My 1st S2000 and I want to tune it
Discussion
I have just recently purchase my 1st ever S2000 and loving it. Does anyone have any advise where to start if I was to make some slight tunning mods.
1st im thinking brakes, maybe Wilwoods...as they are reasonably prices
2nd induction Kit...will this actualy make much of a difference?
3rd Suspension. Lowering springs? or full coil over Kit?
Cheers
Alex
1st im thinking brakes, maybe Wilwoods...as they are reasonably prices
2nd induction Kit...will this actualy make much of a difference?
3rd Suspension. Lowering springs? or full coil over Kit?
Cheers
Alex
alexbakes said:
I have just recently purchase my 1st ever S2000 and loving it. Does anyone have any advise where to start if I was to make some slight tunning mods.
1st im thinking brakes, maybe Wilwoods...as they are reasonably prices
2nd induction Kit...will this actualy make much of a difference?
3rd Suspension. Lowering springs? or full coil over Kit?
Cheers
Alex
1. Unless going on track regularly, the brakes are best left alone, they do a great job and just about the best I've experienced on a road car.1st im thinking brakes, maybe Wilwoods...as they are reasonably prices
2nd induction Kit...will this actualy make much of a difference?
3rd Suspension. Lowering springs? or full coil over Kit?
Cheers
Alex
2. Just noise really. Some say traffic "kangarooing" is improved by this but in my experience, kangarooing is rare anyway. For a start, just remove the air box and experience the difference in sound. Whichever you do, you won't improve power (actually, you can lose power by some induction mods). Same goes for exhausts etc.
3. The car handles great as standard with very little body roll etc. lowering/mods etc. ultimately just make it ride worse (i.e too hard). Is there something about the handling you want to address? Doing a full geo works wonders on some cars.
Forget engine tuning (unless going the supercharger route) as Honda have done it all for you!
Edited by Dracoro on Friday 24th July 01:20
1)Standard brakes seem really good to me. Maybe a pad upgrade would help but why do you need Wilwoods or anything similar unless your racing it?
2)I've just taken the airbox lid off, sounds lovely and it's free.
3)I fitted Eibach Pro springs after a terrible experience with Apex. They make the car look much nicer in my opinion, and don't make the ride any worse. I've found that it's done the handling no harm either, but it seems to be frowned upon over on the S2000 forum. It's up to you.
If you are going to post on that forum be warned........it's full of rude keyboard warriors and 'experts' with no diplomacy, which is a shame, because those a
holes tend to drown out the good guys that will actually help you and give good advice.
2)I've just taken the airbox lid off, sounds lovely and it's free.
3)I fitted Eibach Pro springs after a terrible experience with Apex. They make the car look much nicer in my opinion, and don't make the ride any worse. I've found that it's done the handling no harm either, but it seems to be frowned upon over on the S2000 forum. It's up to you.
If you are going to post on that forum be warned........it's full of rude keyboard warriors and 'experts' with no diplomacy, which is a shame, because those a
holes tend to drown out the good guys that will actually help you and give good advice.
Hollywood Wheels said:
If you are going to post on that forum be warned........it's full of rude keyboard warriors and 'experts' with no diplomacy, which is a shame, because those aholes tend to drown out the good guys that will actually help you and give good advice.
Overstating the case a bit (I never found it any worse than PH is currently). I WOULD go on there for advice, but I'd read the advice carefully...holes tend to drown out the good guys that will actually help you and give good advice.1) Uprated pads will be fine unless you're using it heavily on track - I used DS2500's which improved both feel and stopping-power slightly. Could also fit braided hoses (not Goodridge...there's another brand out there which do aero stuff which have a better rep) - they do a very good job on my ITR!
2) A cold-air snorkel WILL improve drivability if you do suffer from the heat-soak 'kangarooing' that some cars seem to, but almost no induction kits provide any meaningful (>2/3/4bhp) gains, and (like the DC2) some actually cost the car power. A lot of the modding boys on s2ki go for exhausts rather than induction for power gains - one chap with a Jap single-pipe set-up saw a ~12bhp gain.
3) a) A good geometry set-up will make the world of difference to the handling for starters
(it did for mine - take it to a proper place, not a main dealer with e.g. a Hunter rig (which have quite large set-up tolerances and only need be checked every 9 or 12 months...))
b)and cross-braces help also
(lower-front is the best one, but upper-front complements it nicely and an uprated lower-rear doesn't hurt...I fitted all 3 at once and the car felt better 'tied down' and more predictable.)
...if that's still not enough, I think a couple of people on the forum have fitted nitrons with decent results...the only REAL problem with the suspension is that the rear-damping can get 'out of synch' over bumpy B-roads when pushing at REALLY illegal speeds - it then starts 'porpoising' slightly from side to side at the back. The bracing reduced mine but never fully cured it, which is why I think it's a damping issue...but you need to be going indecently quickly anyway to get it going.
