Discussion
DustyC said:
1. What are the requirements for trackdays?
2. What are the requirements for sprinting?
3. Where can I go to try one one and buy it on the South Coast (Hants area)?
1. Unfortunately, there is absolutely no scrutineering of helmets at all on UK trackdays. Some of the crap people turn up with makes you wonder whether there is anything worth protecting... After then seeing how they drive, I am convinced there isn't in several cases. 'All the gear and no idea' springs to mind...
2. Check out the RACMSA regs (the 'blue book')
3. Try one on locally that fits you (most important) and that you feel has adequate ventilation, etc, then buy one on line (grandprix racewaer, or alternatives. If you take this route, make sure you are buying a UK helmet, which has a BSI sticker (these are soon to be superceded by an EU reg. Check the Blue book for details)
Lovely.
I'm not sure that the GP racewear web site is any cheaper than the shops. Doing a search for helmets on this site will get you loads of threads on this topic.
I wend to GP racewear at Silverstone, and totally blew my budget. Not because I was being oversold to, but after trying the different alternatives, you can see why some are more expensive than others.
All of the helmets that they have will comply with either the BSI or SNELL standards - which will take you fairly high up the motorsports ladder. The differences are in fit and weight. BIS helmets are from £150 IIRC (with no VAT), SNELL, from around £225.
As always, buy the lightest and best fitting that you can afford.
I wend to GP racewear at Silverstone, and totally blew my budget. Not because I was being oversold to, but after trying the different alternatives, you can see why some are more expensive than others.
All of the helmets that they have will comply with either the BSI or SNELL standards - which will take you fairly high up the motorsports ladder. The differences are in fit and weight. BIS helmets are from £150 IIRC (with no VAT), SNELL, from around £225.
As always, buy the lightest and best fitting that you can afford.
Work out how much a track day costs to do! Most days on a circuit are £200ish track fee, add in road and track fuel, tyre wear, oils, pads etc, additional drivers or passengers, food and maybe accomodation and if you're realistic you're looking at, at least £450, up to around £600!
Do one day less in the year and put the money into a decent helmet... don't pay less than £300 for a helmet. You won't catch me in anything less than an Arai, either a GP Jet (open face) or a GP5. Although I sometimes use an open face for instructing, I don't recommend them,I've seen someone chin the steering wheel even with a full harness on, and it ain't pretty!
Arai's GP5K is probably the best compromise for track days. It's slightly heavier than the GP5 but much cheaper.
GP5 - £800.75 inc VAT
GP5K - £439.50 inc VAT
GP Jet - £329.00 inc VAT
Before anyone asks, yes I was sponsored by Arai, but I'm not anymore... and I still think they're the best!
Bike helmets are OK but you still won't get a decent one under £300.
Other good car helmet makes include Bell, Simpson, Stand 21, Sparco and Bieffe.
Do one day less in the year and put the money into a decent helmet... don't pay less than £300 for a helmet. You won't catch me in anything less than an Arai, either a GP Jet (open face) or a GP5. Although I sometimes use an open face for instructing, I don't recommend them,I've seen someone chin the steering wheel even with a full harness on, and it ain't pretty!
Arai's GP5K is probably the best compromise for track days. It's slightly heavier than the GP5 but much cheaper.
GP5 - £800.75 inc VAT
GP5K - £439.50 inc VAT
GP Jet - £329.00 inc VAT
Before anyone asks, yes I was sponsored by Arai, but I'm not anymore... and I still think they're the best!
Bike helmets are OK but you still won't get a decent one under £300.
Other good car helmet makes include Bell, Simpson, Stand 21, Sparco and Bieffe.
instructor said:
Do one day less in the year and put the money into a decent helmet... don't pay less than £300 for a helmet.
Absolute crap! Unless you are a professional driver
You really don’t need to pay that much for a lid! For on a bike maybe, but the only real difference in paying that little bit more is a slight improved fitment, and weight. This is crucial on a bike, as you don’t want the head to roll inside the helmet in the event of an accident, and so I never used to wear anything less than an Aria either, nor did I kit my Girlfriend out in anything less.
But your not talking about the need to fall off and hit tarmac, so save your money
instructor said:
You won't catch me in anything less than an Arai, either a GP Jet (open face) or a GP5. Although I sometimes use an open face for instructing, I don't recommend them, I've seen someone chin the steering wheel even with a full harness on, and it ain't pretty!
