Secondhand emtb - brand with least 'risk' of battery/motor?

[Hugo Stiglitz]

Any that are OK or just focus on one's with the least miles covered and factor in 500-700£ as a back up for a motor or battery death?

[bobbo89]

I think whatever you buy you're throwing caution to the wind as none of them are without their potential issues. I've heard people say Bosch are the most reliable but the other day I was reading a thread where a guy was saying he was on his 4th Bosch motor!

I bought an ex-demo Vitus e-Sommet last year and so that came without any sort of warranty, Shimano ep8 motor and I don't want to jinx anything but so far, other than it throwing a speed sensor error that was sorted by some electrical cleaner on the connectors, it's been fine.

[President Merkin]

That guy's an outlier though. Bosch have a good reputation in general. Most brands don't extend warranties beyond the original owner, which imo is scandalous but a different conversation, so work out the risk you're willing to take.

[leyorkie]

Look at the deals available on last year’s model’s and there’s really no need to go used as sellers expect top dollar for their bikes

[NorthDave]

I've had a new Shimano ep8 motor under warranty buy the bike shop reckoned it's the first they've done. They've replaced 4 or 5 Bosch motors though.
Not sure if it's just the quantity out there or something else but I was very glad mine was covered under warranty!!

[stanlow45]

Would’ve thought the battery was most risk given replacement costs and who knows how it’s been previously treated, stored and charged. Never had an issue with my Yamaha motor in thousands of miles but that’s a sample of one. What I do find though is the number of new chains, cassettes and brake pads it seems to chew through is quite considerable but maybe that’s just me.

[Hugo Stiglitz]

What bike is it in?

Chains and cassettes can age very quickly with inconsiderate shifts under torque and of course Roding regularly in low gears and using the power of the motor to overcome the poor gear choices! Whereas normally your legs wouldn't be able to start pedalling on a non ebike. True?

[bobbo89]

FWIW, when I was buying mine I did a little bit of research and found various people (some who run e-bike rental companies) saying that with any e-bike motor the proof is within the first 250 or so miles. Suggestion was that problems tend to occur early on and so once a motor has a few miles under its belt it can be trusted as a solid unit.

How much truth there is in that I've no idea, I'm a bit of a veteran when it comes to bikes but very much a newbie to e-bikes and so I'm learning as I go.

[leyorkie]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

What bike is it in?

Chains and cassettes can age very quickly with inconsiderate shifts under torque and of course Roding regularly in low gears and using the power of the motor to overcome the poor gear choices! Whereas normally your legs wouldn't be able to start pedalling on a non ebike. True?

If you can’t turn the pedals on a none e-bike then you can’t turn the same gear on an e-bike. The pedals have to turn to provide the “ASSISTANCE “ unless you are looking at something else with an electric motor and a throttle 👎

[Hugo Stiglitz]

No I mean when I rode a ebike I'd look down and I'd often be in one of the hardest gears and not notice - I rarely sat in the biggest cog.

On a normal bike you'd bloody know it.

[P-Jay]

There's a learning curve with ebikes I've found, I've had to really increase my cadence to get the motor to work well, but I can still pull offer in a pretty high gear, as long as I can get half a crank it, it'll go. IME wear and tear is a lot higher, I'm riding twice as far as before, so double mileage (obvs) add to that, higher speeds and more torque going through the drivetrain. A lot of my riding friends are going through lots of brake pads too.

Personally, and I spoke to a lot of riders and bike shops before I chose my e-bike, I wouldn't look at a S/H e-bike unless it was cheap. It's still not quite a mature technology and I don't think they like British winters very much, the general feeling from people I've spoken to is "they all go wrong, buy based on Warranty service". Spesh seem to be the best in this regard, at least locally. The local Spesh dealer has a cupboard full of motors and batteries, they will have you out in an hour and deal with the paperwork later. With Shimano you're at the mercy of Madison, and I've heard some horror stories. Mate of mine is trying to chase them now to replace his dead EP8, bike shop told him about another customer, switched his EP8 to another region that doesn't have the 25Kph limit, not tuned, not de-restricted, just not UK road compliant. Madision voided his warranty and won't even supply him a replacement.

