very menacing looking AC Schnitzer ACS5 that appeared in our rear view mirrors... the MC topped a respectible 188mph on the speedo (previously stopped around the 167 mark). No idea what that related to in real terms, but I'd hazard a guess around the 175-180mph mark.

Edited by sixspeed on Tuesday 8th April 18:20

[squeezebm]

M5Pilot said:

M15ley said:

I wouldnt believe any of the 'mappers' exorbitant claims and take everything with a huge pinch of salt. That said reasonable gains have been made with a remap when in conjuction with exhaust mods, particularly 100 cell cats as already mentioned.

The remapping industry has been plagued with BS unfortunately. Claims of 30 bhp on M3's and 50 bhp on M5's just to win business without any dyno graphs whatsoever nor time trials.

I don't blame anyone but the companies that over estimate for the lack of trust.

Sal,funny you should point out that your industry is full of BS,weren't you the guy from e90post that approached me to carry out research on my E92 M,and in return would re-map it for FREE,to then, a day before i was due to come down to Luton you e-mailed/not phoned me to tell me your rolling road had problems and would get back in touch when it was sorted................still waiting,its a small world

[joust]

sixspeed said:

As such, I am still to go back and make some more tweaks to the map with Evo-S, and to try and get a standard Z4M along (no mods) to do some back-to-back runs against, but I've just not had the time and/or been able to find a willing candidate to come along and get some (free!) dyno runs.

I'm away for another week, but if you can fit it around my work I'll happily bring along my boggo standard Z4MR one for you SS.

J