EMTB - an owners honest thoughts
Discussion
OK I took the plunge. Its been 6 months so far.
My new Bird AM9 frame arrives today. I'll probably ride that more.
Why?
It feels like a numb, dull experience on the ebike (a decent one Orbea Rise H15). I can go a whole ride and not bother with any food or drink water.
Descents even when I'm launching off something takes extra effort that I think meh.
It's solid on descents which removes that sketchiness that I love. That feeling off on the limit whoa and subsequent grin.
Yes I can climb on it but tempered with this I'm in eco mode most of the time watching the damn battery bars. Causing anxiety.
Lifting it anywhere, yes it is a light ebike is still annoying. My sons Nukeproof Scout hardtail feels fun and dangerous on descents by comparison. I love it!
Ebikes make you just as fit as you ride further.
That's rubbish. Like I said you hardly break a sweat. I rode the Hope Circuit last weekend and didn't need to drink any water on a warm sunny day.
Finally there is the battery issues. Yep after about 1000miles it can lead you with no power and resale values are low unless you've plainly never used it.
My new Bird AM9 frame arrives today. I'll probably ride that more.
Why?
It feels like a numb, dull experience on the ebike (a decent one Orbea Rise H15). I can go a whole ride and not bother with any food or drink water.
Descents even when I'm launching off something takes extra effort that I think meh.
It's solid on descents which removes that sketchiness that I love. That feeling off on the limit whoa and subsequent grin.
Yes I can climb on it but tempered with this I'm in eco mode most of the time watching the damn battery bars. Causing anxiety.
Lifting it anywhere, yes it is a light ebike is still annoying. My sons Nukeproof Scout hardtail feels fun and dangerous on descents by comparison. I love it!
Ebikes make you just as fit as you ride further.
That's rubbish. Like I said you hardly break a sweat. I rode the Hope Circuit last weekend and didn't need to drink any water on a warm sunny day.
Finally there is the battery issues. Yep after about 1000miles it can lead you with no power and resale values are low unless you've plainly never used it.
It's horses for courses mate. I still ride a non-ebike and I can't see myself going for an eeb anytime soon. My brother, on the other hand, has an ebike and loves it. They totally have their place for some people.
It's amazing the swing of ebikes to non-ebikes over the last 3 years. I would say the majority of bikes I see where I ride are now electric.
It's amazing the swing of ebikes to non-ebikes over the last 3 years. I would say the majority of bikes I see where I ride are now electric.
Scoobyshue said:
It's amazing the swing of ebikes to non-ebikes over the last 3 years. I would say the majority of bikes I see where I ride are now electric.
Yes. Only ride on the road where ebikes are certainly a lot more popular now. But I would say majority I see are still pushbikes. Was out walking in the Surrey Hills last weekend however, and for every 1 MTB there were prob 3 eMTBs. They have exploded in popularity it seems.
I do have an e-bike (DIY hybrid conversion) but I prefer riding regular bikes tbh. E-bike handy for shops etc, but security an issue. Have to lug 3kgs of battery everywhere you go off the bike which limits practicality.
I have a spesh ebike. I hate the thing as it's been very unreliable.
However, you may get more enjoyment out of yours if you view them as fundamentally different to a normal bike.
Mine is essentially a DH bike, and I agree they're a bit numb DH and require a lot of body English to wrestle around. But there is a lot of fun to be had finding previously unclimbable climbs and attacking those. Even on full power some of my local ones are just as exhausting to climb as easier climbs on an analogue bike.
Also, they offer the ability to sneak in a post dinner ride, where feeling as full as a fat man's sock, would previously mean stopping to burp up some sick.
Further, the twice as many DH runs in a very limited time window can also make the difference between pedal, and beer and sofa.
Whilst I'm not a fan, they do have a solid use case.
However, you may get more enjoyment out of yours if you view them as fundamentally different to a normal bike.
Mine is essentially a DH bike, and I agree they're a bit numb DH and require a lot of body English to wrestle around. But there is a lot of fun to be had finding previously unclimbable climbs and attacking those. Even on full power some of my local ones are just as exhausting to climb as easier climbs on an analogue bike.
