M4 GTS or DTM - Owners on here?
Discussion
VerySideways said:
Don't know if the GTS and DTM have the same suspension or not, but the DTM is unpleasant as a road car. WAY too firm.
I've driven all sorts of fairly exotic stuff and i don't think i've ever driven a more stiffly sprung vehicle.
Rubbish, it’s fully adjustable and is Infact the same the GTS. I've driven all sorts of fairly exotic stuff and i don't think i've ever driven a more stiffly sprung vehicle.
Runs softer springs than after market shocks and runs a ring time about that of a 991.1 GT3, its a brutal car to drive, the Gt2RS in BMW land. Road control is mega. Maybe you drove one with smooth track set up settings.
Edited by Porsche911R on Thursday 23 July 12:18
Porsche911R said:
Rubbish, it’s fully adjustable and is Infact the same the GTS.
Runs softer springs than after market shocks and runs a ring time faster than a 991.1 GT3, its a brutal car to drive, the Gt2RS in BMW land. Road control is mega. Maybe you drove one with smooth track set up settings.
Errr, not rubbish - the fact is that the one i drove was, in my opinion, ridiculously hard and wholly unsuitable for British roads.Runs softer springs than after market shocks and runs a ring time faster than a 991.1 GT3, its a brutal car to drive, the Gt2RS in BMW land. Road control is mega. Maybe you drove one with smooth track set up settings.
But thanks for being so patronising.
Not my car so i had no idea how the suspension was set up, i was offered a chance to drive it and i took it.
Perhaps you're right and it was merely set up poorly.
As i said i didn't know if it was a similar set up or not to the GTS, thanks for clarifying.
VerySideways said:
Porsche911R said:
Rubbish, it’s fully adjustable and is Infact the same the GTS.
Runs softer springs than after market shocks and runs a ring time faster than a 991.1 GT3, its a brutal car to drive, the Gt2RS in BMW land. Road control is mega. Maybe you drove one with smooth track set up settings.
Errr, not rubbish - the fact is that the one i drove was, in my opinion, ridiculously hard and wholly unsuitable for British roads.Runs softer springs than after market shocks and runs a ring time faster than a 991.1 GT3, its a brutal car to drive, the Gt2RS in BMW land. Road control is mega. Maybe you drove one with smooth track set up settings.
But thanks for being so patronising.
Not my car so i had no idea how the suspension was set up, i was offered a chance to drive it and i took it.
Perhaps you're right and it was merely set up poorly.
As i said i didn't know if it was a similar set up or not to the GTS, thanks for clarifying.
the track guys or any after market shock have twice the spring rates, many fit KW after market and they are DOUBLE THE RATES !!!!
So sadly you have either been misinformed or have driven a hard set up, or are not use to a GT style product.
The body control is amazing on these cars, it's a track car/road racer after all so it's not going to feel like a Merc !!
But it handles B roads amazing well.
oem DTM:
Front: 400 lbs/in
Rear: 685 lbs/in
that's pretty low spring rates. THE SAME in the REAR AS A NORMAL M4 !!!
the after maket options which loads of people fit are.
Front: 575 lbs/in front
Rear: 800 lbs/in rear
or even this hard for track.
Front: 628 lbs/in front
Rear: 1,028 lbs/in rear
All the jurno and stories about GTS and DTM are utter b
ks but it seems people just repost the bks time and time again.Edited by Porsche911R on Thursday 23 July 12:28
NBTBRV8 said:
The DTM is identical to the GTS, it is just different livery. They seem to be a marmite car with no consensus on how good/bad they are.
It's a road racer and a handfull, but a lot of fun and blindling fast with 600NM torque via 285 rar tyres ! . haters will hate and follow the misinformation on them.AT the end of the day BMW made a road racer closest to the BMW GT4 race cars over any other manufacture.
they toned down the spring rates to make it work on the ring thus the fast ring times.
With the car you can up the rates for smoother tracks (all supplied in the owners manuals) or dial down the rebound a bit for UK roads.
As I stated after market shocks have MUCH firmer spring rates than the oem GTS/DTM's.
It's a fully adjustable 3 way shock with normal M4 rates, so comments on the internet are a bit daft all told.
