Is travelling a good thing?
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Discussion

fomb

Original Poster:

1,405 posts

240 months

Monday 12th December 2011
quotequote all
I'm in the early stages of talking to a company about potentially working for them in a technical marketing sort of role.

I've spent the last 15 years behind a desk developing software, and now have a wife and two kids.

This job entails "Ability to travel internationally and across EMEA up to 40%". Now for me, given that this is described as a UK job, means that it'll be 40% away from the office, with the odd trip further afield when required.

Given that I've not worked in a job that requires regular travel before, I'd be interested to hear from anyone who has. I'm not talking travelling salesman sort of people, more those who are presenting / dealing with larger audiences at conferences etc (or those who do a lot of travel).

rog007

5,828 posts

253 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
It's not for everyone, both morally and physically. Morally, you'll certainly see less of the family and contribute less to running the household. Physically, unless you are religious, your health and fitness will deteriorate; at what rate will depend upon your own self discipline. Good luck!

tuffer

9,006 posts

296 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
rog007 said:
It's not for everyone, both morally and physically. Morally, you'll certainly see less of the family and contribute less to running the household. Physically, unless you are religious, your health and fitness will deteriorate; at what rate will depend upon your own self discipline. Good luck!
What he said, I travel oversees about 80 - 85% and this year my health has suffered big time. Now fat.

Deva Link

26,934 posts

274 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
How old are your kids? Do you get involved in doing stuff with them during the week at the moment or does your wife take care of all that?

Do you find travelling fun or does it stress you out?

If the 40% is accurate and it really is presenting at conferences etc, then that should be a fairly relaxed schedule. The nightmare (to my mind) jobs are the ones where you fly out on Sunday evening, tour a bunch of countries and then get home on Saturday morning. I'm struggling to imagine how conferences etc could fill 40% of your time though. Travelling outside Europe will normally wipe out at least a week. Will the company allow business class travel - that can make a huge difference to the bearability of the flight? In Europe, will they want you to use RyanAir or can you use a proper airline?

I travel to the US and Europe a few times per year but I'm largely in the UK. The obvious next step in my career is some sort of European manger type of role but I'd rather have my eyes poked out with sharp sticks as I absolutely hate all the hassle involved in flying. However my brother did it for years and loved it, only stopping as his wife put him under a lot of pressure as the kids got into their teens.

GSP

1,965 posts

233 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
I travel 50% of the time internationally. The other 50% of the time I am in the UK and 3 days of the week I will be in a hotel.

Everyone else thinkgs it's great... 'oooo you jet setter', and sure it saves you some money, and generally pays well because of the being away from home aspect.

BUT... it's far from great, you eat crap because you can and your not paying for it, you go out for drinks to be social so you don't look a loaner, your away from family, and you loose your routine.

Swings and roundabouts.

456mgt

2,513 posts

295 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
Unless you're prepared to adapt your routine, this will be hard on both you and your family. As said earlier, people who don't travel much will think it's cool that you fly to Copenhagen for dinner then head off for New York the next day. But it isn't. Airports are a special brand of hell, more so since 9/11, and you can get really sick of hotels however nice they are. I find the most important things are to watch what you eat and take your gym stuff with you. Most decent hotels have a gym/sauna so carve out some time to use the facilities. You'll need to make an effort to stay in touch with your family via skype and text etc.

Some travel is great, but it tends to be feast or famine.

deckster

9,631 posts

284 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
Can only agree with what's been written above. I travel pretty much all the time in my current job and whilst there is a certain amount of 'yah, tomorrow I'm in Hamburg and then I have a conference in Orlando' it's essentially pretty st. In my experience, people either can't take the travel and quit pretty quickly, or just grin and bear it because the job otherwise is pretty good (hint: if the job otherwise isn't pretty good, then don't even consider it). People who actively enjoy the travelling are very, very rare.

At the end of the you can only find out which end of the scale you are by actually doing it - you'll find out within the first month.

(this post was written in a hotel bar in Amsterdam whilst, once again, writing reports in my evening and drinking beer because there's sod all else to do. If this appeals to you, by all means take the job smile)

New POD

3,851 posts

179 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
Is travelling a good thing ?

No.

Over the last 20 years in Various Jobs as a manufacturing Engineer, I had been forced to travel cattle class around Europe, and to the States, and NEVER anywhere particularly exotic, and when I found places that I did like travelling to, I found I couldn't afford to take my wife and kids there anyway.

The biggest issue has always been that the travel is always rushed, You travel out to Italy on a Bank Holiday Monday, getting to a sister plant by 5pm (Seriously), and then you spend 3 days with an Italian Company trying to buy an assembly line that's almost the same but not as 24 other similar one in the italian sister company, and finally you agree a deal, which gets it designed, built and delievered 3 days before you need to prove to ford that you have capacity (which is why you aren't doing the negotiation next week. Finally you get home at 10Pm on Friday, and the wife thinks you've been on a Jolly in a Hotel, and having a wail of a time, when in fact you've spent a week arguing with foreigners in a language you don't speak.