Also, they offer the ability to sneak in a post dinner ride, where feeling as full as a fat man's sock, would previously mean stopping to burp up some sick.
Further, the twice as many DH runs in a very limited time window can also make the difference between pedal, and beer and sofa.
Whilst I'm not a fan, they do have a solid use case.
I used to ride a lot and haven't for 10 years so I keep looking at eBikes as a way of getting back to enjoying riding enough to build fitness again, basically a 'temporary' fitness compensator. I haven't bought one yet because I have 5 bikes it could replace so what to get? I did nearly bike to work a Gravel ebike a few weeks ago, but couldn't find a supplier on my scheme.
I sorta think if you're riding good MTB trails in a compact area so you don't need the motor to get you through the boring link trails quickly you can have that experience - the weight takes the fun off the descents and you're climbing so fast that you're not able to get wrecked on the climbs so you lose that too.
My only experience on an eBike was taking my Mum's up Whinlatter pass, it was exhausting because it was so fun going up there at speed that I thrashed myself keeping it over 12mph all the way. The battery controller packed in on the way back though, so that was fun!
The road bikes seem to make sense for commuting or if you have only a small local network of nice quiet roads, or if the area is just too hilly for you, very much a range extender, but difficult to really get the most out of it in most circumstances as you'll be on the limiter too much unless you chip it.
Gravel bikes probably make the most sense I'd think, most people don't have endless miles of gravelly trails locally, so you can bring more nice paths into play. You're not aiming at the best descents, so the weight isn't a problem and you'll be more able to use the motor to travel faster while still working just as hard, so you get the fitness effect and very much just gain a larger network of trails. Plus a little extra speed makes a lot of those sorts of trails flow nicely. (And they're quiet trails so no one would notice if you derestricted and boosted your network a bit more.....)
I'm not convinced enough to pull the trigger yet, but if I keep riding all year I'll probably buy either a really nice gravel bike or a mediocre eGravel bike next year. I have a 1,000ft climb out of the door over 10 miles to the top of a big hill that has loads of lovelly gravel trails disappearing off to the otherside of the country if you want, so I can see that halving the climb time would give me loads of options. But against that the same money buys a lovely lovely bike and it's only 10 mins in the car to the top. I couldn't make my mind up, so as a compromise I bought a nice bike rack for the car and will use that to expand my network for now....
I sorta think if you're riding good MTB trails in a compact area so you don't need the motor to get you through the boring link trails quickly you can have that experience - the weight takes the fun off the descents and you're climbing so fast that you're not able to get wrecked on the climbs so you lose that too.
My only experience on an eBike was taking my Mum's up Whinlatter pass, it was exhausting because it was so fun going up there at speed that I thrashed myself keeping it over 12mph all the way. The battery controller packed in on the way back though, so that was fun!
The road bikes seem to make sense for commuting or if you have only a small local network of nice quiet roads, or if the area is just too hilly for you, very much a range extender, but difficult to really get the most out of it in most circumstances as you'll be on the limiter too much unless you chip it.
Gravel bikes probably make the most sense I'd think, most people don't have endless miles of gravelly trails locally, so you can bring more nice paths into play. You're not aiming at the best descents, so the weight isn't a problem and you'll be more able to use the motor to travel faster while still working just as hard, so you get the fitness effect and very much just gain a larger network of trails. Plus a little extra speed makes a lot of those sorts of trails flow nicely. (And they're quiet trails so no one would notice if you derestricted and boosted your network a bit more.....)
I'm not convinced enough to pull the trigger yet, but if I keep riding all year I'll probably buy either a really nice gravel bike or a mediocre eGravel bike next year. I have a 1,000ft climb out of the door over 10 miles to the top of a big hill that has loads of lovelly gravel trails disappearing off to the otherside of the country if you want, so I can see that halving the climb time would give me loads of options. But against that the same money buys a lovely lovely bike and it's only 10 mins in the car to the top. I couldn't make my mind up, so as a compromise I bought a nice bike rack for the car and will use that to expand my network for now....
I follow a chap on Youtube (Old Northern eMTBer) who has a Rise as well as a Wild like mine. He seems to have a continual problem with the battery running out on the Rise. I suspect a Wild would not address any of your other issues with an eMTB because it's heavier but at least I've never had range anxiety on it with the 625Wh battery.
