RISK ABOUT E92 M3?

[bher]

I am thinking about buying a 2007 M3 but wonder if it is a good idea as it is the first year of production of the V8.
I have no personnal experience with BMW service. I assume with such a purchase the could take care of me.

Is BMW recognised to use the market as an experimental ground?

Thanks

[MitchT]

bher said:

Is BMW recognised to use the market as an experimental ground?

If the problems with the V10 in the M5 and M6 are anything to go by, then yes.

Also... if I were you I'd wait a year and buy a used one. The price of the E92 M3 is pure comedy and residuals are guaranteed to plummit like a lead turd from the arse of a mountain goat when the 'I want it now at all costs' flock lose interest and move on.

[bher]

MitchT said:

If the problems with the V10 in the M5 and M6 are anything to go by, then yes..

Could you give me more info about those problems?

Thanks

[baz1985]

MitchT said:

bher said:

Is BMW recognised to use the market as an experimental ground?

If the problems with the V10 in the M5 and M6 are anything to go by, then yes.

Also... if I were you I'd wait a year and buy a used one. The price of the E92 M3 is pure comedy and residuals are guaranteed to plummit like a lead turd from the arse of a mountain goat when the 'I want it now at all costs' flock lose interest and move on.

Absolutely 100% agreed.

[RS4john]

MitchT said:

bher said:

Is BMW recognised to use the market as an experimental ground?

If the problems with the V10 in the M5 and M6 are anything to go by, then yes.

Also... if I were you I'd wait a year and buy a used one. The price of the E92 M3 is pure comedy and residuals are guaranteed to plummit like a lead turd from the arse of a mountain goat when the 'I want it now at all costs' flock lose interest and move on.

True words indeeed, agree all the way.

[Dunk76]

MitchT said:

bher said:

Is BMW recognised to use the market as an experimental ground?

If the problems with the V10 in the M5 and M6 are anything to go by, then yes.

....And the vanos in the E36 M3, the E39 M5, the problems with SMG-1, the bottom end of the early E46 M3.

Nah - it'll be fine

[bher]

Thanks for your answers but they remain unclear.

I agree with the price/depreciation point but to get some second hand ones you need people as me
More seriously, I really want to have a new car/toy for the spring and if price is always an issue, the new M3 is in my bracket. I still need to test the 997 2S and the boxster S.
But the M3 has more appeal and 4 real seats. Today it is my first choice (test in december only)
My only real concern is to have to see my dealer every month to fix something electronical or worse, because of the new engine.

[Zod]

baz1985 said:

MitchT said:

bher said:

Is BMW recognised to use the market as an experimental ground?

If the problems with the V10 in the M5 and M6 are anything to go by, then yes.

Also... if I were you I'd wait a year and buy a used one. The price of the E92 M3 is pure comedy and residuals are guaranteed to plummit like a lead turd from the arse of a mountain goat when the 'I want it now at all costs' flock lose interest and move on.

Absolutely 100% agreed.

Utter balls. There was a VANOS pressure tube recall on the first few months' cars. That is the only engine issue there has ever been with these cars.

Some people like to spout about things of which they have no idea.

Edited by Zod on Sunday 11th November 21:44

[RS4john]

bher said:

Thanks for your answers but they remain unclear.

I agree with the price/depreciation point but to get some second hand ones you need people as me
More seriously, I really want to have a new car/toy for the spring and if price is always an issue, the new M3 is in my bracket. I still need to test the 997 2S and the boxster S.
But the M3 has more appeal and 4 real seats. Today it is my first choice (test in december only)
My only real concern is to have to see my dealer every month to fix something electronical or worse, because of the new engine.

Mate if you like the car "Go buy one" I would, sod the depreciation and enjoy it.

[Pugsey]

bher said:

Thanks for your answers but they remain unclear.

I agree with the price/depreciation point but to get some second hand ones you need people as me
More seriously, I really want to have a new car/toy for the spring and if price is always an issue, the new M3 is in my bracket. I still need to test the 997 2S and the boxster S.
But the M3 has more appeal and 4 real seats. Today it is my first choice (test in december only)
My only real concern is to have to see my dealer every month to fix something electronical or worse, because of the new engine.

Don't forget that it's very much the nature of the beast that you'll hear all sorts of horror stories on here - many of which are actually third or fourth hand or hearsay. If people are moved to 'write a letter to the Times' it's usually because they've got a problem rather than to praise someone/something.

