Considering a move overseas... who has done it?
Discussion
Hi All,
Getting to the point in our lives where we fancy a change of scenery, specifically outside of the UK.
Our ideal move would be to a warmer climate, ideally English speaking (at least as a business language for me) and somewhere with a comparable quality of life to the UK with regards ease of finding a good place to live, good public transport etc.
Personally, my absolute first choice is America, either California or Florida. However, I'm only too aware as to how difficult this move would be with regards to gaining a Visa. As I understand it, to get to the USA your options are either to successfully apply for a job there and get company sponsorship, or go in via an internal transfer with a company in the UK after doing your time in a role here. I'm not sure that just applying for jobs I see on monster will result in the right amount of success for the former option....
I had some success with a job opportunity in the south of France a few years ago with a leading aeroplane manufacturer, but unfortunately we didn't quite manage to agree location of my employment (I wanted and had applied for Toulouse, they wanted Hamburg after meeting me). This I think lit the fire in me to want to make the move overseas, and we've been casually glancing at overseas opportunities ever since. Finding the right role is just as important as the right country.
So, whats the short version of this thread? I'd love to hear from anyone who has made the jump from the UK to a scenario I've painted out above, even better if its in my line of work (IT Service Management), and even better still if its with a partner who wouldn't be working when we got out there....
Thanks in advance
Getting to the point in our lives where we fancy a change of scenery, specifically outside of the UK.
Our ideal move would be to a warmer climate, ideally English speaking (at least as a business language for me) and somewhere with a comparable quality of life to the UK with regards ease of finding a good place to live, good public transport etc.
Personally, my absolute first choice is America, either California or Florida. However, I'm only too aware as to how difficult this move would be with regards to gaining a Visa. As I understand it, to get to the USA your options are either to successfully apply for a job there and get company sponsorship, or go in via an internal transfer with a company in the UK after doing your time in a role here. I'm not sure that just applying for jobs I see on monster will result in the right amount of success for the former option....
I had some success with a job opportunity in the south of France a few years ago with a leading aeroplane manufacturer, but unfortunately we didn't quite manage to agree location of my employment (I wanted and had applied for Toulouse, they wanted Hamburg after meeting me). This I think lit the fire in me to want to make the move overseas, and we've been casually glancing at overseas opportunities ever since. Finding the right role is just as important as the right country.
So, whats the short version of this thread? I'd love to hear from anyone who has made the jump from the UK to a scenario I've painted out above, even better if its in my line of work (IT Service Management), and even better still if its with a partner who wouldn't be working when we got out there....
Thanks in advance
I moved overseas, although I left the bird behind! I have since become a father, and if you are heading this way you need to think whether you or your missus needs family close by for support. Travelling to visit family and friends is a real pain.
Also, some places have favourable tax/wage levels. You might find that you could not afford to move back home, or you would have to take a big financial hit to do so.
Once you have no address in the UK and stop paying tax in the UK it is nigh impossible to get a UK bank account. You can get bank accounts offshore, e.g. Isle of Man/Jersey, or wherever you are going, but if you need a UK account then keep your existing one open.
At some point after you stop paying tax/NI in the UK, you lose your entitlement to benefits/state pension. This means that if you return to the UK and need hospital treatment/some prescription drugs, you need the cash to pay for them! Even though you may be English..
Are you taking your car? You will likely have to import it in the destination country and get it reregistered which can be a pain.
You might find some expats who made the same move as you, or find a forum to research the pitfalls/benefits.
Someone else might be able to chip in about work permits or visa considerations depending on where you are going
Also, some places have favourable tax/wage levels. You might find that you could not afford to move back home, or you would have to take a big financial hit to do so.
Once you have no address in the UK and stop paying tax in the UK it is nigh impossible to get a UK bank account. You can get bank accounts offshore, e.g. Isle of Man/Jersey, or wherever you are going, but if you need a UK account then keep your existing one open.
At some point after you stop paying tax/NI in the UK, you lose your entitlement to benefits/state pension. This means that if you return to the UK and need hospital treatment/some prescription drugs, you need the cash to pay for them! Even though you may be English..
Are you taking your car? You will likely have to import it in the destination country and get it reregistered which can be a pain.
You might find some expats who made the same move as you, or find a forum to research the pitfalls/benefits.