...oh, and some people don't like the 'passive rear steer' set-up of the rear geometry (increased toe-in on compression at the rear...which means reduced toe-in on rebound...i.e. if you lift-off mid corner the outside rear will suddenly lose MORE grip (!!!) - cue oversteer!). I never found it a problem, as my style in the car was more 'fast-ish in, even faster out', and after the geometry and braces I found the handling to be quite predictable and manageable. You can get replacement parts (I forget which) to eliminate this also.
(Overall then, my advice is sort the geo, the cross-braces, and the brake pads first - the easy/cheap/insurer-friendly stuff first. THEN learn the car for a bit. THEN see what else needs doing...I stopped there with mine.
Finally, whatever you do DON'T talk to Mikey K, otherwise you'll find yourself ordering a supercharger kit!!!
My plan for tweaking the S to make it an ideal road car that is OK for some track day fun too has been so far:
Removed all suspension bolts, greased them and done a wheel alignment adding a tad more camber all round and rear toe in - they're prone to corroding solid meaning you can't adjust the suspension.
Fitted a home made box section steel rear subframe brace to replace the tinny Honda u-shaped one - this made a significant difference to the feel of the car, more readable on uneven surfaces. I might knock up a lower front brace too when there's time.
Keep the same calipers and brake lines, general consensus is they're more than up to the job. OE Honda pads are fine for the road, track action gets them too hot, especially the rears as I found out. So it's Ferodo pads all round on original discs until they expire, then some aftermarket discs that can manage the heat the Ferodos can generate better. Go for Motul or Castrol fluid. Brake ducts are a belt and braces option that should get a bit more cooling air to the discs which will always help.
Most of the stuff I've picked up from s2ki website. I feed it a really useful and lively place, an awesome bank of knowledge. People complain about being encouraged to use the search function on there, but there's so much stuff it makes sense to search first as often you can find the answers in a few moments with a little leg work.
Removed all suspension bolts, greased them and done a wheel alignment adding a tad more camber all round and rear toe in - they're prone to corroding solid meaning you can't adjust the suspension.
Fitted a home made box section steel rear subframe brace to replace the tinny Honda u-shaped one - this made a significant difference to the feel of the car, more readable on uneven surfaces. I might knock up a lower front brace too when there's time.
Keep the same calipers and brake lines, general consensus is they're more than up to the job. OE Honda pads are fine for the road, track action gets them too hot, especially the rears as I found out. So it's Ferodo pads all round on original discs until they expire, then some aftermarket discs that can manage the heat the Ferodos can generate better. Go for Motul or Castrol fluid. Brake ducts are a belt and braces option that should get a bit more cooling air to the discs which will always help.
Most of the stuff I've picked up from s2ki website. I feed it a really useful and lively place, an awesome bank of knowledge. People complain about being encouraged to use the search function on there, but there's so much stuff it makes sense to search first as often you can find the answers in a few moments with a little leg work.
foggy said:
done a wheel alignment adding a tad more camber all round and rear toe in...
How MUCH rear toe-in (because the Honda tolerances go from 10' to IIRC 40' - toe out at the rear is typically a BAD thing! ) - too much toe-in, combined with increased rear camber, will give you a car that is naturally very understeery and difficult to get the back out on.havoc said:
foggy said:
done a wheel alignment adding a tad more camber all round and rear toe in...
How MUCH rear toe-in (because the Honda tolerances go from 10' to IIRC 40' - toe out at the rear is typically a BAD thing! ) - too much toe-in, combined with increased rear camber, will give you a car that is naturally very understeery and difficult to get the back out on.Compared to standard Honda MY06 spec I went for increased camber by 30' all round (-1deg0' front and -2deg0' rear) standard front caster and toe (6deg0' and 0deg0' respectively) and 25' toe in on the rear which I think is higher than spec as the figures on the computer were green and then turned red as I increased the toe a little more (checking the paperwork original spec is 4' to 19' rear toe). Toe in is positive on the rear rather than negative as per the front as negative is actually toe out on the rear so I learnt when reading up!
Edited by foggy to put correct angles in once he'd checked the geo print out
Edited by foggy on Monday 27th July 17:39
That was pretty much my plan, not too hard on the inside edges of the tyres also.
The beauty of having a 4 wheel alignment rig tucked away in the workshop at work, I can go tweak it again whenever suits. It's not a quick job mind, took me the best part of 3 hours to get it all in position!
The beauty of having a 4 wheel alignment rig tucked away in the workshop at work, I can go tweak it again whenever suits. It's not a quick job mind, took me the best part of 3 hours to get it all in position!
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