For my lazy butt, an eMTB means I get out when I wouldn't otherwise, but I don't use it for bike park stuff; it's for exploring. Lifting isn't at all pleasant so I stick to the bridleways which are legal and they all have gates so not an issue. I am glad I didn't go for one of the lite eMTBs like the Rise which came out around the time I bought because it wouldn't have suited my use.
I did find when out last year with a riding mate on a normal bike that my fitness had massively improved compared to his; that can only be because I'd been out on my eMTB without him (since he hadn't bought one). So it does improve fitness even though you might not feel it.
For my lazy butt, an eMTB means I get out when I wouldn't otherwise, but I don't use it for bike park stuff; it's for exploring. Lifting isn't at all pleasant so I stick to the bridleways which are legal and they all have gates so not an issue. I am glad I didn't go for one of the lite eMTBs like the Rise which came out around the time I bought because it wouldn't have suited my use.
I did find when out last year with a riding mate on a normal bike that my fitness had massively improved compared to his; that can only be because I'd been out on my eMTB without him (since he hadn't bought one). So it does improve fitness even though you might not feel it.
Edited by Jobbo on Thursday 4th May 08:47
People are certainly voting with their wallets, last data I saw has gravel & eebs s the only growth areas in the UK bike market. It's probably worth remembering buying an ebike today probaby puts you in the vanguard/early adopter category.
A Rise is about 17kg, a comparable enduro/trail bike is typically 13-15kg, always lighter but the progress on weight amongst the 'lighter' ebikes in the past few years is remarkable. The pace & intensity of competition will drive innovation, I reckon we're only a few years from parity in weight through battery & motor advances & if that occurs, the dilemma for the rider will become what they want from an ebike bike that is all but indivisble from a normy on paper, As it stands today, the answer seems to be longer, more frequent rides & E bikes offer that.
A Rise is about 17kg, a comparable enduro/trail bike is typically 13-15kg, always lighter but the progress on weight amongst the 'lighter' ebikes in the past few years is remarkable. The pace & intensity of competition will drive innovation, I reckon we're only a few years from parity in weight through battery & motor advances & if that occurs, the dilemma for the rider will become what they want from an ebike bike that is all but indivisble from a normy on paper, As it stands today, the answer seems to be longer, more frequent rides & E bikes offer that.
President Merkin said:
People are certainly voting with their wallets, last data I saw has gravel & eebs s the only growth areas in the UK bike market. It's probably worth remembering buying an ebike today probaby puts you in the vanguard/early adopter category.
A Rise is about 17kg, a comparable enduro/trail bike is typically 13-15kg, always lighter but the progress on weight amongst the 'lighter' ebikes in the past few years is remarkable. The pace & intensity of competition will drive innovation, I reckon we're only a few years from parity in weight through battery & motor advances & if that occurs, the dilemma for the rider will become what they want from an ebike bike that is all but indivisble from a normy on paper, As it stands today, the answer seems to be longer, more frequent rides & E bikes offer that.
Yeah, stuff like the Fazua bottom bracket drive motors look really really good. The battery and motor assembly just slides out of the downtube to leave you with a nice light bike, that might have sub-optimal gearing, but it's a decent step in the right direction. The trade-off is reduced torque and battery capacity, but range extenders are an option. I think they can dial in whatever torque and battery capacity you want if they move the motor to the seat tube and that would really make a difference because spending so much money you really want to be able to tune the weight vs performance to suit you and your riding.A Rise is about 17kg, a comparable enduro/trail bike is typically 13-15kg, always lighter but the progress on weight amongst the 'lighter' ebikes in the past few years is remarkable. The pace & intensity of competition will drive innovation, I reckon we're only a few years from parity in weight through battery & motor advances & if that occurs, the dilemma for the rider will become what they want from an ebike bike that is all but indivisble from a normy on paper, As it stands today, the answer seems to be longer, more frequent rides & E bikes offer that.