I had two very early E46 M3s - Coupe then Cab - and now have a new E92. No probs what so ever, although obviously it's early days for the latest beasty. Having said that I did know someone who had an engine go on an early E46 and BMW merely took the car back and gave him another. I think it highly unlikely that you'd have the kind of problems that meant you were seeing you're dealer every month - these aren't TVRs you know!

Re the other cars you mention - I've had them all and it really depends on what you want from a car. The Boxster is without doubt the sweetest chassis and is of course a pure two seater drop top 'sports car'. The 997S is again a 'sports car' - just about a 2+2 - and is totally unique in it's feel. It's probably a tad slower than the new M3 now but a more 'special' driving experience. Very dated and basic inside nowadays though and to get anywhere near to the spec of a £56k M3 you'll be spending £70k. The M3 is now a pretty luxurious, heavyish saloon which also happens to be very quick and handle beautifully. Unlike the other two though it's really pretty ordinary to drive around in at day to day speeds when, frankly, you might as well be sitting in any top of the range 3 series - you need to drive it fast to feel what you've paid for whereas the other two you don't.

I bought the M3 as I'm lucky enough to have other cars to play with and fancied a change from the X5 as my every day smoker. If I had to choose one of these cars as my only transport I'd go for the Boxster first if space wasn't a consideration followed by the 997S if it was and the M3 last - based on my own experiences and preferences of course.

Oh, and if you want to buy new and are happy to pay the price - go for it and sod 'em! Some of the smug comments on here re depreciation etc smack of downright ingratitude to me. They should be thanking guys like us!

Good luck!

Edited by Pugsey on Monday 12th November 09:33

[bher]

Thanks Pugsey for this kind answer.

I have a Volvo V70 for the 3 kids, sports stuff and bad weather days. Wife has a 7 seater also.
I come from lotus elise 111r Track biased but I am looking for something to use on week end with wife and occasionnaly with kids. The elise is now too harsh for me and I do not use it enough on open road.
I was very interested and looking for porsche but I have to choose for a cabrio (Boxster S, same restriction in use as the lotus) or THE classic sportcar (997) pricey but not enough original for me (looks like every car lover has a porsche nowadays) or a externally more dicreet but impressive (on paper at least)weapon: the bmw M3. I do not plan to track it as my elise (as often as possible with timework) but 2 to 3 days a year probably

Again thanks for reassuring me about reliability. Any more info is usefull.

[bher]

Hi again Pugsey,

Looking at you profile - impressive profile I have to say- you went the aston route. The V8 vantage was on my list initially but I trow it away after reading about it. Could you give me more info about your experience?
thanks

[Pugsey]

bher said:

Hi again Pugsey,

Looking at you profile - impressive profile I have to say- you went the aston route. The V8 vantage was on my list initially but I trow it away after reading about it. Could you give me more info about your experience?
thanks

I had one of the very first - and had all sorts of problems. Early owners were very much 'unpaid developement drivers' for Aston though and I wouldn't have any quams at all about buying one of these fabulous cars now. You're now up at around £90k new though - and no room for the kids of course which is something you mentioned. Don't know if you read the mags - if you do my saga with the V8 appeared in the Longtermers section of EVO.

[Pugsey]

bher said:

Thanks Pugsey for this kind answer.

I have a Volvo V70 for the 3 kids, sports stuff and bad weather days. Wife has a 7 seater also.
I come from lotus elise 111r Track biased but I am looking for something to use on week end with wife and occasionnaly with kids. The elise is now too harsh for me and I do not use it enough on open road.
I was very interested and looking for porsche but I have to choose for a cabrio (Boxster S, same restriction in use as the lotus) or THE classic sportcar (997) pricey but not enough original for me (looks like every car lover has a porsche nowadays) or a externally more dicreet but impressive (on paper at least)weapon: the bmw M3. I do not plan to track it as my elise (as often as possible with timework) but 2 to 3 days a year probably

Again thanks for reassuring me about reliability. Any more info is usefull.

Must admit that given the Volvo and wife's 7 seater I wouldn't consider the M3 in your position. Sadly the Boxster (my first choice) is out because you mention wanting to take the kids. As long as they're still fairly young they'll fit in the 997 - although come to think of it 3 might be a push!! Just don't think the M3 is 'different' enough if it's going to be a fun/weekend car. Having said that you could wait and get the forthcoming Cab? One final thing - even the M3 has just two very seperate seats in the back so 3 children may STILL be a problem!

