Caught the track bug - where do i go from here ?
Discussion
Afternoon gents 
I was up at Bruntingthorpe on sunday on a track day in my trusty shoebox - the 106 gti. I'd stripped the back end of it out (to go with what i have done already - see profile) and went out and had an absolute blast !
I had a group of guys come over who were also out in their 205 mi16's + 1.9's etc afterwards for a chat and they enquired about my car. After i told them about how little i've actually done to the engine they were impressed and perhaps a little suprised about how well it went against the other more powerful cars.
I'd like to improve the cars track behavior further and the way I see this happening is by going even lighter and not messing with the engine (yet !) I was thinking initally stripping the front of leather seats and perhaps door cards and fitting some lightweight bucket seats and harnesses.
I want to spend about £300 or so to start with and i thought this would be the best use of the money?
Can anyone suggest any tried and tested seats for around the above price but are a good compromise between quality/weight etc ?
Cheers !
Steve
>> Edited by lockstock2sb on Tuesday 31st May 13:36
I was up at Bruntingthorpe on sunday on a track day in my trusty shoebox - the 106 gti. I'd stripped the back end of it out (to go with what i have done already - see profile) and went out and had an absolute blast !
I had a group of guys come over who were also out in their 205 mi16's + 1.9's etc afterwards for a chat and they enquired about my car. After i told them about how little i've actually done to the engine they were impressed and perhaps a little suprised about how well it went against the other more powerful cars.
I'd like to improve the cars track behavior further and the way I see this happening is by going even lighter and not messing with the engine (yet !) I was thinking initally stripping the front of leather seats and perhaps door cards and fitting some lightweight bucket seats and harnesses.
I want to spend about £300 or so to start with and i thought this would be the best use of the money?
Can anyone suggest any tried and tested seats for around the above price but are a good compromise between quality/weight etc ?
Cheers !
Steve
>> Edited by lockstock2sb on Tuesday 31st May 13:36
1 word - Instruction. This will knock seconds off your lap time, where a £300 investment in new seats is unlikely to make any discernable difference at all!
I prefer proper tracks too, as it makes it easier to see where you've gone wrong (all too easy to tell yourself you have it right when just dealing with a few cones
). Try Bedford or Donington, getting instruction after a session or two and watch the lap times tumble!
Rich
I prefer proper tracks too, as it makes it easier to see where you've gone wrong (all too easy to tell yourself you have it right when just dealing with a few cones
). Try Bedford or Donington, getting instruction after a session or two and watch the lap times tumble! Rich
Yep, a bit of learning can go a long way. I would suggest:
- A copy of the Circuit Driver track guide (the best source I know for learning the lines, even if it's not always correct for your car).
- One or two decent books on race driving (search the archives for recommendations)
- A sub to Circuit Driver magazine. Mark Hales' Track Techniques column is absolutely superb
- Outside your budget, but a bullet camera would be nice if you're into that thing. You can watch and learn where you are going wrong.
- And of course, some one-to-one instruction.
The second area would be reliability and durability. I've no idea what goes wrong with 106s, but it would be better to have a reliable, if slightly slow car than an ever so slightly faster car that doesn't work.
And a third option, maybe - buy yourself a decent lid? Might keep you out of a wheelchair one day, you know it's in good nick, fits and is clean. Boring, but spend your money on the basics first.
- A copy of the Circuit Driver track guide (the best source I know for learning the lines, even if it's not always correct for your car).
- One or two decent books on race driving (search the archives for recommendations)
- A sub to Circuit Driver magazine. Mark Hales' Track Techniques column is absolutely superb
- Outside your budget, but a bullet camera would be nice if you're into that thing. You can watch and learn where you are going wrong.
- And of course, some one-to-one instruction.
The second area would be reliability and durability. I've no idea what goes wrong with 106s, but it would be better to have a reliable, if slightly slow car than an ever so slightly faster car that doesn't work.
And a third option, maybe - buy yourself a decent lid? Might keep you out of a wheelchair one day, you know it's in good nick, fits and is clean. Boring, but spend your money on the basics first.
I've got myself a decent lid already - no way i'm going to wear a ill fitting minging cheapo rental one
As far as instruction is concerned - i agree that its money well spent. I think i'm going to do 1 or 2 more then look into getting some guidance. I think i have a reasonable concept of car control/physics - but it takes an expert to help convert that into real world skill i guess
As far as the car itself is concerned
its been very reliable up to now and has been looked after with regular oil changes using top quality oil, and genuine filters, plus its recently had new brake fluid, pads and tyres. I dont really see a need to invest any money in uprating engine parts for the sake of reliability just yet...but how far do you go with it anyway? You could go over the top with it if you were fussy - but theres still a risk of things going pop if you are unlucky. I think as long as i look after the fundamentals i should get a decent run before worrying about a rebuild etc - at which point i will use uprated/more robust internals etc..
BTW - thanks for the advice so far
>> Edited by Lockstock2sb on Tuesday 31st May 16:14
As far as instruction is concerned - i agree that its money well spent. I think i'm going to do 1 or 2 more then look into getting some guidance. I think i have a reasonable concept of car control/physics - but it takes an expert to help convert that into real world skill i guess
As far as the car itself is concerned
its been very reliable up to now and has been looked after with regular oil changes using top quality oil, and genuine filters, plus its recently had new brake fluid, pads and tyres. I dont really see a need to invest any money in uprating engine parts for the sake of reliability just yet...but how far do you go with it anyway? You could go over the top with it if you were fussy - but theres still a risk of things going pop if you are unlucky. I think as long as i look after the fundamentals i should get a decent run before worrying about a rebuild etc - at which point i will use uprated/more robust internals etc..