Someone else might be able to chip in about work permits or visa considerations depending on where you are going
Edited by TurricanII on Tuesday 16th October 00:21
I moved to Sydney 2 years ago with the family, which included a 4 month old baby - it's definitely tough being away from family support with the kids and it's very hard to work out what your wage should be in a new country - unfortunately I didn't find an easy way to work it all out before I arrived, but if you come to Aus I can give you an idea of the ratio of earnings compared to the UK
Lots of us in the various I ternational forums here!!
Not as many countries as some, but I have done Norway, Germany and currently Singapore. Next will probably be Malaysia.
As mentioned above
Make sure that it is something that both you and SWMBO want.
Understand that you will probably not be seeing family much
You will not be going back "home" as often as you may think, and friends / family will not visit as often as they say.
You will make great new friends
Ensure that you understand the true cost of living where you are going (rent, tax, food, transport, entertaining, medical, education etc) and ensure that your earning capabilities match this. Many people just do a forex conversion plus a bit and think they will be fine. They usually are not.
If your partner will not be able to get a working visa (at all / immediately) ensure that there is stuff for them to do, p,aces to socialize, hobbies to do etc.
Loads more but that will get you going.
Not as many countries as some, but I have done Norway, Germany and currently Singapore. Next will probably be Malaysia.
As mentioned above
Make sure that it is something that both you and SWMBO want.
Understand that you will probably not be seeing family much
You will not be going back "home" as often as you may think, and friends / family will not visit as often as they say.
You will make great new friends
Ensure that you understand the true cost of living where you are going (rent, tax, food, transport, entertaining, medical, education etc) and ensure that your earning capabilities match this. Many people just do a forex conversion plus a bit and think they will be fine. They usually are not.
If your partner will not be able to get a working visa (at all / immediately) ensure that there is stuff for them to do, p,aces to socialize, hobbies to do etc.
Loads more but that will get you going.
phumy said:
Understand and align yourself with the local culture, i.e. when in Rome, dont ever think you can fight it or even change it, you cant and you wont.
When in Jakarta, drive like a porn star on extacyhttp://www.asiaone.com/Motoring/News/Story/A1Story...
Lived in Australia, New Zealand, France and now Thailand.
Please do remember that living somewhere and going on holiday there are not the same things at all. What
seems charming, novel or fun on holiday can be a total pain in the arse when you live with it day in day out.
Finding jobs can be hard - many companies are rightly dubious of expats in terms of longevity, so unless you have a specific connection to the place, or a very in demand skill this will probably be your first hurdle. Especially if you are trying to do it remotely.
If time and funds allow, I'd suggest booking a few weeks in your desired locations and testing out the job market. A house swap or short term apartment rental would be ideal. Firstly to go and see if it's possible to get work there, and secondly to try living there, albeit for a very short time, that isn't driving around in a nice rental car after the traffic has died down, and doing fun stuff.
Best option of all, if it's open to you is to try and get transfered with a company who will pay your housing, car, school fees etc and move you on after 2 or 3 years if you want. But these gigs are pretty rare, and companies usually favour long serving staff members for them when they do come up.
Please do remember that living somewhere and going on holiday there are not the same things at all. What
seems charming, novel or fun on holiday can be a total pain in the arse when you live with it day in day out.
Finding jobs can be hard - many companies are rightly dubious of expats in terms of longevity, so unless you have a specific connection to the place, or a very in demand skill this will probably be your first hurdle. Especially if you are trying to do it remotely.
If time and funds allow, I'd suggest booking a few weeks in your desired locations and testing out the job market. A house swap or short term apartment rental would be ideal. Firstly to go and see if it's possible to get work there, and secondly to try living there, albeit for a very short time, that isn't driving around in a nice rental car after the traffic has died down, and doing fun stuff.
Best option of all, if it's open to you is to try and get transfered with a company who will pay your housing, car, school fees etc and move you on after 2 or 3 years if you want. But these gigs are pretty rare, and companies usually favour long serving staff members for them when they do come up.
XJSJohn said:
phumy said:
Understand and align yourself with the local culture, i.e. when in Rome, dont ever think you can fight it or even change it, you cant and you wont.
When in Jakarta, drive like a porn star on extacyhttp://www.asiaone.com/Motoring/News/Story/A1Story...
I have my shirt and trousers on too, she will get away with it dont fear..
OPwhat are your ages 20s, 30s?
http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/stream/work...
If under 30, one way of working ,here short term, and can get your foot in the door for perm visa
http://www.immigration.govt.nz/migrant/stream/work...
