References before Interview

[-crookedtail-]

Would you provide references to an external recruiter before they submit your profile to a potential company?


Seems a tad much to me before that potential company has even looked at my CV. The recruiter says it is due to them being 'burned' in the past but I don't want my references to be bothered unless I'm least expecting an offer. Could you imagine a recruiter doing that each time they sent your details, references would be fuming!


Is this a new thing? I've never come across this before.

Is it just an attempt to get a toe into your contacts?

[essayer]

Never

[dibblecorse]

I'm ex agency and now run an in house recruitment team, its a sharp practice to build their network as references gathered this way have no real value as the candidate just provides people who will be positive.

I bet they just want leaders you have worked for and not peers?

I never did it, and I wouldn't work via an agency that did, say you will make them available once an interview has been secured.

[-crookedtail-]

dibblecorse said:

I'm ex agency and now run an in house recruitment team, its a sharp practice to build their network as references gathered this way have no real value as the candidate just provides people who will be positive.

I bet they just want leaders you have worked for and not peers?

I never did it, and I wouldn't work via an agency that did, say you will make them available once an interview has been secured.

Yeah, it's just my previous bosses.

Thanks for the advice. Confirmed what I thought

[agent006]

dibblecorse said:

make them available once an interview has been secured.

Even that's a bit previous. I've always had references requested after accepting an offer.

OP, call their bluff. That's assuming the job actually exists.

[dibblecorse]

agent006 said:

dibblecorse said:

make them available once an interview has been secured.

Even that's a bit previous. I've always had references requested after accepting an offer.

OP, call their bluff. That's assuming the job actually exists.

Not at all, we will regularly ask at that stage, we know its a bit of a moot point but part of it is actually seeing IF they can indeed provide someone as most liabilities can't as even their network won't want to place themselves at the risk of reputational damage especially as at some point the references could be interested in us.

[snotrag]

Never, not in a million years. If the recruiter doesnt understand that, they are in the wrong business.

[Viperzs]

Nope. I wouldn't want my current employer to know that I was looking elsewhere. That is a conversation for me to have with them when I am ready, not for them to find out from a recruiter.

[spikeyhead]

I've never known a recruiter ask, and any that did would immediately be on my list of companies never to do business with

[InformationSuperHighway]

Agree with the above.

I've been asked this by a recruiter before, i refused and we didn't work together.. pretty simple.

[bucksmanuk]

Standard crappy recruitment agency nonsense
As above these slime balls are everywhere – delete and move on…

[Jasandjules]

That would be a hell no.

[Gargamel]

Tricky one

Previously when I was Agency side we had a temporary worker side, and having two references on file was part of a ISO9000 standard. As we were the employing entity and payrolling the workers, of course it made slightly more sense since in legal effect they were our employees on loan in another business. So fairly standard at the time.

On the permanent side, yes its certainly an attempt to build contacts. Look if you are someone who worked for this person, then they must need people like you in their teams, so call up, do a professional reference then ask them if they ever find it difficult to hire good people .... then off you go full speed. After all you just showed them how professional your company are and how you always do your due diligence.

Whilst I agree its doing it in the wrong order, you can't on the one hand call rec cons idiots and charlatans for trying to ensure the product is of the right quality ...

[Countdown]

Gargamel said:

On the permanent side, yes its certainly an attempt to build contacts. Look if you are someone who worked for this person, then they must need people like you in their teams, so call up, do a professional reference then ask them if they ever find it difficult to hire good people .... then off you go full speed. After all you just showed them how professional your company are and how you always do your due diligence.

The LAST thing any of my bosses would want is to be cold called by Recruitment Agents. It's of no benefit to my boss, it's of no benefit to me, it's purely for the benefit of the RA. (If the RA's primary purpose was to get a reference they could have done it via email).

That's why RA's get called con artists and charlatans.

[captain_cynic]

Countdown said:

Gargamel said:

On the permanent side, yes its certainly an attempt to build contacts. Look if you are someone who worked for this person, then they must need people like you in their teams, so call up, do a professional reference then ask them if they ever find it difficult to hire good people .... then off you go full speed. After all you just showed them how professional your company are and how you always do your due diligence.

The LAST thing any of my bosses would want is to be cold called by Recruitment Agents. It's of no benefit to my boss, it's of no benefit to me, it's purely for the benefit of the RA. (If the RA's primary purpose was to get a reference they could have done it via email).

That's why RA's get called con artists and charlatans.

This, asking for references beforehand is a huge red flag to avoid that job.

The absolute laziness of recruiters and HR never ceases to amaze me. Asking for me to provide a direct contact, call the company and ask for the HR dept you lazy sods.

[Gargamel]

Sheesh what’s with you people, I try to explain that it’s business development for Recruiters and you all start frothing.

From the agents point of view it makes total sense, your old boss was a decision maker on hiring, so of course they want to engage them.

It’s not a crime to try to make a sale !

[captain_cynic]

Gargamel said:

Sheesh what’s with you people, I try to explain that it’s business development for Recruiters and you all start frothing.

From the agents point of view it makes total sense, your old boss was a decision maker on hiring, so of course they want to engage them.

It’s not a crime to try to make a sale !

And it's been explained to you multiple times that none of us want to be "contacts" for recruiters. Employers don't want to be randomly contacted and candidates don't want to be trated as contact farms..

The fact it's thought of as a "sale" shows just how utterly useless recruiters are.

In fact you've stopped just short of admitting that recruitment agencies put out false advertisements for the purposes of contact gathering.

And you're wondering what's wrong with us.

[Pit Pony]

agent006 said:

dibblecorse said:

make them available once an interview has been secured.

Even that's a bit previous. I've always had references requested after accepting an offer.

OP, call their bluff. That's assuming the job actually exists.

Or call thier bluff, and say the classic line from Mary Poppins when Julie Andrews says "I make it a rule not to give references"

[98elise]

Absolute no from me.

I don't want my references bothered unless there is a job offer on the table. I certainly don't want them pissed off at me handing their contact details out so easily.