Stripping out a track day car.
Discussion
I have been tracking my Skoda vRS last year and I am very pleased with it.
Engine upgrades to nearly 250 BHP, Gearbox with LSD, usual suspension and anti-rollbar upgrades, brakes, lighter wheels with Triple 8’s.
I am at the stage where I have been considering for some time stripping out the interior and changing the glass for polycarbonate.
Just a ballpark question. If I strip out the interior sensibly, all seats, electric window motors and mechanisms, radio, transmission tunnel, door cards, handles et cetera and all the bits and pieces. Change the glass for polycarbonate including the back window. Fit a pair of lightish bucket seats.
What is going to be the approximate weight saving?
Also, just a shot in the dark, if anyone has a pair of track day/race seats that would be suitable, please PM me.
Engine upgrades to nearly 250 BHP, Gearbox with LSD, usual suspension and anti-rollbar upgrades, brakes, lighter wheels with Triple 8’s.
I am at the stage where I have been considering for some time stripping out the interior and changing the glass for polycarbonate.
Just a ballpark question. If I strip out the interior sensibly, all seats, electric window motors and mechanisms, radio, transmission tunnel, door cards, handles et cetera and all the bits and pieces. Change the glass for polycarbonate including the back window. Fit a pair of lightish bucket seats.
What is going to be the approximate weight saving?
Also, just a shot in the dark, if anyone has a pair of track day/race seats that would be suitable, please PM me.
Obviously not the same car - I stripped as much as I could out of Lionel 1 - removed 105kg. It made it feel fast but was quite unpleasant.
When I built Lionel 2 I was a bit more sensible, probably took 70kg out, there isnt that much difference between the two, except Lionel 2 is much nicer place to thrash round the track all day.
For me, I take out some easy wins, because race car, but wouldn't bother going to the nth degree.
ETA - I bet you could get way more than 120kg out of an Octavia if you were so inclined.
When I built Lionel 2 I was a bit more sensible, probably took 70kg out, there isnt that much difference between the two, except Lionel 2 is much nicer place to thrash round the track all day.
For me, I take out some easy wins, because race car, but wouldn't bother going to the nth degree.
ETA - I bet you could get way more than 120kg out of an Octavia if you were so inclined.
If it’s still a road car, leave the glass in it
I stripped out my DC2 ITR - in many ways I wish i hadn’t hadnt, except for the proper seats and harnesses. I did enjoy it but I was in my 30s. Not now in my 50s!!
Not much weight in carpets and sound deadening in a DC2 ITR - not sure about your VRS. Seats are normally the main gain, plus it’s just better on track to be located properly
I stripped out my DC2 ITR - in many ways I wish i hadn’t hadnt, except for the proper seats and harnesses. I did enjoy it but I was in my 30s. Not now in my 50s!!
Not much weight in carpets and sound deadening in a DC2 ITR - not sure about your VRS. Seats are normally the main gain, plus it’s just better on track to be located properly
Thanks for the replies.
Thoughts are to keep the car taxed and MOT so I can use it very, very occasionally and of course try out any changes I make.
I see the point about carpets and sound deadening. For the little gain I will leave that in.
Glass and its mechanisms must be worth a fair bit. For the cost of about 500 quid to renew all glass in polycarbonate sounds about right.
Yes, the front seats aren’t as heavy as anything like an A3 but I know from my last car which had Lotus seats, they hardly weighed anything!
Thoughts are to keep the car taxed and MOT so I can use it very, very occasionally and of course try out any changes I make.
I see the point about carpets and sound deadening. For the little gain I will leave that in.
Glass and its mechanisms must be worth a fair bit. For the cost of about 500 quid to renew all glass in polycarbonate sounds about right.
Yes, the front seats aren’t as heavy as anything like an A3 but I know from my last car which had Lotus seats, they hardly weighed anything!
Standard equipment in a VAG saloon is going to be heavy I would have thought. As already pointed out, you will gain a lot from the front seats alone.
100-150kg will be achievable, maybe more if you go mental with it. It's just a matter of how far you want to go. I personally don't mind a stripped out car if it's just for TD's and to drive to and from the track, but wouldn't daily one. I would say if you are going poly windows, no interior etc then just go the whole hog and gut the thing. Set of lightweight wheels would be a good upgrade too.
100-150kg will be achievable, maybe more if you go mental with it. It's just a matter of how far you want to go. I personally don't mind a stripped out car if it's just for TD's and to drive to and from the track, but wouldn't daily one. I would say if you are going poly windows, no interior etc then just go the whole hog and gut the thing. Set of lightweight wheels would be a good upgrade too.
- racecar
Honestly I don’t think it’s worth it. Polycarbonate windows scratch very readily if you are looking to retain the ability to open and close them. They drum and rattle about if not secured or bonded in tightly.
All the weight is in the things you will want to keep (sound and vibration deadening).
You can turn your car into something very different and the benefit is not worth it as others are saying.
Car manufacturers aren’t silly, few things are superfluous or unnecessarily heavy for their function.
I agree with others who are saying fit more suitable front seats and harnesses and leave it at that.
All the weight is in the things you will want to keep (sound and vibration deadening).
