track day car advice.

[forrest]

I'm planning on building a trck day car, if anyone owns one of the following or has any advice, please help.

The car must be road legal.

Prefferably : Front engine, manual, RWD, normally aspirated, and not too special to look at. I want to completely strip the car, add a cage etc, It'll be on a limited budget, so losing weight is more important than engine tuning.

My short list is:
Clio 1.2 with a 2.0 Laguna lump.
325i
old Supra
old Celica
Torino ? (spelling)
Alfa 75
Volvo 240 turbo
Merc 190 E
944
200SX 13/14
106 Rallye
Golf I
928
XJS

Cheers.

[jeremyc]

How limited is your budget?

What about buying a Caterham/Westfield and enjoying all of the things you are looking for without the expense and hassle of the build, and lower running costs?

[forrest]

£7000 tops.
I don't want Caterfield, nor 911, otherwise anything goes.

[gargamel]

fairly sure the 106 & clio are fwd
alfa 75 - breaks to easily

and indeed brakes and handling rule out nearly all the heavy cars in this list

I would say an m spec bmw is the way forward - even with intergalatic milage

should get an e30 m spec for the money

[pentoman]

Anyone else fascinated at the task of converting an XJS V12 into a track car?

I'd be up for that!

[m-five]

pentoman said:

Anyone else fascinated at the task of converting an XJS V12 into a track car? I'd be up for that!

Seen one or two in my track day experience.

Once was a turbocharged monster that used to pull away in either a cloud of oily smoke, or in a puff of flame.

Wasn't particularly fast for a supposed 450bhp though (compared to a puny 340bhp M5).

The other one was a Lister conversion, don't know the specs but it was fast and handled very well.

Neither looked road-legal and both came on trailers.



>> Edited by m-five on Friday 15th August 14:53

[alunr]

dontlift has a tricked up 944 which looks a lot of fun

[ultimasimon]

alunr said:

dontlift has a tricked up 944 which looks a lot of fun

He also has a Kamela on order which looks like a lot more fun! Can't wait to see that as it has the same power to weight as my Ult

BTW don't go for the 928 as a track day car, my penultimate car was a 928S and the running costs are MENTAL

[trackdemon]

cheap RWD track fun?

I really like the idea of a 75 V6, shorn of all extraneous bits and with a fruity exhaust. The base mechanicals are surpirsingly hardy, and remember the 75 was a pretty decent European touring car in its day. Cheap as chips to buy, huge enthuisiast network will supply all kinds of cheap or expensive bits as you want. Lots of fun to drive and sounds glorious. Maybe a GTV if you could find one?

Otherwise:
Leggy MX5
Sharknose 323i
Citroen BX GTi 16v - not RWD, but still fun and different
Daihatsu Charade GTti - mad as a hat, still FWD but plenty oversteer=grins
Fiat Mirafiori (131?)- Oh yes!, find one that hasn't rusted away, stick fat arches on it and an Integrale unit under the bonnet - was a good rally car in its day... parts supply questionable though
Ford Capri 2.8i - easy choice, but easy to see why! Classic shape, sh!tloads of cheap parts supply, gruff & grunty V6 with he man oversteer. A safe but good choice.
Spruced up Mk1 or 2 'scort - followed one round Hethel last year and while it wasn't quick it did look enormous fun with no grip from its skimpy 13" wheels. Easy to tune and loads of cheap bits around. Having a MIG welder may come in handy though!
Ginetta - a few different Ginetta's knocking around at lowish money could be good. In fact how about an Evante? Rare beast indeed...
Honda CRX/Prelude? FWD but great fun, reasonably quick and a bit sturdier than some....
Hyundai Stellar. Could buy for £100 and throw a grand at making it go. I just love the idea of one of these old sh!tboxes power sliding round a track due to having a Ford 16v lump underbonnet
Isuzu Piazza - rare and parts may be thin on the ground but fits your criteria pretty much out of the box, except ot looks funky in a late '80s kind of way!
Any old Jag - brave but could be fun.
Mazda RX7 - dodgy engine but nice
Misubishi Starion Turbo (lag)- Another rare far eastern beast. Proper 'mans car'
Nissan 200SX - Obvious front runner. Maybe a Silvia turbo to do it really cheap?
Opel Manta - squeeze a modern Vauxhall unit underbonnet to make it go properly. Handles better than Capri & rarer. Quite cool or am I sad?
Peugeot 205 / 309 GTi - Can't go wrong except wrong wheel drive. Still oversteer though!
Porsche 924/944 - boring! Could get pricey if things go wrong
Renault GTA V6 - rare and beautiful rear engined beast. Only for the very brave. Find one!
Rover SD1 - Bit big and heavy, but good fun. Could be pricey to run.
Saab 99/900 Turbo - Parts pricey. Different
Subaru Legacy - Well, if its good enough for McRae....
Toyota Supra - Early model, not the lardy 89-94 model.
Vauxhall Carlton GSi - Lots of fun, if a little heavy.
Volvo 340 - no, really! Stick a big engine in it and off you go. Saw a couple of these at a Silverstone trackday a while back and they were proper quick.

