Discussion
Thanks Mrflibbles, I’ll have another search. Had a read of your blog and it’s good to see your very happy with your S2000. I’m after one right now and look at one over the weekend. (not a GT). I don’t want a GT as can’t see the point in the hard top, but if tat is the only difference then not getting one.
I've also had 2 S2K's ..... both with hard tops.
Personally I am not bothered about having it.
I don't care for the looks with the HT on and though you do get far better vision out of the back it - in my mind - kind of defeats the object of having a convertible ! In winter you may not have the roof down very much at all, but on those lovely crisp clear days you could put the roof down the HT is in the way.....
My first HT squeaked but the current one is fine - you are either lucky with the fit or not.
Both my S2K's happened to be GT's at good prices so I got them. If they weren't GT's it wouldn't have bothered me one bit. There is one real downside to the GT that does cause a problem for me .... and that is having to store the HT 99% of the time in my garage - it does take up a fair bit of space on it's stand ....
Personally I am not bothered about having it.
I don't care for the looks with the HT on and though you do get far better vision out of the back it - in my mind - kind of defeats the object of having a convertible ! In winter you may not have the roof down very much at all, but on those lovely crisp clear days you could put the roof down the HT is in the way.....
My first HT squeaked but the current one is fine - you are either lucky with the fit or not.
Both my S2K's happened to be GT's at good prices so I got them. If they weren't GT's it wouldn't have bothered me one bit. There is one real downside to the GT that does cause a problem for me .... and that is having to store the HT 99% of the time in my garage - it does take up a fair bit of space on it's stand ....
havoc said:
Upsides:
- Stiffer structure...not huge but noticeable improvement in handling
How do you work that out? Same chassis, but more weight?? Surely that would hinder handling as the hardtop isn't actually attached to the chassis, just the body so the ridgidity is exactly the same????- Stiffer structure...not huge but noticeable improvement in handling
If I'm wrong, someone please explain.
JM-S2K said:
havoc said:
Upsides:
- Stiffer structure...not huge but noticeable improvement in handling
How do you work that out? Same chassis, but more weight?? Surely that would hinder handling as the hardtop isn't actually attached to the chassis, just the body so the ridgidity is exactly the same????- Stiffer structure...not huge but noticeable improvement in handling
If I'm wrong, someone please explain.
I guess the important question though is: Given you've not driven one with it on and off, how can you sit there and contradict me?!? I've 2 winters worth of experience of it, FFS!!!
As for weight...20-25kg, I reckon...2% penalty! Big deal...you'll gain as much from the improved aero.
MiloD said:
Newbie S2000 owner here, didn't go for a GT - no point... esp when you consider that if I had the hardtop it probably would have been on the car and I wouldn't have enjoyed two full days of top down sunny 
Well all going well will be collecting my (non GT as no where to store the hard top) S2000 on Saturday, can't wait, This is a going to be long week.bracken78 said:
MiloD said:
Newbie S2000 owner here, didn't go for a GT - no point... esp when you consider that if I had the hardtop it probably would have been on the car and I wouldn't have enjoyed two full days of top down sunny
Well all going well will be collecting my (non GT as no where to store the hard top) S2000 on Saturday, can't wait, This is a going to be long week.
Well done!
[quote=havoc
The hardtop attaches to the structure via two bolts, and is flat across the rear just in front of the boot...so it will act as an additional part of the monocoque.
I guess the important question though is: Given you've not driven one with it on and off, how can you sit there and contradict me?!? I've 2 winters worth of experience of it, FFS!!!
As for weight...20-25kg, I reckon...2% penalty! Big deal...you'll gain as much from the improved aero.
[/quote]
Yes body structure, not the chassis! Oh and how can something ADDITIONAL be part of a monocoque?
How have you come to the conclusion that I haven't driven an S2K with a hardtop on?
I can "contradict" (point out to) you that the hardtop wont aid handling as I have a knowledge of engineering and physics. The extra weight will (although very very negligable) hinder handling as weight has an input on how a car handles, where as aerodynamics doesn't have as much of an effect. I agree that the hardtop is probably better earodynamically than the soft top.
Its a pointless argument really as the difference with a hardtop on or off will be so small that none of us will notice! I simply wanted the OP not to expect a GT to handle any better/differently to a non GT!
The hardtop attaches to the structure via two bolts, and is flat across the rear just in front of the boot...so it will act as an additional part of the monocoque.
I guess the important question though is: Given you've not driven one with it on and off, how can you sit there and contradict me?!? I've 2 winters worth of experience of it, FFS!!!
As for weight...20-25kg, I reckon...2% penalty! Big deal...you'll gain as much from the improved aero.
[/quote]
Yes body structure, not the chassis! Oh and how can something ADDITIONAL be part of a monocoque?
How have you come to the conclusion that I haven't driven an S2K with a hardtop on?
I can "contradict" (point out to) you that the hardtop wont aid handling as I have a knowledge of engineering and physics. The extra weight will (although very very negligable) hinder handling as weight has an input on how a car handles, where as aerodynamics doesn't have as much of an effect. I agree that the hardtop is probably better earodynamically than the soft top.
Its a pointless argument really as the difference with a hardtop on or off will be so small that none of us will notice! I simply wanted the OP not to expect a GT to handle any better/differently to a non GT!
JM-S2K said:
Its a pointless argument really as the difference with a hardtop on or off will be so small that none of us will notice! I simply wanted the OP not to expect a GT to handle any better/differently to a non GT!
I know enough about cars to know that even if there was a difference in the way the two cars handle there is no way I will be able to tell, I'm not Michael.I'm no Schumacher either, but I CAN tell. The car, following fitment back in November, felt like it had more mechanical grip and a smoother progression at break-away. Same thing happened last winter.
That combination CAN'T be achieved through any incidental geometry change, therefore I can only attribute it to less body flex under load.
I'd consider reading up on the conversion of coupes to roadsters (e.g. Astons, 3-series, 911...), and the additional body strengthening that is required to restore at least some of the lost stiffness when the roof is cut-off. If THAT is widely accepted (and I can't see a car company wasting money doing it for no reason...), then why are you questioning the opposite effect?!?
Oh...and I'd read up on car design to go with your Physics if I were you...the only current mass-production car I'm aware of with both a chassis and a monocoque is the LR3 Discovery. Virtually all modern cars DO NOT HAVE A SEPARATE CHASSIS!
PistonHeads - Closed-mindedness Matters!
That combination CAN'T be achieved through any incidental geometry change, therefore I can only attribute it to less body flex under load.
I'd consider reading up on the conversion of coupes to roadsters (e.g. Astons, 3-series, 911...), and the additional body strengthening that is required to restore at least some of the lost stiffness when the roof is cut-off. If THAT is widely accepted (and I can't see a car company wasting money doing it for no reason...), then why are you questioning the opposite effect?!?
Oh...and I'd read up on car design to go with your Physics if I were you...the only current mass-production car I'm aware of with both a chassis and a monocoque is the LR3 Discovery. Virtually all modern cars DO NOT HAVE A SEPARATE CHASSIS!
PistonHeads - Closed-mindedness Matters!
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