So, for me. I'll only buy new, and I won't mess about with it. I couldn't take the risk on buying a S/H ebike, especially given so many people derestrict them.

[PushedDover]

President Merkin said:

That guy's an outlier though. Bosch have a good reputation in general. Most brands don't extend warranties beyond the original owner, which imo is scandalous but a different conversation, so work out the risk you're willing to take.

Me or the Bike an Outlier? :/

As per just mentioned in the 'Other' ebike thread. - I've a Cube HT, and bought the same for my Wife. Her's Fine. Mine, problematic.
But it seems a shorting cable somewhere may be the culprit?

Still - I bought a Bosch Cannondale today because at 85Nm, and 750W battery and the price point - I feel it is a solid / best option.

[President Merkin]

PushedDover said:

Me or the Bike an Outlier? :/

Not for me to say is it? All I've ever pointed out is five motors in what, three years? is highly unusual by any measure. Do you regularly clean & regrease the outer seals? Do you frequently submerge the motor in water, clean the bike with a jet washer? These are all apposite questions. If it were me, I'd want to know why I was burning through motors, if for no other reason than being without a usable bike repeatedly. I would certainly be asking the dealer for answers at the very least.

[OutInTheShed]

Failures of Bosch motors under warranty don't seem to be unusual.
A couple of people on our local facebrick page have had more than one fail.

[PushedDover]

I have some diagnosis outputs and discussions with Bosch on going
Seems a short…..

[President Merkin]

Do you mean a short cicuit in the wiring loom? In which case I would be irritated with the dealer for simply warrantying motor after motor without at least trying to get to the root cause.

[PushedDover]

We now know looking at the diagnosis from the last motor and the current motor they look very similar / same:




LBS mech thinks / believes that this indicates a short somewhere causing it. Why or how it has reappeared after 13 mo. And 1,900mi of riding is confusing obviously

LBS rang me yesterday to say they’ve spoken and tried to work with Bosch. Bosch say the last motor was a goodwill exchange - carries no warranty with it.
After pressing apparently, they are willing to meet a 50:50 contribution, which equates to me paying £350 for a new motor.
I am not sure a) they can be right that goodwill (especially as the receipt for it says Warrsnty claim number) can carry no warranty on it,
b) they will move on price,
c) more importantly, if I spend the money (and a purchased motor would now ironically carry a warranty for 2 years), if I have a short in the wiring architecture, inherent in the bike and the cause of the failures, I’ll be better off over time

With this raised, Bosch said speak to Cube - I can’t see this making much difference, as they have no idea on any of this - zero contact to date and will say ‘you bought it 4 years ago. Foxtrot Oscar.’

[Hugo Stiglitz]

How do you wash the bike usually?

For me. Everything down there can't be 100% sealed.

[President Merkin]

I would definitely at least speak to Cube, you have a long history with the bike & nothing to lose by doing so. On the wiring loom, there is not actually that much to them. It only connects a controller, a battery, a speed sensor & a motor. Plus a light if fitted. If you did decide to go with another motor, it wouldn't be that spendy to either swap the faulty loom or even better, the faulty wire or controller to cure the issue for good. A Purion or a Kiox can be had for about £80..

If you remove the battery & see how it all runs, it becomes obvious. A couple of wires run down the top of the down tube from the controller & battery & another runs along the chain stay from the speed sensor & the three meet at the motor. They're actually fairly rudimentary set ups well within the capability of a decent LBS.

[PushedDover]

As always over the four years.
If loose surface mid hose it off, otherwise leave it until a proper wash once a months with a sponge / brush.

Said to the LBS and I stand by it, bike has never seen a jet wash or focused hosing on the motor area.

And he said he does same or worse