Small claims court for unpaid wages

[105.4]

I’m a sub contractor for a well known parcel handling company.

I keep a highly detailed spreadsheet of all of the work I’ve done each day. Different size / weight parcels pay different rates, as do parcel collections.

Last month I was missing payment for over 250 parcel collections. The company that I work for are refusing to acknowledge that I collected any of these parcels, therefore they’re refusing to pay me for them, even though I’ve submitted undeniable evidence that I’ve done the work, (data / information that they’ve already got on their systems btw).

The internal appeals process has almost been exhausted.

Have any of you fellas ever gone down the Small Claims route to rectify such issues? If so, how easy / difficult was the process?

I’d rather not go down this route, but my patience of dealing with incompetent, lying, confounded morons has almost depleted.

Thanks in advance

[Largechris]

I've done a lot of small claims over the years. It's a piece of cake. You can do it all online, small initial fee scaled to the value of the claim which gets paid back when you win.

Do it.

[Muzzer79]

105.4 said:

I’m a sub contractor for a well known parcel handling company.

I keep a highly detailed spreadsheet of all of the work I’ve done each day. Different size / weight parcels pay different rates, as do parcel collections.

Last month I was missing payment for over 250 parcel collections. The company that I work for are refusing to acknowledge that I collected any of these parcels, therefore they’re refusing to pay me for them, even though I’ve submitted undeniable evidence that I’ve done the work, (data / information that they’ve already got on their systems btw).

The internal appeals process has almost been exhausted.

Have any of you fellas ever gone down the Small Claims route to rectify such issues? If so, how easy / difficult was the process?

I’d rather not go down this route, but my patience of dealing with incompetent, lying, confounded morons has almost depleted.

Thanks in advance

If you're a sub-contractor for this company, is it a good idea to take them to court?

You may find yourself not being a sub-contractor for much longer.....

I know that you are morally correct but consider how easy it will be to find work elsewhere and what that will mean for you.

[Largechris]

Muzzer79 said:

If you're a sub-contractor for this company, is it a good idea to take them to court?

You may find yourself not being a sub-contractor for much longer.....

I know that you are morally correct but consider how easy it will be to find work elsewhere and what that will mean for you.

But they're not paying him.......

[55palfers]

Largechris said:

Muzzer79 said:

If you're a sub-contractor for this company, is it a good idea to take them to court?

You may find yourself not being a sub-contractor for much longer.....

I know that you are morally correct but consider how easy it will be to find work elsewhere and what that will mean for you.

But they're not paying him.......

....and there's loads of jobs going.

[Muzzer79]

Largechris said:

Muzzer79 said:

If you're a sub-contractor for this company, is it a good idea to take them to court?

You may find yourself not being a sub-contractor for much longer.....

I know that you are morally correct but consider how easy it will be to find work elsewhere and what that will mean for you.

But they're not paying him.......

They are not paying him for some of the work. This sucks and it isn't right.

However, if pursuing it means losing that work and not having easy options to gain more work, the sensible choice can be to swallow a very stty-tasting pill and move on.

If work is free-flowing and there are other as-convenient and well-numerated options, it's worth pursuing.

[Largechris]

Muzzer79 said:

Largechris said:

Muzzer79 said:

If you're a sub-contractor for this company, is it a good idea to take them to court?

You may find yourself not being a sub-contractor for much longer.....

I know that you are morally correct but consider how easy it will be to find work elsewhere and what that will mean for you.

But they're not paying him.......

They are not paying him for some of the work. This sucks and it isn't right.

However, if pursuing it means losing that work and not having easy options to gain more work, the sensible choice can be to swallow a very stty-tasting pill and move on.

If work is free-flowing and there are other as-convenient and well-numerated options, it's worth pursuing.

From the description, there's no dispute that the work was done, it's not a conversation about quality of work etc.

In other words what if next month they don't pay him for any of the work?

No serious business person needs customers like that, the vast majority of successful people would refuse further work with them.

Sue, and it's quite likely a higher up in their legal department will take one look at it and raise hell with their own employees, not the contractor. Which should work out better all round.

[Muzzer79]

Largechris said:

From the description, there's no dispute that the work was done, it's not a conversation about quality of work etc.

Agreed - nobody mentioned quality

Largechris said:

In other words what if next month they don't pay him for any of the work?

That would equally suck and a similar decision would have to be made in terms of reward vs outlay working for this particular company.

Largechris said:

Sue, and it's quite likely a higher up in their legal department will take one look at it and raise hell with their own employees, not the contractor. Which should work out better all round.

You've never worked for a large parcel company have you?

[Largechris]

Muzzer79 said:

You've never worked for a large parcel company have you?

Neither have you.....

[105.4]

Muzzer79 said:

You've never worked for a large parcel company have you?

Disjointed is the kindest way I can find to describe the ‘organisation’.

[Muzzer79]

Largechris said:

Muzzer79 said:

You've never worked for a large parcel company have you?

Neither have you.....

Actually, I have

[105.4]

Muzzer79 said:

They are not paying him for some of the work. This sucks and it isn't right.

However, if pursuing it means losing that work and not having easy options to gain more work, the sensible choice can be to swallow a very stty-tasting pill and move on.