I am a serial M Power owner and have run an M4 for a few years now as a daily. Tried a DTM recently and it’s such a different car to the stock M4 as to feel like a different model altogether. Much more stifly sprung and akin to a 991 GT3 in road feel. Overall was very impressed I must say. I tend to think a lot of the road tests at the time were overly harsh and comparing it to a GT3 RS, while the RS will be a better and more desire able machine, looking at where prices have ended up it ain’t twice the car! GTS looks good value potentially in the mid 70s
finmac said:
I am a serial M Power owner and have run an M4 for a few years now as a daily. Tried a DTM recently and it’s such a different car to the stock M4 as to feel like a different model altogether. Much more stifly sprung and akin to a 991 GT3 in road feel. Overall was very impressed I must say. I tend to think a lot of the road tests at the time were overly harsh and comparing it to a GT3 RS, while the RS will be a better and more desire able machine, looking at where prices have ended up it ain’t twice the car! GTS looks good value potentially in the mid 70s
for a £136k car where there are only now 21 left in the UK I think, £85k is a steel and soon the TAX will be low on these as they are low Co2 once 4 years old.you could not build the car for £120k from a donor M4 comp, BMW put every thing at the car, eve nthe wheels are £6k worth forged ones vs the standards even though they look the same.
It's a brutal drive and not a LTD M4 with some stickers.
DTM more usable than the GTS as they removed the larger splitter for a smaller one and added Cannards to the same effect plus a lot newer of course and rarer.
So you can get it in carparks and on your drive ok.
For a race car feel it beats GT3's, GT3 still the better car though I guess but those are still £135k for a nice one vs £85k for a DTM.
finmac said:
Not sure whether BMW extended warranty cost is same for GTS/DTM as M4?
BMW offer 3 levelsthe top one is £763 for the year, the cars cheap to run really, lower service costs than Porkers now even with M TAX !
cars will be 4 years old in 12 months so the TAX is a nice bonus reduction as the co2 is sub 200.
Cannot see these ever droping in value as BMW wont make any thing again like it imo, even the new M4 looks rank any way lol.
BUT will they make a car like this again ? I doubt it.
the M2 CS was 1/2 a job and look at the price of that, the new Alfa is £160k for the same sort of thing. and let not talk about the Jag thing ......
£136k any way was a joke for the BMW DTM, but the parts add up to more than that, so must be a loss leader car.
Matthew7711 said:
Shame there’s nothing special about these cars that justifies the price.
Top car Journalists really had nothing good to say about them compared to similar competition.
They will continue to drop and buffer just above the highest used M4/M3 CS.
Same happened to the CSL, but now I’d have to pay about 997 GT3 and close to 991 GT3 money to get one (with much higher mileage than the Porsches), so there is a case to be made that enthusiast take a while to appreciate the car and then values might well go up and make them unaffordable as a trackday car. I am talking LHD, too many RHD CSLs so values are different.Top car Journalists really had nothing good to say about them compared to similar competition.
They will continue to drop and buffer just above the highest used M4/M3 CS.
Edit: I think the floor is lower than the current asking prices due to the economy / people will limit non-essential spending in the medium term imo, so most/all cars will drop from today’s values - some quite substantially as they were in bubble territory
Edited by MDL111 on Sunday 26th July 08:01
MDL111 said:
Matthew7711 said:
Shame there’s nothing special about these cars that justifies the price.
Top car Journalists really had nothing good to say about them compared to similar competition.
They will continue to drop and buffer just above the highest used M4/M3 CS.
Same happened to the CSL, but now I’d have to pay about 997 GT3 and close to 991 GT3 money to get one (with much higher mileage than the Porsches), so there is a case to be made that enthusiast take a while to appreciate the car and then values might well go up and make them unaffordable as a trackday car. I am talking LHD, too many RHD CSLs so values are different.Top car Journalists really had nothing good to say about them compared to similar competition.
They will continue to drop and buffer just above the highest used M4/M3 CS.
Edit: I think the floor is lower than the current asking prices due to the economy / people will limit non-essential spending in the medium term imo, so most/all cars will drop from today’s values - some quite substantially as they were in bubble territory
Edited by MDL111 on Sunday 26th July 08:01
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