You can turn your car into something very different and the benefit is not worth it as others are saying.
Car manufacturers aren’t silly, few things are superfluous or unnecessarily heavy for their function.
I agree with others who are saying fit more suitable front seats and harnesses and leave it at that.
Edited by HustleRussell on Sunday 9th January 16:12
And for a track car, in hindsight more than anything else, I'd spend it on brakes - as much as I could possibly afford, it's the one best thing! That and making sure every suspension bush has been poly'd or whatever else is good for a VRS chassis
These were both my dailies for a fair few years .... hence sharing my own personal experience!
Red seated car I bought from almost new, then tuned and stripped. Brilliant car - made about 240BHP at 9500 revs on ITBs and the most lary cams Japan sold!
Black car was a race car that previous owner had managed to make road legal again. AP brakes, crazy new gear ratios designed for track, stock engine but revved to 9.5K. It was faster due to the effects of the gearing, but more than that, the brakes were just bonkers brilliant.
Both still had their glass and heaters. Living in Scotland, you want to be able to demist
[url]
|https://thumbsnap.com/zrp9KAbn[/url
These were both my dailies for a fair few years .... hence sharing my own personal experience!
Red seated car I bought from almost new, then tuned and stripped. Brilliant car - made about 240BHP at 9500 revs on ITBs and the most lary cams Japan sold!
Black car was a race car that previous owner had managed to make road legal again. AP brakes, crazy new gear ratios designed for track, stock engine but revved to 9.5K. It was faster due to the effects of the gearing, but more than that, the brakes were just bonkers brilliant.
Both still had their glass and heaters. Living in Scotland, you want to be able to demist
[url]
|https://thumbsnap.com/zrp9KAbn[/urlIt's worth fitting some lighter bucket seats and removing the rear seats along with any trim behind you etc
But the other stuff is a much bigger sacrifice for very little gain if any... Especially if you're driving it to and from the track?
Glass windows are very useful and much easier to see out of than plastic that is more than 3 days old. Maybe for the rears but I definitely wouldn't do the front windows for the little you save.
Door cards can easily be swapped for some lighter ones for a little weight saving, worth remembering you'll need to always wear long sleeves if you've got no door cards at all.
Radio can save a few kg but if you're removing a lot of the interior, you now won't have anything to drown out all of the extra road noise and rattles!
But the other stuff is a much bigger sacrifice for very little gain if any... Especially if you're driving it to and from the track?
Glass windows are very useful and much easier to see out of than plastic that is more than 3 days old. Maybe for the rears but I definitely wouldn't do the front windows for the little you save.
Door cards can easily be swapped for some lighter ones for a little weight saving, worth remembering you'll need to always wear long sleeves if you've got no door cards at all.
Radio can save a few kg but if you're removing a lot of the interior, you now won't have anything to drown out all of the extra road noise and rattles!
JP__FOX said:
It's worth fitting some lighter bucket seats and removing the rear seats along with any trim behind you etc
But the other stuff is a much bigger sacrifice for very little gain if any... Especially if you're driving it to and from the track?
Glass windows are very useful and much easier to see out of than plastic that is more than 3 days old. Maybe for the rears but I definitely wouldn't do the front windows for the little you save.
Door cards can easily be swapped for some lighter ones for a little weight saving, worth remembering you'll need to always wear long sleeves if you've got no door cards at all.
Radio can save a few kg but if you're removing a lot of the interior, you now won't have anything to drown out all of the extra road noise and rattles!
Fully agree, also door cards are never that heavy- we’re talking about a 1-2kg saving per door here 0.001% But the other stuff is a much bigger sacrifice for very little gain if any... Especially if you're driving it to and from the track?
Glass windows are very useful and much easier to see out of than plastic that is more than 3 days old. Maybe for the rears but I definitely wouldn't do the front windows for the little you save.
Door cards can easily be swapped for some lighter ones for a little weight saving, worth remembering you'll need to always wear long sleeves if you've got no door cards at all.
Radio can save a few kg but if you're removing a lot of the interior, you now won't have anything to drown out all of the extra road noise and rattles!
I’d just remove the easy big stuff and leave it at that. Polycarbs are a pain. Scratch easy and you’ll boil in the summer.
My car was 1040kgs full weight with a tank of fuel. Since then I’ve removed the sound deadening, radio, speakers, got a lithium battery, have the washer fluid from full to about 1/5. ( You’ll laugh but it was mega heavy when full!!) and changed from heavy oem single pots to alloy four pot brakes. Hoping it’s at 1000kgs now.
My car was 1040kgs full weight with a tank of fuel. Since then I’ve removed the sound deadening, radio, speakers, got a lithium battery, have the washer fluid from full to about 1/5. ( You’ll laugh but it was mega heavy when full!!) and changed from heavy oem single pots to alloy four pot brakes. Hoping it’s at 1000kgs now.
FWIW I found performance plastics in Belmont very good for poly windows. They provide to a lot of motorsport teams and you can get coating that prevents scratching and misting.