Fair words, you need to be a complete muppet to wear one of these.
The peek has snapped necks
The chin is exposed
No protection against shards of glass if any windows are smashed.
An experienced racer was killed at Truxton recently and the open faced helmet was partly to blame
instructor said:
Bike helmets are OK but you still won't get a decent one under £300.
They are not ok as they limit your peripheral view
If your strapped in you cant do many life savers as you do on a bike!
Have a look at the demon-tweaks catalogue. Go for a Sparco or an AGV helmet. As long as it has been FIA approved then you can assume it will take a beating if you crash.
Two things that are far better than buying an expensive helmet:
1. Use the chin strap, the helmet will fly off without it
2. You are supposed to replace it after a crash, bit more affordable if you've only paid £150 - £200.
In the event of a crash, and if your helmet hits the window or a roll cage then the foam lining dissipates the shock load and produces what feels like holes. These areas wont work twice, next time a large percentage of the shock will go straight through rather than radiate out around the helmet
instructor said:
Other good car helmet makes include Bell, Simpson, Stand 21, Sparco and Bieffe.
I am sure they are, but you don’t need to be in a Porsche to have a safe time on a track day.
I'm not sure that I necessarily agree here atom.
At the end of the day, even if you are just an occasional track driver - should you be unfortunately involved in an off, then you will see the same G's as professional race drivers. Many on here have cars that go much quicker than a lot of race machinery, with less dedicated high speed crash protection - even if the lap times are way off.
A heavier helmet will put more load on your neck for the same impact. FACT.
Also, even if you are only using the lid occasionally, comfort is still a factor. Track days are for enjoyment - I don't see how this can be helped by wearing a helmet that makes you miserable.
Everything is a compromise - and all of the helmets that a reputable store will sell you will be designed to one of two standards - so therefore will all be as strong as each other. However, there are other factors which affect safety.
Finally, BSI helmets tend to have larger visors, so help if you wear glasses, or want a little more vision. (Having said that, I wear glasses and still use a SNELL)
I wear an Arai GP5k and would recommend it whole heartedly for anyone with the same requirements as me! As has been said above - you don't need to go for a name, but you do have to be comfortable.
At the end of the day, even if you are just an occasional track driver - should you be unfortunately involved in an off, then you will see the same G's as professional race drivers. Many on here have cars that go much quicker than a lot of race machinery, with less dedicated high speed crash protection - even if the lap times are way off.
A heavier helmet will put more load on your neck for the same impact. FACT.
Also, even if you are only using the lid occasionally, comfort is still a factor. Track days are for enjoyment - I don't see how this can be helped by wearing a helmet that makes you miserable.
Everything is a compromise - and all of the helmets that a reputable store will sell you will be designed to one of two standards - so therefore will all be as strong as each other. However, there are other factors which affect safety.
Finally, BSI helmets tend to have larger visors, so help if you wear glasses, or want a little more vision. (Having said that, I wear glasses and still use a SNELL)
I wear an Arai GP5k and would recommend it whole heartedly for anyone with the same requirements as me! As has been said above - you don't need to go for a name, but you do have to be comfortable.
I had the same question last year. The last post has a link to a summary of the info I gleaned.
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=33441&f=13&h=0&hw=sprinting+helmet
My opinion after the research - don't buy a bike helmet, it's not designed optimally for the job, don't buy an open face design, go for the best spec, and try before you buy. I went for a Bell rather than an Arai as it fitted much better!
Have fun! I'm still yet to give sprinting a go....
Cheers,
Andy.
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=33441&f=13&h=0&hw=sprinting+helmet
My opinion after the research - don't buy a bike helmet, it's not designed optimally for the job, don't buy an open face design, go for the best spec, and try before you buy. I went for a Bell rather than an Arai as it fitted much better!
Have fun! I'm still yet to give sprinting a go....
Cheers,
Andy.
atom290 said:
Fair words, you need to be a complete muppet to wear one of these.
Does that turn Gronholm, Solberg and Panizzi into Beaker, Kermit and Miss Piggy then?
instructor said:
Bike helmets are OK but you still won't get a decent one under £300.
This is also crap, lots of ACU gold standard helmets can be had for under £300. One of the main differences between a bike a car lids is that car lids are generally nomex lined and hence fireproof. They are also made of slightly different material.
atom290 said:
They are not ok as they limit your peripheral view
If your strapped in you cant do many life savers as you do on a bike!