Well, thats all I can think of for now! Me? I'd go for either the 'slightly offbeat' Alfa 75 V6 or the 'classic' Ford Capri 2.8i....

[Incorrigible]

forrest said:

£7000 tops. I don't want Caterfield, nor 911, otherwise anything goes.

I'd re-consider the caterfield if I were you

All the others on the list are going to cost fortunes in consumables (tyres, brakes etc)

You could go for a slightly larger kit car (sylva fury etc) but they're heavier (expense)

If you want it for the road as well, what about a TVR "S". Again it'll cost much more to run on the track than a caterfield but all the runnning gear is cheap (ford) and they're easily tunable/fixable/upgradable with all the knowledge you need right here (PH not me )

[accident]

a question needs to be answered before you pick a car.
what do you want from your track days?
1;do you see it as a place to learn "racecraft"in preperation for you debut on the racing stage.
2;do you see it as an exercise in learning the best lines and the quickest way to drive your car near its limits.
3: do you just want to have a laugh going sideways all the time regardless of speed.
if the answer is 1 then pick a car that you can take with you when you go racing,any 7alike will do as they have plenty of various race,sprint and hillclimbs to go at.
it the answer is 2 then any car on the planet will be fine as its you thats learning to drive.
if the answer is 3 then anything rwd with a reasonably powerfull engine an lsd and really hard tyres that offer no real grip will have you grinning so much you wont be able to take your helmet off.capri2.8,sierra 2.8,bmw 325i,alfa gtv6,xjs,starion,nissan s13 200.
we are talking £1000 cars here(maximum)then blow the other 6 grand on track days and fuel.

[james]

m-five said:

pentoman said: Anyone else fascinated at the task of converting an XJS V12 into a track car? I'd be up for that! Seen one or two in my track day experience. Once was a turbocharged monster that used to pull away in either a cloud of oily smoke, or in a puff of flame. Wasn't particularly fast for a supposed 450bhp though (compared to a puny 340bhp M5). The other one was a Lister conversion, don't know the specs but it was fast and handled very well. Neither looked road-legal and both came on trailers. >> Edited by m-five on Friday 15th August 14:53

That's Tracey Bakers car. She races it in the Jaguar Car Club XJS series. If you want to see what an XJS can do on the track, you should go along to watch them some time. They can be damned quick.

I used to race against one in Classic Touring Car races. It was pretty much unstopable, but then it is owned and driven by a guy who owns a Jag dealership, so I don't think he has too much to worry about when it comes to getting a bit of expert work done on it )

[james]

trackdemon said:

cheap RWD track fun? Rover SD1 - Bit big and heavy, but good fun. Could be pricey to run.

Not once you've got rid of all the bits you don't need. When I was racing an SD1 we got the weight down to 1165Kg. We could have got it lighter still, as there was still weight to lose, but it would have been a case of diminishing returns. Anyway, we'd only have had to put it back as ballast, as we would have been below minimum weight. A great fun car though. We got the weight down, and stuck a 300BHP 3.5 engine in there (if you're just using it for track days, you'd probably be better off sticking in a larger capacity less highly tuned motor). A few hundred quid on suspension, and you're away.

Not heavy at all, and you can get them to handle like a dream

[I Cooke]

I'll say it again!

1.9 205Gti with an Mi16 engine. Absolutely fantastic.

Make sure it's the 1.9 Mi16 ally block though, not the 2.0 litre heavyweight.

Stripped out and caged you can get them to 800Kg, the engine has 160Bhp (ish) as stock!

Calc out,,,,

Thats 200Bhp / Ton

[zumbruk]

Driven at the wrong end, innit...

[forrest]

I'm about to start a new project for a track day car for next year. I've decided on either a E30 325i Sport, or a 535i Sport. Either way I want to drop in a S36/S38 M5 straight six. I'm not after good lap times, I'm after some fun, and sonthing different from the Caterham 7, Impreza & 911 Bregade. The car must be road legal, as I drive to the 'Ring quite often, although it is not an only car. I want to spend a max of £7k for which I want to strip the car, cage it, uprate the suspension and brakes. I also want subtle, so black with ome type of standard looking BMW wheels, and de-badged and de-chromed. Please any ideas or comments. Also any advice on people who can do this sort of engine swap. I'v decided on hartge for the suspension and brakes.