dilemna: z4m roadster or boxster 987s
Discussion
Hi everyone.
Just sold my 964rs and about to take the plunge on something more modern and useable everyday.
I will buy a left hooker (i am a 'continental' and can' t stand driving rhd' s).
I test drove both of the above and even owned: 986s (with all the toys inc sport exhaust) and z3m roadster (i had two)...
I still cannot make a decision!
I bear in mind driving pleasure but also depreciation.
The 987s with pcm, pasm, 19' classics and 8000km will be 35k from main dealer (germany).
The z4mr with all toys and 1500km will be 30k. I will add csl wheels and probably sideskirts and strutbrace.
I am a bit scared to get tired of the z4mr too quickly. I am not a big fan of the bangle design, but have to admit that having seen pics of the z4mc with csl wheels has reconciled me with it somehow... Driving wise, i thought the engine gear box combo was amazing!
The 987s, i like the design out of the box. Particularly with the 19' classsics. The engine, i know i will feel a bit underpowered, but nowadays and to drive around London + the occasional countryside blast + the odd trackday should be plenty enough.
I have been torturing myself for 2 weeks but cannot come down to a decision. I need to decide, otherwise, the cars i am looking at will go, and i will have nothing...
Any experience similar to mine or someone willing to comment: more than welcome!
Thanks in advance,
Eric.
ps: does anyone have pitures of a z4m roadster (not coupe) with sideskirts and csl wheels??
Just sold my 964rs and about to take the plunge on something more modern and useable everyday.
I will buy a left hooker (i am a 'continental' and can' t stand driving rhd' s).
I test drove both of the above and even owned: 986s (with all the toys inc sport exhaust) and z3m roadster (i had two)...
I still cannot make a decision!
I bear in mind driving pleasure but also depreciation.
The 987s with pcm, pasm, 19' classics and 8000km will be 35k from main dealer (germany).
The z4mr with all toys and 1500km will be 30k. I will add csl wheels and probably sideskirts and strutbrace.
I am a bit scared to get tired of the z4mr too quickly. I am not a big fan of the bangle design, but have to admit that having seen pics of the z4mc with csl wheels has reconciled me with it somehow... Driving wise, i thought the engine gear box combo was amazing!
The 987s, i like the design out of the box. Particularly with the 19' classsics. The engine, i know i will feel a bit underpowered, but nowadays and to drive around London + the occasional countryside blast + the odd trackday should be plenty enough.
I have been torturing myself for 2 weeks but cannot come down to a decision. I need to decide, otherwise, the cars i am looking at will go, and i will have nothing...
Any experience similar to mine or someone willing to comment: more than welcome!
Thanks in advance,
Eric.
ps: does anyone have pitures of a z4m roadster (not coupe) with sideskirts and csl wheels??
Ive not driven the z4m but I have driven a z4m coupe and owned a 987s which i sold a month ago. IMHO the boxster is better in many ways to the coupe (i know you are talking roadster). It deals with our roads better, the handling is fantastic, the gearbox/clutch are better on the boxster, The interior feels better and is certainly less cramped than a z4. The engine on the z4 is on paper quicker but it does not feel a substantially and tbh i preferred the 987s delivery (It builds and gets quicker). I love the look of the coupe and I imagine that it is perhaps a bit more involving to drive but i suspect that it may become a bit tiresome using daily. I used to have an s2000 and it reminded me a bit of that, great car but it became irriatating. A coupe on csls looks fantastic and you are guaranteed to see very few. Ive not seen one on the road yet.
thanks baxster.
Here is the link to the same post on the porsche forum:
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?p=1&f=48&t=374123&h=0
it is strange: i get more praises about the 987 s on the bimmer forum, and vice-versa... usually the opposite!
Here is one of the 'well specced' 987 s i am looking at the mo'. Apparently i can get at least eur 3k of the advertised price. I am quite tempted despite the fact that it does not have Bose or short shifter:
www.porsche-bergischesland.de/de/sale/usedcars/id102352/info.aspx
(they will put a proper 'sport' steering wheel as the current one is horrible).
Here is the link to the same post on the porsche forum:
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?p=1&f=48&t=374123&h=0
it is strange: i get more praises about the 987 s on the bimmer forum, and vice-versa... usually the opposite!
Here is one of the 'well specced' 987 s i am looking at the mo'. Apparently i can get at least eur 3k of the advertised price. I am quite tempted despite the fact that it does not have Bose or short shifter:
www.porsche-bergischesland.de/de/sale/usedcars/id102352/info.aspx
(they will put a proper 'sport' steering wheel as the current one is horrible).
Eric, you may have read my article in EVO last spring when we took the Z4M Roadster over to the 'ring, together with 987S, Alpina Roadster S and TVR Tuscan Convertible. We drove them all for 3 days and then spent the afternoon lapping the 'ring, before driving them back to blighty.