Carpets can be surprisingly heavy, I stripped an E46 saloon and with the thick foam padding / packing under the carpet, particularly in the front footwells this came to around 15kg, we did need foot rests / plates fabricating as the floor level in the footwells was around 3in lower without the carpets / packing
Carpets can be surprisingly heavy, I stripped an E46 saloon and with the thick foam padding / packing under the carpet, particularly in the front footwells this came to around 15kg, we did need foot rests / plates fabricating as the floor level in the footwells was around 3in lower without the carpets / packing
Have owned quite a few track cars over the past 20 years ( and several racing cars at the same time ).
What I’ve learned is stripping out your road based track car ( for track use ) is a big mistake and a complete waste of time.
The car becomes a pain in the arse to use when not on track , it seriously reduces its value the more you strip them out ( track cars not racing cars).
You’d go a lot faster if you spent a bit more money on better tyres , brakes and some drive training.
What I’ve learned is stripping out your road based track car ( for track use ) is a big mistake and a complete waste of time.
The car becomes a pain in the arse to use when not on track , it seriously reduces its value the more you strip them out ( track cars not racing cars).
You’d go a lot faster if you spent a bit more money on better tyres , brakes and some drive training.
HustleRussell said:
Honestly I don’t think it’s worth it. Polycarbonate windows scratch very readily if you are looking to retain the ability to open and close them. They drum and rattle about if not secured or bonded in tightly.
All the weight is in the things you will want to keep (sound and vibration deadening).
You can turn your car into something very different and the benefit is not worth it as others are saying.
Car manufacturers aren’t silly, few things are superfluous or unnecessarily heavy for their function.
I agree with others who are saying fit more suitable front seats and harnesses and leave it at that.
This, so much. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.All the weight is in the things you will want to keep (sound and vibration deadening).
You can turn your car into something very different and the benefit is not worth it as others are saying.
Car manufacturers aren’t silly, few things are superfluous or unnecessarily heavy for their function.
I agree with others who are saying fit more suitable front seats and harnesses and leave it at that.
Edited by HustleRussell on Sunday 9th January 16:12
If you're racing or sprinting, and looking for the extra tenths of a second, then do it.
If it's just to take to a handful of trackdays a year, or if you have to drive it on the road, then you're probably wasting your time and making the car less pleasant to be in.
If you really wanted to turn it into a pretend racecar, then I guess nobody can stop you. You'll find loads of people on the internet who will convince you that their car was "night and day" after they'd stripped 20kg of sound-deadening out. They are most likely lying.
But if you really wanted to go quicker, invest the effort in decent tyres, braking materials (and cooling), then tuition. You'll gain far more than any weight-loss exercise.
ETA - Just read the reply above mine. On the money.
Thank you for all your replies.
Digesting it, I can see the pro’s and con’s.
Make the car the lightest possible and shave a little off the lap times. Obviously the car won’t be as nice to drive. I was worried about summer track days and the inevitable heat with polycarbonate windows.
Leave as is and slowly improve the car, (obviously I am a driving god as I post on PH and don’t need telling what to do ). Okay, I have done scores of RWD TD’s so maybe a little FWD tuition wouldn’t go amiss.
Having given this thought as the advice has come in, I believe I will do the British thing, comprise, fudge through it!
Out will go all the seats, parcel shelf and bolt in bits.
I have a couple of very light Lotus seats that I will fit with harnesses.
The only thing that the car really will require is some 4 pots, (if anyone has a set of Cupra R’s please let me know).
The above and squeeze in as many TD’s as possible.
Thank you all for your help on this.
See you on track………
Digesting it, I can see the pro’s and con’s.
Make the car the lightest possible and shave a little off the lap times. Obviously the car won’t be as nice to drive. I was worried about summer track days and the inevitable heat with polycarbonate windows.
Leave as is and slowly improve the car, (obviously I am a driving god as I post on PH and don’t need telling what to do ). Okay, I have done scores of RWD TD’s so maybe a little FWD tuition wouldn’t go amiss.
Having given this thought as the advice has come in, I believe I will do the British thing, comprise, fudge through it!
Out will go all the seats, parcel shelf and bolt in bits.
I have a couple of very light Lotus seats that I will fit with harnesses.
The only thing that the car really will require is some 4 pots, (if anyone has a set of Cupra R’s please let me know).
The above and squeeze in as many TD’s as possible.
Thank you all for your help on this.
See you on track………
I think you've come to the right conclusion, from my PoV.
I guess I'll just never understand this mentality on trackdays.
I went purely for the enjoyment and thrill of driving a car at something approaching its limit. I loved learning tracks, spending a day out with a group of mates, and getting to fiddle with a car.
What do people going to non-competitive trackdays and timing themselves to the nearest tenth/hundredth of a second get out of it? What are they doing with this information?
I guess I'll just never understand this mentality on trackdays.
phazed said:
Make the car the lightest possible and shave a little off the lap times.
I've done plenty, and have never once felt the need to time myself (even via my GoPro footage).I went purely for the enjoyment and thrill of driving a car at something approaching its limit. I loved learning tracks, spending a day out with a group of mates, and getting to fiddle with a car.
What do people going to non-competitive trackdays and timing themselves to the nearest tenth/hundredth of a second get out of it? What are they doing with this information?
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