The following Monday, you go to work and inform your Boss that you'll take Tuesday Morning and Wednesday afternoon off in Leiu for the fact that you had to travel out on the bank holiday (leaving the house at 7am FFS) and he tries to fob you off with "Travel Time is in your Own time" (HR back you up which moves you to the "If there are redundancies, he's on the top of the list" list that your boss must have in his desk.

The travelling sends you paranoid.

So 2 week later you have to go to France, but this time you are Ready. First you book an early flight, so you don't have to go into work, second you stop and have a Very nice lunch in the mountains, third you have a look around Nancy and go shopping, then you head for the hotel. Next Day you breeze into the factory at 10 ish, and leave at 4, and go sight seeing, then the next day the same, except that you pretend that you have to get back for an evening flight. Instead you go to the supermarket, and buy a small carry on suitcase and fill it with wine. The Next day you head for your flight, but stop in the mountains for a nice lunch, and a walk in the park, and finally you get home at about 7pm. Next day you go into work at about 11, saying the flight was late and it was very late when you got home (it was 10 mins late, and 7pm is later than 5pm)

But that was 10 years ago. I'm now a self employed 'Lean 6 Sigma Magician', and most contracts are nowhere near home. But Luckily I Now get paid by the Hour and my kids are a lot older (15 and 18), so I'm out of the house from 5am Monday to 5pm Friday, but I just work as many hours as I can Monday to Thursday, and Friday I take it easy, and finish at Lunch.

I think the main issue is what you spend your time doing when you are at home. I had to find a nice way to say to my wife, that I couldn't spend my weekends going shopping and helping clean the house, as I'd prefer to spend time with her and the kids. I offered to get a cleaner, and order the food on line, but she'd rather not do that. Also, I've had to put my foot down about coming to parents evenings and stuff, like concerts. If I drive back to be in time for a parents evening, I loose 5 hours pay, and My wife would rather I earned that, but I've had to say "No, I need to be seen to be there for this" Effectively my wife is doing what a st boss would do. "Can't your wife go?"

I think if you have a job with lots of travelling you need to Make sure that family time is treated with respect by your boss.
Also
Book hotels with a Gym
Never go over the speed limit for work.
Never Rush anywhere.
Always choose flights and travel arrangements to suit you.
Always get a taxi back from the airport.

GSP

1,965 posts

233 months

Tuesday 13th December 2011
quotequote all
deckster said:

(this post was written in a hotel bar in Amsterdam whilst, once again, writing reports in my evening and drinking beer because there's sod all else to do. If this appeals to you, by all means take the job smile)
Written from a bar in a generic and very dated Scandic Hotel.

Another thing is if you are not used to spending money it can take some getting used, some colleagues have come and gone having never managed it.

Before I got my current job my previous employer pretty much had a no expenses policy. Then a month later I was thrust an American express card and was spending £4k a month on flights alone, before factoring in food, hire cars, hotels and entertaining. You can end up with £10k+ expenses each month, which is very uncomfortable if your used to being worried about claiming a boots meal deal for lunch.

I'm fortunate in that I love the industry I work in, and the people I work with, plus my employer is super flexible in as much if you do silly hours monday to wednesday, you have a lazy thursday and friday off, which is a must, if you get a sense that your potentially going to be working for a little hitler don't even bother. If you do have doubts though I just wouldn't bother as it can be hard getting back into a normal job.


Edited by GSP on Tuesday 13th December 23:09

null

13,816 posts

220 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
I find it ok if you're never away over a weekend and if you're either paid very, very well for the 14 hours you're able to work when away for 48 hours or you're paid for the time you're required to travel. Or if it's pretty infrequent.

Otherwise, it's very easy to get bitter about getting fatter eating about steak on the company in some hot country, daft as it sounds.

EvoDelta

8,288 posts

219 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
I never used to mind travelling before I had my son, but nowadays every trip is a chore. I have a trip planned to Rome at the end of January that I should be looking forward to, but in reality it's going to be a PITA.

Edited by EvoDelta on Wednesday 14th December 09:39


Edited by EvoDelta on Wednesday 14th December 09:39

J B L

4,217 posts

244 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
It can go both ways: you might love it, travelling in comfort to nice locations meeting with interesting people or it could be hell compounded by the fact that you are missing your family.

OP, you ought to think hard about it because although 40% doesn't seem much it represents 10 working days away from home out of a typical month of 23. That is indeed if your new employer is being straightforward and you don't end up with more days away and/or rush periods when you have to double your travels.