Being a serial Porsche owner, having owned a 986S and previously a 964RS, I preferred the Z4M. Much more the man's car, and feels more akin to the older 964/993 era of Porsches. Richard Meaden who currently owns a 964RS preferred the Z4M (just), although also liked the balance of fluidity of the 987S. Several months after the test I ordered myself a Z4M Coupe, which reminds me greatly of my old 993 C2, very similar (hewn from solid steel) feel to them.
We tried to describe the personality of each car in the article; Richard captured the Boxster very well by describing it as a 'pebble', smooth, perfect and completely innofensive. The Z4M was more edgy, a bit like a diamond in the rough. Both cars behave as the look, and for us we preferred the character and greater driver contribution needed to get the most out of the Z4M. Both were quick, although the Z4M is noticeably quicker in a straight line and much more effortless.
It depends on what you want, but I can certainly confirm that the Z4M is closer in character to your 964RS than the 987S.
Being a serial Porsche owner, having owned a 986S and previously a 964RS, I preferred the Z4M. Much more the man's car, and feels more akin to the older 964/993 era of Porsches. Richard Meaden who currently owns a 964RS preferred the Z4M (just), although also liked the balance of fluidity of the 987S. Several months after the test I ordered myself a Z4M Coupe, which reminds me greatly of my old 993 C2, very similar (hewn from solid steel) feel to them.
We tried to describe the personality of each car in the article; Richard captured the Boxster very well by describing it as a 'pebble', smooth, perfect and completely innofensive. The Z4M was more edgy, a bit like a diamond in the rough. Both cars behave as the look, and for us we preferred the character and greater driver contribution needed to get the most out of the Z4M. Both were quick, although the Z4M is noticeably quicker in a straight line and much more effortless.
It depends on what you want, but I can certainly confirm that the Z4M is closer in character to your 964RS than the 987S.
Steve,
Thanks v much for your comment.
Yes indeed, i read the article at the time and did not know how much it would be important for me down the line...
I re-read it 3 days ago...
I did not realise that you had been involved in it. Although i knew it was your car tested in EVO a few months after.
Would you mind reposting some pictures of your car (for some reason i can' t see them in the other thread anymore)?
I would like to see clearly how the side skirts work.
And.... if someone run a z4mr with 19 csl wheels.... pls post pictures!!
What is the difference between the 19' CS and the 19' CSL wheels?? Would the CS wheels work as well on the z4mr?
Thanks v much for your comment.
Yes indeed, i read the article at the time and did not know how much it would be important for me down the line...
I re-read it 3 days ago...
I did not realise that you had been involved in it. Although i knew it was your car tested in EVO a few months after.
Would you mind reposting some pictures of your car (for some reason i can' t see them in the other thread anymore)?
I would like to see clearly how the side skirts work.
And.... if someone run a z4mr with 19 csl wheels.... pls post pictures!!
What is the difference between the 19' CS and the 19' CSL wheels?? Would the CS wheels work as well on the z4mr?
I have copied some links below from the group test wed did last year (just to see each car in context), plus a few of my present Z4M Coupe. I also ran a test of the Z4M against the Cayman a few months later, so there are a few pics of that too.
As far as CSL wheels, they fit on the Z4M because it shares the same axles as the M3 so either CS or CSL wheels would fit. The main difference is that the CS wheels on the front are narrower 8J compared to 8.5J.
As far as CSL wheels, they fit on the Z4M because it shares the same axles as the M3 so either CS or CSL wheels would fit. The main difference is that the CS wheels on the front are narrower 8J compared to 8.5J.
DoctorD said:
I would go for the CSL wheels which you can pick up from Simpson's motorsport for £1000 a set. Add £800 for a set of PS2s, then £300 for the side skirts and around £200-300 for the strut brace. CS wheels were I believe more expensive as listed by BMW parts.
Am I wrong in thinking that the CS wheels, whilst looking identical to the CSL ones, are actually a bit heavier? Also - I'm a tiny bit nonplussed at the rush to put 19" alloys on such a small car. Would 18"s not suit the car better? A set of 18" BBS alloys for example? I'd ideally like to balance grip with power to an extent where the Z4MC would remain 'playful'. Any thoughts?
I would need to weigh both sets of wheels, but someone a few years ago discovered that the CS rear wheels shared the same part number as the CSLs rear wheels. So I guess the CSL wheels are no more special than the CS ones. Just wider at the front.
As far as 18 vs 19s. The Z4M already comes with 18s, so little need to upgrade, but with 19s and PS2s the chassis is still playful, but 'much' more secure and predicatble than on the 18s with Contis. There really is very little if any penalty for going to the 19s, but I would recommend that tyre size is kept at 235/265 (as standard originally on the CSL) rather than going up a size to 245/275. There really is more than enough grip on the standard size and in my view going any wider would most probably provide too much grip and dull its agility.