Call me strange, but I never doa life saver in a car. Personally I use my mirrors. You don't need to be strapped in as tight as Schumacher either, so a degree of movement is retained. Car lids actually have narrower apertures than most bike lids if you'd car to take a look at the diff between Arai's bike and GP range....
You should not be allowed out on circuit w/o having your chin strap done up. This is P1ss poor if the organisors do not insist on this, and would probably open them up to some serious liability claims in the event of an accident (despite their 'disclaimers' - which only go so far in law before negligence overrides their small print)
...more affordable .... It's your head. Wrap it in whatever you feel you should be wearing so as to afford the best protection...
fergus said:
Fair words, you need to be a complete muppet to wear one of these.
Does that turn Gronholm, Solberg and Panizzi into Beaker, Kermit and MissPiggy then?
I think the rallying names sound more like muppet names than the real muppet names!Especially Gronholm, can almost picture the muppet now!
atom290 said:
Absolute crap! Unless you are a professional driver
It's not crap! The more expensive helmets cost more because of their superior construction and the development that has gone into them to ensure they provide the best possible protection. Tarmac, ARMCO, railway sleepers, roll cages etc, do not dicriminate between the professional and amateur driver. That is the most ridiculous, dangerous, irresponsible drivel masquerading as advice I have ever heard!
Anyone else reading, take no notice of this moron, you only come with one head, don't save money, save your life!
Read this and reflect on it:
"There is hardly anything in the world that some men cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey.
It's unwise to pay too much, but it's more unwise to pay too little. When you pay too much you lose a little money, that's all.
When you pay too little you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing you bought it to do.
The common law of business prohibits paying a little and getting a lot - it can't be done. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it's well to add something for the risk you take. And if you do that, you will have enough to pay for something better."
John Ruskin - Poet and Writer (1819 ~ 1900)
Or perhaps this quote from Shakespeare:
"The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten!"
From The Merchant of Venice
Hear, hear.
When I kitted up for sprinting earlier this year, I looked at the prices of the stuff, gulped, and then thought "If you're hanging upside down, on fire, that's no time for false economy".
So, 3 layer Nomex, Nomex undies, gloves, boots & balaclava and a mid-range Bell helmet. Came to about £700 in total. You only need the suit and helmet for sprinting, but then we're back to false economy.
You might feel a bit of a knob kitted up like that on a track day, but you're going to be a bigger knob without it in the aforementioned fire. (Interestingly, at the briefing at the RMA day at Silverstone a few weeks ago, they were pushing race suits hard...) (I'm not the only one who feels like a knob, either - someone at Snetterton recently was wearing chinos & a sweat shirt, but when you got closer, he had Nomex long-johns on underneath!)
When I kitted up for sprinting earlier this year, I looked at the prices of the stuff, gulped, and then thought "If you're hanging upside down, on fire, that's no time for false economy".
So, 3 layer Nomex, Nomex undies, gloves, boots & balaclava and a mid-range Bell helmet. Came to about £700 in total. You only need the suit and helmet for sprinting, but then we're back to false economy.
You might feel a bit of a knob kitted up like that on a track day, but you're going to be a bigger knob without it in the aforementioned fire. (Interestingly, at the briefing at the RMA day at Silverstone a few weeks ago, they were pushing race suits hard...) (I'm not the only one who feels like a knob, either - someone at Snetterton recently was wearing chinos & a sweat shirt, but when you got closer, he had Nomex long-johns on underneath!)
fergus said:
someone at Snetterton recently was wearing chinos & a sweat shirt, but when you got closer, he had Nomex long-johns on underneath!)
How close did you get? It was only a t/day after all!!
Only close enough to talk to! Sparco long-johns have a roll-neck collar.
zumbruk said:
fergus said:
zumbruk said:
someone at Snetterton recently was wearing chinos & a sweat shirt, but when you got closer, he had Nomex long-johns on underneath!)
How close did you get? It was only a t/day after all!!
Only close enough to talk to! Sparco long-johns have a roll-neck collar.
I think you'll find that Sparco roll-neck tops have a roll-neck collar.
Sparco long johns cover an entirely different part of the body
Edited to say - damn - beaten to it
>> Edited by griff2be on Tuesday 29th June 12:59
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