One important factor to consider is the other half. I was already travelling left, right and centre when I met my wife, she knew the deal way before we got serious and we now have a 2 y.o child. It can be hard on her sometimes and she will make me feel it (rarely but it can happen when she'sat the end of her tether), that's something you have to block out because there's work to be done! But I know she knows that's what I want to do, it comes with my line of business and the day I have enough I'll change.
Your wife might not be used to it: did you talk to her about it? Can your children look after themselves when one is sick and takes all her attention whilst you are away? How will it affect her social life?
Only reason I am pointing all this out is because I have seen quite a few colleagues taken dowm the guilt trip route as if all the bad things that were happening in the household were their fault and that damn job they prefer to their family

The physical aspect mentionned by other posters is important, when travelling to Europe/US I always try and find a hotel with a swimming pool and forces myself to do at least 1/2 hour swimming per evening minimum.
Travelling to 'exotic' locations sometimes makes it a bit more difficult but then again, there were places I travelled to (Africa mainly) where I daren't eat at all hehe so that was the diet sorted.
Top tip: even though all these steacks and stuff are tempting: when on your own go for the large salad. I know it's boring but like other posters have said before, it takes discipline not to become the guy people in the plane pray won't sit next to them!


I know it can paint a gloomy picture but regular business travel can be enjoyable, I like it. It takes a lot of organisation to get your work and family life to work together but you end up falling into a rythm that just works. My trips are planned 3 to 6 months in advance everything that's not marked as a trip is family or Me time. I couldn't have a desk only job now, one day I can see myself stopping just not now.

In your case, you ought to be ready for quite a bit of change. One rule of airport survival is to just go with the flow. Give yourslef quite a bit of time to avoid stress.

Good luck. thumbup

ScoobyDood

2,183 posts

188 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
There are a lot of factors to consider, most of which are mentioned here. Also you must consider what the employer's views are on work/life balance.

I worked on contract for BP a few years back and was lucky enough to be on a project that took me to all sorts of exotic places for up to 6 months at a time and in business/Upper class. They also insisted I was never away from home for more than 3 weeks at a time breaking stays up with 5/6 day paid respite (and upper class flights) at home. Still haven't spent all those Virgin miles ;-)

NotKenBlock

7,524 posts

213 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
GSP said:
Everyone else thinkgs it's great... 'oooo you jet setter',
.
I get this a lot.

Im out of the country about 10 times a year and travel in the UK (day trips mostly) about 4 days with 1 working from home or in head office.

I recently did a trip to Frankfurt.. queue the usual.. 'oh its a great city go here' 'when i went we did this' your so lucky work pay for it.

Reality:
Step of the plane sunday night at 9.30pm go straight to hotel (at the airport)
Wake up, go to meeting (at the office, which is at the airport)
Fly home.

Didnt leave the airport complex.

How glamourous...

hyperblue

2,907 posts

209 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
NotKenBlock said:
GSP said:
Everyone else thinkgs it's great... 'oooo you jet setter',
.
I get this a lot.

Im out of the country about 10 times a year and travel in the UK (day trips mostly) about 4 days with 1 working from home or in head office.

I recently did a trip to Frankfurt.. queue the usual.. 'oh its a great city go here' 'when i went we did this' your so lucky work pay for it.

Reality:
Step of the plane sunday night at 9.30pm go straight to hotel (at the airport)
Wake up, go to meeting (at the office, which is at the airport)
Fly home.

Didnt leave the airport complex.

How glamourous...
hehe Exactly. I went to South Korea this year. I'm told it's an alright country, but I could've been anywhere in the world. My schedule was:

Land 11pm after an 11 hour flight via Tokyo, take a taxi straight to hotel.
Wake up 6am to travel to the office. Meetings ending at 6pm, return to hotel.
Fly back at 5am the following morning.

However, my company let me arrange the return flight to have a 3 day stay in Tokyo, used up some annual leave and explored the city. Used some air miles to book the hotel, made the trip less of a chore for me.

If you're just in hotel/meeting/plane it does get tedious and tiring. As others have mentioned, you have to be quite disciplined to not get fat, make good use of the hotel gym if you can. Hotel food is generally not healthy and if you're on your own it's easy to have a few pints due to the boredom of being in a hotel.

Also you'll get ill a lot, due to crappy air on the plane, dodgy local food etc.

Edited by hyperblue on Wednesday 14th December 11:59

Rude-boy

22,227 posts

262 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
Not in the same league as many but I also travel a lot for the second job.

I can tell you lots about airports, hotels and race tracks. I can tell you all about the fastest way to get between these.

Outside of that I can tell you bugger all.

You know that travelling has lost it’s glow when you realise that all you really need is a clean room with an en-suit, TV and coffee and that you view Hilton’s and Radison’s the same way you view a Premier Inn.