BTW - thanks for the advice so far
>> Edited by Lockstock2sb on Tuesday 31st May 16:14
I'd also recommend instruction but getting a decent seat will help in more than just weight saving. It is difficult to control a car well if you are moving around in the seat. A decent bucket seat and a 4 or 6 point harness will hold you in place much better in the corners and give you more control over the steering wheel and pedals.
As you know Bruntingthorpe you could do a fundamentals of car control course with Don Palmer - www.donpalmer.co.uk/
And if you find that you're moving around in your seat try this gadget:- www.cg-lock.com/. PetrolTed reviewed it on PH a while back and gave it a thumbs up. It's not a replacement for a harness but if you get this before your driving course it'll probably make the course more rewarding.
You can always ask your instructor questions about what harness, seat, helmet, furry dice ... whatever! ... before you possibly spend your money on the wrong thing.
--
Richard
And if you find that you're moving around in your seat try this gadget:- www.cg-lock.com/. PetrolTed reviewed it on PH a while back and gave it a thumbs up. It's not a replacement for a harness but if you get this before your driving course it'll probably make the course more rewarding.
You can always ask your instructor questions about what harness, seat, helmet, furry dice ... whatever! ... before you possibly spend your money on the wrong thing.
--
Richard
I must've seen you race on Sunday then, my first FCS was a good day, shame couldn't take the R21 out!
Was supposed to do a track day last year, and looking like I'll miss out this year too (RST not up to it, and I'm not prepared to spend the money on it)
Do they do tution session at Snetterton? (Pretty sure they do at Brands?) I'd definitely like a tuition session before I even try a novice session at the likes of Trax!
Z
Was supposed to do a track day last year, and looking like I'll miss out this year too (RST not up to it, and I'm not prepared to spend the money on it)
Do they do tution session at Snetterton? (Pretty sure they do at Brands?) I'd definitely like a tuition session before I even try a novice session at the likes of Trax!
Z
aceparts_com said:
Up until laast year I was a complete novice. I've now done 15 track days/events, probably 10 of which were with instruction. You just cannot put a price on it, also, unlike mods to the car you get to take the knowledge with you.
Addictive...
i must agree. instruction is the best way to improve safety and track times.
chris
Instruction is a good starting point and only adds a small amount ££ to the day, very very worthwhile.
EG If you are at a Motor Sport events track day (very good place to start; www.motorsport-events.co.uk)
its only £30.
However, tuition only takes half an hour, and you'll soon pick it up so if you still then want to go and improve your car for the track without breaking the bank (or changing your insurance premium)here's where you should start:
1) Brakes - fit a set of fast road/track pads to the front eg Pagid or Mintex (C-tech 1144 < £50) and good brake fluid. This will make a huge improvement in bite and resistance to fade. (Ignore the people who tell you to go and buy a costly set of huge disks with 4 pot callipers, waste of money for track days, just get good pads).
2) Tyres - crap v's good tyres will make more difference to your lap time than anything. Ideally get a spare set of cheap rims (2nd hand alloys or even steel ones) and get the best set of tyres you can afford (try to save money and get a set of part worn slicks). EARS do good budget road legal slicks (Maxsport RB5), or if you can afford it get a set of Yokohama A048's or A032's.
3) get a 4 point harness fitted, this will hold you much better in your seat, you'll be surprised how much it helps! keep your existing seats and seat belt, all you need is 4 hoops bolted to the floor in the right places and you can clip your harness on when you get to the track. Clubmans Harness < £50, half an hour labour to fit the mountings.
4) Next step would be a better set of shocks springs but thats probably the next next step, start with 1,2 and 3!
I've done loads of track days in a variety of cars ranging from £500 Golf GTi's to full on Mitsubishi EVO's. Follow the above advice and you'll have fun without blowing you bank account or ruining your car's day to day road behaviour.
>> Edited by rallycross on Sunday 5th June 21:28
EG If you are at a Motor Sport events track day (very good place to start; www.motorsport-events.co.uk)
its only £30.
However, tuition only takes half an hour, and you'll soon pick it up so if you still then want to go and improve your car for the track without breaking the bank (or changing your insurance premium)here's where you should start:
1) Brakes - fit a set of fast road/track pads to the front eg Pagid or Mintex (C-tech 1144 < £50) and good brake fluid. This will make a huge improvement in bite and resistance to fade. (Ignore the people who tell you to go and buy a costly set of huge disks with 4 pot callipers, waste of money for track days, just get good pads).
2) Tyres - crap v's good tyres will make more difference to your lap time than anything. Ideally get a spare set of cheap rims (2nd hand alloys or even steel ones) and get the best set of tyres you can afford (try to save money and get a set of part worn slicks). EARS do good budget road legal slicks (Maxsport RB5), or if you can afford it get a set of Yokohama A048's or A032's.
3) get a 4 point harness fitted, this will hold you much better in your seat, you'll be surprised how much it helps! keep your existing seats and seat belt, all you need is 4 hoops bolted to the floor in the right places and you can clip your harness on when you get to the track. Clubmans Harness < £50, half an hour labour to fit the mountings.
4) Next step would be a better set of shocks springs but thats probably the next next step, start with 1,2 and 3!
I've done loads of track days in a variety of cars ranging from £500 Golf GTi's to full on Mitsubishi EVO's. Follow the above advice and you'll have fun without blowing you bank account or ruining your car's day to day road behaviour.
>> Edited by rallycross on Sunday 5th June 21:28
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