As far as 18 vs 19s. The Z4M already comes with 18s, so little need to upgrade, but with 19s and PS2s the chassis is still playful, but 'much' more secure and predicatble than on the 18s with Contis. There really is very little if any penalty for going to the 19s, but I would recommend that tyre size is kept at 235/265 (as standard originally on the CSL) rather than going up a size to 245/275. There really is more than enough grip on the standard size and in my view going any wider would most probably provide too much grip and dull its agility.
Mmmm. Interesting. Anyone got weights on a set of CSL alloys? I'd still err instinctively towards 18"s I think. The 19"s look blinding, mind you. Reason for the 18"s being that my last excusion in a Z4C 3.0 was on 17"s with winter tyres. Fun is too small a word - it was liquid entertainment. I thought I'd wet myself laughing once or twice. Almost every roundabout was an excuse to fog up the drivers side window (car was LHD). I'd hate to create something that just ended up being super grippy and precise when what I want is a proper hooligans toy that keeps me on my toes and has limits low enough that I can have a play at relatively sane speeds. I'll get my Z4MC order in soon and should have a car for the Summer - perhaps there'll be a chance to passenger someone in a CSL alloy equipped car between now and then?
Guys, per my post on the porsche forum, i went out driving a slk55 amg on empty countrysidelanes today.
That thing has got one hell of an engine!!!
I know that the press did not aclaim the car, but i must say that i had a very entertaining moment.
The engine was like a small nuclear plant!!!
I was laughing nervously at each accelerations.
The handling was surprisingly good too: the car was precise and well balanced.
I do not think i would go for it for many reasons (auto gb, not a great trackday proposition, license loosing motor)
But still, i thought i' d mention it in here as the cars we mentioned above are fairly similar.
That thing has got one hell of an engine!!!
I know that the press did not aclaim the car, but i must say that i had a very entertaining moment.
The engine was like a small nuclear plant!!!
I was laughing nervously at each accelerations.
The handling was surprisingly good too: the car was precise and well balanced.
I do not think i would go for it for many reasons (auto gb, not a great trackday proposition, license loosing motor)
But still, i thought i' d mention it in here as the cars we mentioned above are fairly similar.
i actually found pictures of z4 roadsters with 19' csl wheels on following Steve' s links to simpsonmotorsport:
www.simpsonmotorsport.co.uk/default.asp?id=144&pid=70&name=Alpina%20Roadster%20S
and in black:
www.simpsonmotorsport.co.uk/default.asp?id=77&pid=70&name=BMW%20Z4%203.0%20Supercharged&page=Projects
www.simpsonmotorsport.co.uk/default.asp?id=144&pid=70&name=Alpina%20Roadster%20S
and in black:
www.simpsonmotorsport.co.uk/default.asp?id=77&pid=70&name=BMW%20Z4%203.0%20Supercharged&page=Projects
Hi loach et all,
sorry to revive a bit of an old thread, but thought i' d keep you posted... i just bought a car.
I wanted the z4m, but the car i was looking at was sold although the salesman promised me the sale...
So i got myself one of those:
a 986 s limited edition at the week end: the 550 spyder with 266bhp.
gt silver + cocoa inside and hood. Sport chassis.
pcm, manual box, telephone. 10000 miles from porsche zentrum in germany with factory warranty.
Yes i prefer lhd.
It looks new and for less than £25000.
I went to pick it up to germany at the weekend and drove 1000km with an overnight break in Brugge... I am well chuffed!
It was cheaper than 987s and hopefully depreciation will be less harsh. The car feels very 'special' and unique.
i put a pic in my profile (do not know how to do it here otherwise)... I will eventually get a z4m... just waiting for the depreciation to do its wonders first...
sorry to revive a bit of an old thread, but thought i' d keep you posted... i just bought a car.
I wanted the z4m, but the car i was looking at was sold although the salesman promised me the sale...
So i got myself one of those:
a 986 s limited edition at the week end: the 550 spyder with 266bhp.
gt silver + cocoa inside and hood. Sport chassis.
pcm, manual box, telephone. 10000 miles from porsche zentrum in germany with factory warranty.
Yes i prefer lhd.
It looks new and for less than £25000.
I went to pick it up to germany at the weekend and drove 1000km with an overnight break in Brugge... I am well chuffed!
It was cheaper than 987s and hopefully depreciation will be less harsh. The car feels very 'special' and unique.
i put a pic in my profile (do not know how to do it here otherwise)... I will eventually get a z4m... just waiting for the depreciation to do its wonders first...
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