We were meant to be going to see the Northern Lights this Christmas but I’m so feed up of travelling this year that I’ve had a little strop about it and we’re staying home as we never seem to be there just for the sake of it. These days it seems the only time we aren’t travelling is when we have to be home for some reason.

And we don’t have kids and 95% of the time come as a package.

Deva Link

26,934 posts

274 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
Paddy_N_Murphy said:
ScoobyDood said:
There are a lot of factors to consider, most of which are mentioned here. Also you must consider what the employer's views are on work/life balance.

I worked on contract for BP a few years back and was lucky enough to be on a project that took me to all sorts of exotic places for up to 6 months at a time and in business/Upper class. They also insisted I was never away from home for more than 3 weeks at a time breaking stays up with 5/6 day paid respite (and upper class flights) at home. Still haven't spent all those Virgin miles ;-)
^^^^ Different world
smile
Absolutey, but I note he said "a few years back". I live near Shell Stanlow and know a few people who worked there - their travelling T's & C's were remarkable - getting paid all travelling time at overtime rates, a nightly disturbance allowance etc etc. Even European travel was business class. They used to love going away as they made a fortune in expense claims - I used to end up out of pocket on my travelling!

But Shell have shut down or sold off all those little divisions and specialist groups it had locally and I'm sure those people's new employers won't be as generous.

ScoobyDood

2,183 posts

188 months

Wednesday 14th December 2011
quotequote all
Deva Link said:
Paddy_N_Murphy said:
ScoobyDood said:
There are a lot of factors to consider, most of which are mentioned here. Also you must consider what the employer's views are on work/life balance.

I worked on contract for BP a few years back and was lucky enough to be on a project that took me to all sorts of exotic places for up to 6 months at a time and in business/Upper class. They also insisted I was never away from home for more than 3 weeks at a time breaking stays up with 5/6 day paid respite (and upper class flights) at home. Still haven't spent all those Virgin miles ;-)
^^^^ Different world
smile
Absolutey, but I note he said "a few years back". I live near Shell Stanlow and know a few people who worked there - their travelling T's & C's were remarkable - getting paid all travelling time at overtime rates, a nightly disturbance allowance etc etc. Even European travel was business class. They used to love going away as they made a fortune in expense claims - I used to end up out of pocket on my travelling!

But Shell have shut down or sold off all those little divisions and specialist groups it had locally and I'm sure those people's new employers won't be as generous.
2004/5 to be precise

dreamer75

1,439 posts

257 months

Thursday 15th December 2011
quotequote all
It depends on the sort of travel. Companies I've worked for (big American companies) want you to travel and stay as economically as possible (i.e. cheaply as poss).

That doesn't mean st hotels, but it does mean minimal time away as possible; no flying out and giving yourself time to adjust to jetlag for example.

But for Euro travel that doesn't tend to be an issue, instead it might be very early starts (to get the first plane int he am), a long day, and then get a late flight back. Repeat.

For a TME type role those trips may not be planned far in advance, so there's not so much opportunity to get any sort of routine if you have family.

For me personally, it's not for me (any more). When I was younger I enjoyed it, but now I just can't be bothered with the packing, unpacking, hotels, hotel food, lack of exercise, foreign tv, and having to socialise with people in the evenings that I just don't want to bother with !

Some people love it though; and it's for all the reasons I hate! i.e. meeting lots of different people, going out to restaurants/hotels for food and drinks, opportunity to get visibility within the company with a lot of different people etc. etc.

DWS

657 posts

247 months

Thursday 15th December 2011
quotequote all
Rude-boy said:
You know that travelling has lost it’s glow when you realise that all you really need is a clean room with an en-suit, TV and coffee and that you view Hilton’s and Radison’s the same way you view a Premier Inn.
Nail on the head.
I travelled for 15 years with the job and am married without kids. My wife got used to me not being there all the time but didn't like it. I travelled worldwide met some great people who remain great friends. Saw some great places, saw some S**t places. Stayed in too manny hotels, learnt to travel light, learnt to pack only what I REALLY needed and had some fantastic experiences. There are also a lot of downsides again as others have pointed our. Airports are not pleasant places, sitting in a metal tube for hours on end gets tiresome. At first it's a novelty but it wears off quite quickly and you will get told you live jet set life by people who havn't done it. THey won't beleive it's not half as much fun as they think it is.

What Rud-boy says above is spot on, that's the point I got to and decided to get out.
Overall do I regret all the travelling? no. I got to the point of if I never got on a plane again it would be too soon. I now only fly two or three times a year to go on holiday.

Only you can decide if it's for you.


ETA Re BP. Beleive it was thier policy that you travelled Business class as they were S**t scared of anyone sueing them for DVT by sitting in monkey class