If under 30, one way of working ,here short term, and can get your foot in the door for perm visa
Lived in NZ for 18 months but have since come back to the UK.
As others have stated, be sure it is what you all want, being away from friends and family affects some more than others and can be difficult. Despite promises otherwise friends and family will not visit that often and when they do will expect you to take holiday to be with them (not always possible depending on what job you do).
Be sure you understand the cost of living, we did not anticipate the cost of living in NZ to be as high as it was / is which in the end brought us back to the UK despite the way of life being wonderful we had no spare cash at the end of the month.
However, I would say go for it, it gives you a more balanced view of the world, you make new friends, you will have experiences to last you the rest of your life.
You will understand that no other country appreciates tea like the brits do
As others have stated, be sure it is what you all want, being away from friends and family affects some more than others and can be difficult. Despite promises otherwise friends and family will not visit that often and when they do will expect you to take holiday to be with them (not always possible depending on what job you do).
Be sure you understand the cost of living, we did not anticipate the cost of living in NZ to be as high as it was / is which in the end brought us back to the UK despite the way of life being wonderful we had no spare cash at the end of the month.
However, I would say go for it, it gives you a more balanced view of the world, you make new friends, you will have experiences to last you the rest of your life.
You will understand that no other country appreciates tea like the brits do
Thanks for all the replies guys, really appreciate the insights.
This is most definitely a joint decision, and not a 'LETS DO IT!' push from myself. I'd be crucifying myself to force my other half out there and leave her in misery whilst I go and do high five circuits round the office after a successful round of office chair jousting.
I totally appreciate how difficult working out the financials of it all is. Everything is just so different dependant on where you go, even city to city (much like the UK then really..) so lots to be taken into the mix.
This is most definitely a joint decision, and not a 'LETS DO IT!' push from myself. I'd be crucifying myself to force my other half out there and leave her in misery whilst I go and do high five circuits round the office after a successful round of office chair jousting.
I totally appreciate how difficult working out the financials of it all is. Everything is just so different dependant on where you go, even city to city (much like the UK then really..) so lots to be taken into the mix.
You will find expat forums for most places you are looking to go to, although the main contributors (in my experience) tend to be expat spouse's showing off how much their other half earns, they also can give you a good idea of what living costs will be like and the sort of things that you can expect.
They also often have usefull area guides for accommodation and pricing (at least where costs more than others) and other usefull resources.
Whatever you choose, if you are doing the move independently rather than with the support of an employer make sure you do your research thoroughly to ensure that you get the most out of your overseas experience!
(remember employer will usually cover flights, shipping, a few months serviced apartment, deposits for property, if not whole rental, access to relocation specialists etc. all of this costs a lot up front when solo)
They also often have usefull area guides for accommodation and pricing (at least where costs more than others) and other usefull resources.
Whatever you choose, if you are doing the move independently rather than with the support of an employer make sure you do your research thoroughly to ensure that you get the most out of your overseas experience!
(remember employer will usually cover flights, shipping, a few months serviced apartment, deposits for property, if not whole rental, access to relocation specialists etc. all of this costs a lot up front when solo)
XJSJohn said:
Ensure that you understand the true cost of living where you are going (rent, tax, food, transport, entertaining, medical, education etc) and ensure that your earning capabilities match this. Many people just do a forex conversion plus a bit and think they will be fine. They usually are not.
I hope last sentence is not true! tyrewrecker said:
XJSJohn said:
Ensure that you understand the true cost of living where you are going (rent, tax, food, transport, entertaining, medical, education etc) and ensure that your earning capabilities match this. Many people just do a forex conversion plus a bit and think they will be fine. They usually are not.
I hope last sentence is not true! XJSJohn said:
tyrewrecker said:
XJSJohn said:
Ensure that you understand the true cost of living where you are going (rent, tax, food, transport, entertaining, medical, education etc) and ensure that your earning capabilities match this. Many people just do a forex conversion plus a bit and think they will be fine. They usually are not.
I hope last sentence is not true! jshell said:
tyrewrecker said:
jshell said:
Or they have to pay their apartment rental 1 year up-front!
Good companies cover apartment eh John 
but its a good point, even for the "expat package" type, its becoming more and more an all in cash package deal these days and you look after yourself. All be it that places like Dubai are something of an exception to the rule, but i dont think that OP was thinking of the middle east!
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