Who said spending momey was easy.

[bher]

Pugsey said:

bher said:

The V8 vantage was on my list initially but I trow it away after reading about it.

Don't know if you read the mags - if you do my saga with the V8 appeared in the Longtermers section of EVO.

It was already you that I red. I remember very well the picture of the truck in your alley.
My budget is about £70k - €100k and aston would be second hand in that setting but as you mentionned the 2 seats options will mean less use of the car and then not enough use for the money. I know the M3 got only 2 rear seats but I drive quite frequently some kids to sport club, parties, without my wife... so that is not a problem.

The big question is porsche vs m3. The very personnal reason against the porsche is that it is too common I mean unless you got a GT3 or a turbo, it is another guy in a porsche because he doesn't know enough car to pick something else.
I have to admit the porsche ticks a lot of boxes regarding sportness, driveability, design, track options,.... but at least in Belgium it is the first choice for too many people...and this is not a good point for a passionnate guy as me looking for something a little bit original. (reason for the volvo and not the audi, bmw, mercedes 5 doors BTW CQFD)

Edited by bher on Monday 12th November 12:09

[Pugsey]

bher said:

Pugsey said:

bher said:

The V8 vantage was on my list initially but I trow it away after reading about it.

Don't know if you read the mags - if you do my saga with the V8 appeared in the Longtermers section of EVO.

It was already you that I red. I remember very well the picture of the truck in your alley.
My budget is about £70k - €100k and aston would be second hand in that setting but as you mentionned the 2 seats options will mean less use of the car and then not enough use for the money. I know the M3 got only 2 rear seats but I drive quite frequently some kids to sport club, parties, without my wife... so that is not a problem.

The big question is porsche vs m3. The very personnal reason against the porsche is that it is too common I mean unless you got a GT3 or a turbo, it is another guy in a porsche because he doesn't know enough car to pick something else.
I have to admit the porsche ticks a lot of boxes regarding sportness, driveability, design, track options,.... but at least in Belgium it is the first choice for too many people...and this is not a good point for a passionnate guy as me looking for something a little bit original. (reason for the volvo and not the audi, bmw, mercedes 5 doors BTW CQFD)

Edited by bher on Monday 12th November 12:09

In my opinion you shouldn't worry about other peoples perceptions or whether a car is too common. Buy the one you want for the right reasons. I still feel that the M3 will quickly feel to 'normal' for your weekend toy - ie just a very fast saloon car - whereas the 997S will remain 'special' and 'different' from a driving perspective for as long as you own it. It will also handle the occassional track day much better than the M3 too. I've had a new M3 on track now (not mine) and it had eaten it's brakes by the end of the morning and was pretty rough on tyres too. Basically it's too heavy. I think you're going to have to drive both cars before deciding - as I said it's a hard life! Oh and don't forget - if you're not in a rush - there will be a CSL version of the M3 which might be worth waiting for?

[MPowerMark]

because you drive a porsche that isnt something extra special such as a gt3 or gt2 etc u must not have enough knowledge about cars??? because he only drives a standard 997 or a 987 boxster etc..... what a pathetic comment. MUG

[Welshbeef]

Seems to me that the top end sport BM's are not all they are cracked up to be with the pretty poor reliability & the effective forcing you to use main dealers on them....

I mean the old M3 343bhp = 107bhp/ltr with big end problems yet look at the S2000 255bhp = 127.5bhp/ltr and totally linear delivery yet no engine problems.

Jap cars win again it seems - no wonder most power boats are powered by Honda ditto the desirable petrol powered strimmers & lawn mowers they really do know how to make exceptional engines which are durable.

[squeezebm]

Welshbeef said:

Seems to me that the top end sport BM's are not all they are cracked up to be with the pretty poor reliability & the effective forcing you to use main dealers on them....

I mean the old M3 343bhp = 107bhp/ltr with big end problems yet look at the S2000 255bhp = 127.5bhp/ltr and totally linear delivery yet no engine problems.

Jap cars win again it seems - no wonder most power boats are powered by Honda ditto the desirable petrol powered strimmers & lawn mowers they really do know how to make exceptional engines which are durable.

Ummmm another one with no cars in his profile,go jap then my friend and leave the M's to them that like trouble

[taffyracer]

He does have a valid point though, he does make it sound as if BM make shite engines which clearly they do not, most manufacturers have problems, but the Honda units do seem to be bulletproof which given some of their outputs is quite staggering