What Honda Engine To Use?
Discussion
We are currently in the middle of having our 1986 Honda Civic restored. The plan was to give it a modern engine with more power BUT with an automatic gearbox. The car will be a GT, not a lairy track monster.
Plan was to use a H22 from a MK4 Prelude (BB1) however they are thin on the ground. I even had a look in Japan whilst I was out there on holiday and couldn’t find anything.
I know most people would say B18 or K20 but neither have an auto option. Are there any alternatives? The K24 from a Accord is on the shortlist, 188bhp with scope to extract a few more horses. Can pick a donor Accord up for under a grand.
Plan was to use a H22 from a MK4 Prelude (BB1) however they are thin on the ground. I even had a look in Japan whilst I was out there on holiday and couldn’t find anything.
I know most people would say B18 or K20 but neither have an auto option. Are there any alternatives? The K24 from a Accord is on the shortlist, 188bhp with scope to extract a few more horses. Can pick a donor Accord up for under a grand.
A Civic as a GT?? Well each to their own. 
Left field. Rover KV6. Yes it isn’t a Honda engine. But Rover and Honda has ties on other projects, so there is a tentative link. He engine is also available easily in the U.K. and is compact and lightweight as well as a good performer. Has Honda worthy high end power but also lovely low and mid range grunt which would suit the character of a GT car. They also easily fit the pg1 gearbox which I think has Honda origins.
Left field. Rover KV6. Yes it isn’t a Honda engine. But Rover and Honda has ties on other projects, so there is a tentative link. He engine is also available easily in the U.K. and is compact and lightweight as well as a good performer. Has Honda worthy high end power but also lovely low and mid range grunt which would suit the character of a GT car. They also easily fit the pg1 gearbox which I think has Honda origins.
Orcadian said:
K20A4 fitted to 2nd Gen CR-V has Auto option
Ian
Cheers, shall add it to the shortlist Ian
300bhp/ton said:
A Civic as a GT?? Well each to their own.
Left field. Rover KV6. Yes it isn’t a Honda engine.
I meant more in the sense of a comfortable cruiser, in the same way that my old ISFs were comfy cars with the ability to make progress thanks to the sizeable V8.Left field. Rover KV6. Yes it isn’t a Honda engine.
I know of the Rover Honda link, owned a few D series engined Rovers but this engine needs to be a Honda and ideally one that can be liberated from a donor car with ancillaries to make it easier. Saves buying a standalone ecu etc.
In an ideal world I would suggest a B16A from an 1996-2000 Civic EK4 SiR, These are quite common but only in Japan unfortunately, usually some knocking around at auction, So you would have to import an engine or full car. I would also keep a look out for people breaking Del Sol SiR's on eBay and other channels if your are interested in the 1.6, A few auto versions of these made it across with the B16A as well.
A revvy 1.6L DOHC VTEC with 170ps would suit the car's character more than the rest IMO.
DC5 Integra Type S' are quite common with Auto's as well, K20 2.0 170PS, But again, not many in UK.
A revvy 1.6L DOHC VTEC with 170ps would suit the car's character more than the rest IMO.
DC5 Integra Type S' are quite common with Auto's as well, K20 2.0 170PS, But again, not many in UK.
ooo a third gen build! Get a thread up for it.
As for engine choices, unless your very handy with fabrication stuff a k swap is gunna be difficult, even when theyre done the ground clearance is poor, and the bonnet doesnt shut due to the inlet manifold.
B16/B18/B20 is a plug and play, mounts readily available job... youll have to convert the fuel system to take it though.
Easy option is d series, d16z6 is around 150hp, can be had for pennies and goes really well in a third gen, my 180hp stripped out EK couldnt get near a friends d16 third gen.
If it were me doing it, id fancy the b18c (from a dc2 integra), or a b16 with an S80 short ratio lsd gearbox (again from an integra).
ETA: I didnt read the whole auto thing!
a stock B20 from a CRV uses the same mounts as other b series engines, has more torque and can use an auto box, then when you get bored, stick a vtec head on it and let it rev!
As for engine choices, unless your very handy with fabrication stuff a k swap is gunna be difficult, even when theyre done the ground clearance is poor, and the bonnet doesnt shut due to the inlet manifold.