If work is free-flowing and there are other as-convenient and well-numerated options, it's worth pursuing.

Thanks for your reply Muzzer, and I totally get your point.

From a quick straw poll in the depot, only around 20% of drivers cross-check their wages against an estimate of what they should be getting.

Because I’m untrusting / OCD / weird, I keep a fully detailed spreadsheet of all the work I’ve done, at what rates, and on what days. I suspect the firm relay on drivers not checking wages and pay short to earn the company a few extra quid. This is speculation on my part though.

And every month it’s the same pantomime trying to chase missing wages. They’ll give a reason as to why that work hasn’t been paid. I’ll disprove that. They then come up with another excuse, which is also disproved, and the back-and-forth continues before I get bored and leave it.

My KPIs across all metrics put me comfortably in the top 5% in the region, well above any expected targets.

Almost every month I’m paid short by some degree. This last month was the straw that broke the camels back.

So where does one draw the line? One days wages gone unpaid? Two days? One week? Two weeks?

A line has got to be drawn somewhere.

[Muzzer79]

105.4 said:

Muzzer79 said:

They are not paying him for some of the work. This sucks and it isn't right.

However, if pursuing it means losing that work and not having easy options to gain more work, the sensible choice can be to swallow a very stty-tasting pill and move on.

If work is free-flowing and there are other as-convenient and well-numerated options, it's worth pursuing.

Thanks for your reply Muzzer, and I totally get your point.

From a quick straw poll in the depot, only around 20% of drivers cross-check their wages against an estimate of what they should be getting.

Because I’m untrusting / OCD / weird, I keep a fully detailed spreadsheet of all the work I’ve done, at what rates, and on what days. I suspect the firm relay on drivers not checking wages and pay short to earn the company a few extra quid. This is speculation on my part though.

And every month it’s the same pantomime trying to chase missing wages. They’ll give a reason as to why that work hasn’t been paid. I’ll disprove that. They then come up with another excuse, which is also disproved, and the back-and-forth continues before I get bored and leave it.

My KPIs across all metrics put me comfortably in the top 5% in the region, well above any expected targets.

Almost every month I’m paid short by some degree. This last month was the straw that broke the camels back.

So where does one draw the line? One days wages gone unpaid? Two days? One week? Two weeks?

A line has got to be drawn somewhere.

You can draw your line anywhere you choose - one day or one month

The important thing is that, even if you get your money, what is the scenario if they terminate your use as a sub-contractor?

If you are confident enough that you will find work at another parcel company or that you can/will take a different job that's out there - fill your boots. Small claims court, the whole schebang.

However, if you think that changing jobs will be difficult/inconvenient to your home setup/in a not-workable location then consider your next move very carefully.

If you were a PAYE employee of reasonable service, there'd be no dilemma here - you'd just claim. This is because as a PAYE employee you have employment rights.

As a sub-contracted employee, you have virtually no rights, so they can terminate you very easily and quickly. Only you know how much of a problem that would theoretically be.

[StuTheGrouch]

Largechris said:

I've done a lot of small claims over the years.

Why does that not surprise me...

[105.4]

Muzzer79 said:

You can draw your line anywhere you choose - one day or one month

The important thing is that, even if you get your money, what is the scenario if they terminate your use as a sub-contractor?

If you are confident enough that you will find work at another parcel company or that you can/will take a different job that's out there - fill your boots. Small claims court, the whole schebang.

However, if you think that changing jobs will be difficult/inconvenient to your home setup/in a not-workable location then consider your next move very carefully.

If you were a PAYE employee of reasonable service, there'd be no dilemma here - you'd just claim. This is because as a PAYE employee you have employment rights.

As a sub-contracted employee, you have virtually no rights, so they can terminate you very easily and quickly. Only you know how much of a problem that would theoretically be.

Sage and level headed advice Muzzer.

[anonymous-user]

You need to send a letter before action before issuing a small claims. See where that gets you first before doing anything else.

[105.4]

pocketspring said:

You need to send a letter before action before issuing a small claims. See where that gets you first before doing anything else.

Thanks. I’ll look into that, although ideally I’d just like to be paid the correct amount each month, without having to plead, beg, argue and send a dozen emails containing evidence which they’ve already got of work completed.

After a certain point it all starts to get a little demoralising.

[anonymous-user]

105.4 said:

pocketspring said:

You need to send a letter before action before issuing a small claims. See where that gets you first before doing anything else.

Thanks. I’ll look into that, although ideally I’d just like to be paid the correct amount each month, without having to plead, beg, argue and send a dozen emails containing evidence which they’ve already got of work completed.

After a certain point it all starts to get a little demoralising.

I know, I know dude. I had to issue proceedings, twice, against a company I used to work for for lack of expenses. Each time, they paid before it went to court.

[105.4]

pocketspring said:

I know, I know dude. I had to issue proceedings, twice, against a company I used to work for for lack of expenses. Each time, they paid before it went to court.

We’re you an employee or a subby?
Did it cause you any issues?

[pubrunner]

pocketspring said:

You need to send a letter before action before issuing a small claims. See where that gets you first before doing anything else.

This ^^^ should be your starting point.

There's plenty of good advice here :

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/law-and-courts/l...

With a bit of luck, an LBA will elect a response and you'll get the money that you are owed.