Will the S2000 go down as a truly great car?
Discussion
It’s a truly great roadster.
Fairly basic (not many toys or options - focussed on the driving) and yet sophisticated (fully adjustable double wishbones all round and THAT engine).
It’s character is in its engine and interior. Apart from (arguably) the electric roof and fancy dash it doesn’t have anything it doesn’t need. What it does have I guess it needed to elevate beyond the MX5 and compete with the Boxster.
I think given it had a ten year run virtually unchanged they got it pretty much right.
Fairly basic (not many toys or options - focussed on the driving) and yet sophisticated (fully adjustable double wishbones all round and THAT engine).
It’s character is in its engine and interior. Apart from (arguably) the electric roof and fancy dash it doesn’t have anything it doesn’t need. What it does have I guess it needed to elevate beyond the MX5 and compete with the Boxster.
I think given it had a ten year run virtually unchanged they got it pretty much right.
I drove one on a very memorable tour of some very fantastic roads. I didn’t like the digital dash (strangely I’ve grown to love the one in my Abarth - guess the S2000 was ahead of the curve and I wasn’t ready) but apart from that it was close to perfect.
It handled superbly, it was happy enough going slowly but it came alive when given the opportunity. What an engine!
It handled superbly, it was happy enough going slowly but it came alive when given the opportunity. What an engine!
APontus said:
Porsche.
Most of the people which changed from S2000s to Boxster Ss (and there were a few when I was an owner) seemed to regret it. The general sentiment was that the Porsche (and I expect this applies to most models) was the better platform - but it was also less engaging/satisfying as a driving experience. "Truly great" - not sure - but many ex-owners (including myself) regret selling, and would like to see a new offering from Honda which doesn't deviate to greatly from the original design/ethos.
It was a memorable period at Honda - the ATR, CTR, NSX and the S2000.
Koolkat969 said:
I'm guessing you mean the Porsche Boxster as the previous poster has mentioned.
I don't think the test reports at the time match your statements however.
My recollection was that the Boxster repeatedly beat the S2000 in roadtests sure to the Honda having poor EPAS and a snappy chassis.I don't think the test reports at the time match your statements however.
I'm sure they'll be the odd outlier but that appeared to be the consensus.
It did, it's there in black and white....
But in the real world however.....
I've owned both, 987.2 boxster from New for 3.5 years (and a 987.1 cayman before it), before getting bored. It's a great car, extremely competent in every department, but it's just missing that thing that makes it joyous.
The s2000 (a 56 plate, so with most of the suspension revisions and a electronic throttle) I'm into my 8th year now and it still makes me smile whenever I drive it, it has that little extra undefinable something, yes if youndiaectbthe components the epas isn't great, but it's enough and the package as a whole is truly great...
S.
But in the real world however.....
I've owned both, 987.2 boxster from New for 3.5 years (and a 987.1 cayman before it), before getting bored. It's a great car, extremely competent in every department, but it's just missing that thing that makes it joyous.
The s2000 (a 56 plate, so with most of the suspension revisions and a electronic throttle) I'm into my 8th year now and it still makes me smile whenever I drive it, it has that little extra undefinable something, yes if youndiaectbthe components the epas isn't great, but it's enough and the package as a whole is truly great...
S.
I drove a Boxster briefly a while before I bought my first S2000, so it was not meant to be a direct comparison - I don't recall much about the Porsche but it was better in the steering and handling areas.
Equivalent spec Boxsters were about £10k more than the Honda at the time from memory - I'm sure if Honda had invested more in the design and charged Porsche money for it it would have handled and steered just as well - but then everyone may well just have bought the "premium" German product if it cost the same.
I think the Honda was "great" for the money - handling was not as bad as made out, but perhaps the steering let it down enough not to be "truly great".
As it happens, I had a lot more fun driving the S2000 than I ever have driving my Evora, the steering and handling of which pi$$ all over the Honda as you would expect.
Equivalent spec Boxsters were about £10k more than the Honda at the time from memory - I'm sure if Honda had invested more in the design and charged Porsche money for it it would have handled and steered just as well - but then everyone may well just have bought the "premium" German product if it cost the same.
I think the Honda was "great" for the money - handling was not as bad as made out, but perhaps the steering let it down enough not to be "truly great".
As it happens, I had a lot more fun driving the S2000 than I ever have driving my Evora, the steering and handling of which pi$$ all over the Honda as you would expect.
Olivera said:
No. Good drivetrain, but arguably not great as the engine is pretty gutless below 5000rpm. It also has early 'zero feel' EPAS, and the handling wasn't entirely resolved from the factory.
Time and time again this tripe is trotted out. It just isn’t gutless below 5000rpm.As for the OP saying Honda didn’t bother to develop it, it’s quite the opposite. As an example of an undeveloped car it’s a bad example.
I realise this makes me sound like a crazed fanboy but one of these things is perception and one of them is not correct at all.
Edited by F20CN16 on Sunday 30th May 18:13
F20CN16 said:
Time and time again this tripe is trotted out. It just isn’t gutless below 5000rpm.
How much power does it make at 4k and 5k rpm? Sub 100bhp and 125bhp?I think I'm being complementary in saying it's an exciting engine that makes decent numbers *if* you're prepared to rev it to the red line. However compared to any turbo car or larger capacity engined sports car (Boxster) you can make the argument that below 6k rpm performance is woeful.
Olivera said:
How much power does it make at 4k and 5k rpm? Sub 100bhp and 125bhp?
I think I'm being complementary in saying it's an exciting engine that makes decent numbers *if* you're prepared to rev it to the red line. However compared to any turbo car or larger capacity engined sports car (Boxster) you can make the argument that below 6k rpm performance is woeful.
I agree that a comparison against a larger capacity engine would result in some disappointment, most likely. Depends on what one determines as gutless! It’s about 140bhp at 5000rpm. I guess it’s all perception. My car shifts along very nicely at 5000rpm, and I’m happy to rev it out to 8000+ as the car is used for fun on nice days. The power “curve” is very linear, but there’s a misconception that the power massively increases at VTEC switchover.I think I'm being complementary in saying it's an exciting engine that makes decent numbers *if* you're prepared to rev it to the red line. However compared to any turbo car or larger capacity engined sports car (Boxster) you can make the argument that below 6k rpm performance is woeful.
I think a lot of perspective is lost with the s2000 due to its top end power figure of 230+bhp.. It somewhat punches above its weight, and therefore gets put alongside the big guns.
If you were to simply think of it as a 2.0 NA, your mind would be able to reconcile the fact that it's performance is pretty decent with the bonus that it's over 100bhp/litre and revs to 9k.
Admittedly I sold mine as I wanted something that didn't need to have its neck wrung to keep up with turbocharged motors of the same era.
But in isolation, what a machine. A v6 version would have been legendary.
If you were to simply think of it as a 2.0 NA, your mind would be able to reconcile the fact that it's performance is pretty decent with the bonus that it's over 100bhp/litre and revs to 9k.
Admittedly I sold mine as I wanted something that didn't need to have its neck wrung to keep up with turbocharged motors of the same era.
But in isolation, what a machine. A v6 version would have been legendary.
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