B16/B18/B20 is a plug and play, mounts readily available job... youll have to convert the fuel system to take it though.
Easy option is d series, d16z6 is around 150hp, can be had for pennies and goes really well in a third gen, my 180hp stripped out EK couldnt get near a friends d16 third gen.
If it were me doing it, id fancy the b18c (from a dc2 integra), or a b16 with an S80 short ratio lsd gearbox (again from an integra).
ETA: I didnt read the whole auto thing!
a stock B20 from a CRV uses the same mounts as other b series engines, has more torque and can use an auto box, then when you get bored, stick a vtec head on it and let it rev!
There is a thread running on the car already.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
We both have lots of history with D16s, I grew up on a steady diet of Rover 216/416s including a couple of twin cam 416 GTIs, as well as an EG civic esi with the z6 that loved to rev.
My vote is for the d16z6 much as I’d love a B or H series I think the auto gearbox issue will be too much to overcome.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
We both have lots of history with D16s, I grew up on a steady diet of Rover 216/416s including a couple of twin cam 416 GTIs, as well as an EG civic esi with the z6 that loved to rev.
My vote is for the d16z6 much as I’d love a B or H series I think the auto gearbox issue will be too much to overcome.
Pretty sure the Auto from an accord (K24) will fit. K20, the K24 bottom end certainly goes together with a K20 head and all fits on the K20 box.
Or a 5th gen Lude with the Tiptronic box (185bhp H22A7) is a good shout, Tiptonic is a little bit fragile though.
4th gen lude got a 2.3 SOHC auto in JDM cars too I think.
Accord also got a 3.0 V6 auto, would sound pretty decent too.
Or a 5th gen Lude with the Tiptronic box (185bhp H22A7) is a good shout, Tiptonic is a little bit fragile though.
4th gen lude got a 2.3 SOHC auto in JDM cars too I think.
Accord also got a 3.0 V6 auto, would sound pretty decent too.
Cheers for the suggestions folks.
Only issue here is that I rang a Honda engine conversion specialist who basically laughed and told me that unless I had very very deep pockets there was no point in contemplating an engine swap and to just leave it as stock.
According to him the H22 won’t fit and anything else will be cumbersome. Seems post 87 cars are easier but an 86 is a different story. He discussed how a B series would require a standalone ecu and mapping as it’s never been done with an autobox before.
That leaves us in a strange position. Someone who is seemingly an authority when it comes to Civic engine conversions says it can’t be done!
Only issue here is that I rang a Honda engine conversion specialist who basically laughed and told me that unless I had very very deep pockets there was no point in contemplating an engine swap and to just leave it as stock.
According to him the H22 won’t fit and anything else will be cumbersome. Seems post 87 cars are easier but an 86 is a different story. He discussed how a B series would require a standalone ecu and mapping as it’s never been done with an autobox before.
That leaves us in a strange position. Someone who is seemingly an authority when it comes to Civic engine conversions says it can’t be done!
The KV6 suggestion is an interesting one, it's a fairly nice engine (well, the early ones were appallingly poorly put together, but I suspect they're all long vanished now), a cheap Rover 75 auto would give you everything you need in a package, and you can chop up the subframe etc to build a custom one for what you require.
Whether it'll fit is another question, but they're pretty compact, and they went in the 45/ZS ok, so it's not outside the realms of possibility.
In such a small/light car, however, even a fairly mundane 4-pot is going to have some poke, so I wouldn't get too hung up about it. On the contrary, you can go too far - a while back, a guy on another forum I'm on put a fairly potent turbo engine in an 80s Civic, from memory it was something ridiculous like 500 bhp. He had to swap it into a mk6 as it was literally pulling the shell apart, cracking panel joins etc.
Whether it'll fit is another question, but they're pretty compact, and they went in the 45/ZS ok, so it's not outside the realms of possibility.
In such a small/light car, however, even a fairly mundane 4-pot is going to have some poke, so I wouldn't get too hung up about it. On the contrary, you can go too far - a while back, a guy on another forum I'm on put a fairly potent turbo engine in an 80s Civic, from memory it was something ridiculous like 500 bhp. He had to swap it into a mk6 as it was literally pulling the shell apart, cracking panel joins etc.
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