President Merkin said:
A Rise is about 17kg, a comparable enduro/trail bike is typically 13-15kg,
The Rise is more like 20kg rather than 17kg; my Wild is 24kg. I've seen a few full-fat eMTBs launched this year getting down to 21kg so I would hope the lite eMTBs might get down towards 17kg, but they aren't there yet.Jobbo said:
The Rise is more like 20kg rather than 17kg; my Wild is 24kg. I've seen a few full-fat eMTBs launched this year getting down to 21kg so I would hope the lite eMTBs might get down towards 17kg, but they aren't there yet.
Is it? Ok, I don't run one, just looked it up on Google. Personally I'm smoking around on Focus Jam2, which is a big old unit at 24kg. I like it though, smashes through everything with reassuring stability. Horses for courses.https://bikerumor.com/2023-orbea-rise/
That's puff for the new 2023 Rise which I haven't yet seen an independent review of, in its lightest form; if that's what the OP has I apologise for assuming otherwise. Orbea preferred not to quote weights previously but for the updated 2023 Rise and Wild, they're trumpeting some pretty serious weight reductions if they're real.
There's a review here of the 2023 Rise M-Ltd which says it weighs 18.8kg with the larger 540Wh battery: https://enduro-mtb.com/en/orbea-rise-m-ltd-2023-re... - not bad.
There's a review here of the 2023 Rise M-Ltd which says it weighs 18.8kg with the larger 540Wh battery: https://enduro-mtb.com/en/orbea-rise-m-ltd-2023-re... - not bad.
Well I had my first ride on my new (to me) Vitus E Sommet yesterday and I think it's incredible. Started as just a local shake down ride to find any problems and get the suspension set-up but ended up looping all over the place linking together all the local sections of single-track and fun downhilly bits.
It's very different from riding a regular bike, not as poppy, fun, flickable or chuckable but it's planted AF, super stable and just motors through stuff. Did 95% of the ride in eco mode and only dropped 1 bar out of the 4 in just over 2 hours of riding. Nipping to the shop on it afterwards was fun too, stuck it in boost, was quicker than using the car and didn't have the hassle of parking.
It'll never replace a normal bike IMO as the riding you're doing is different and you're enjoying it for different reasons. I kind of feel like on an E you're more directing the bike into going where you want it to whereas a normal bike you're actually riding it, if that makes sense... It's definitely got a place in my garage and I'm going to love having it but it'll never replace my Cotic fully or Marino hardtail, they're going nowhere.
Main issue I found was the weight which round where I live most rides involve a few stiles and fences that need the bike lifting over which is a pain.
It's very different from riding a regular bike, not as poppy, fun, flickable or chuckable but it's planted AF, super stable and just motors through stuff. Did 95% of the ride in eco mode and only dropped 1 bar out of the 4 in just over 2 hours of riding. Nipping to the shop on it afterwards was fun too, stuck it in boost, was quicker than using the car and didn't have the hassle of parking.
It'll never replace a normal bike IMO as the riding you're doing is different and you're enjoying it for different reasons. I kind of feel like on an E you're more directing the bike into going where you want it to whereas a normal bike you're actually riding it, if that makes sense... It's definitely got a place in my garage and I'm going to love having it but it'll never replace my Cotic fully or Marino hardtail, they're going nowhere.
Main issue I found was the weight which round where I live most rides involve a few stiles and fences that need the bike lifting over which is a pain.
Edited by bobbo89 on Thursday 4th May 10:03
President Merkin said:
Is it? Ok, I don't run one, just looked it up on Google. Personally I'm smoking around on Focus Jam2, which is a big old unit at 24kg. I like it though, smashes through everything with reassuring stability. Horses for courses.
https://bikerumor.com/2023-orbea-rise/
Yep, I had a similar weight YT Decoy 29 and it was fun in many ways, particularly at BPW where you didn't need the smelly bus! Sold it as tennis took over most of my cycling time! I was a little nervous about Shimano motor longevity too...https://bikerumor.com/2023-orbea-rise/
I don’t get them but have no issue with people who use them.
Round here, I see mainly youngsters or 40 something blokes on them.
I also see some older friends use e road / Gravel bikes.
I’m 53, I’ll sick with leg power for no even if that means me struggling up the steeper hills in South Wales.
Round here, I see mainly youngsters or 40 something blokes on them.
I also see some older friends use e road / Gravel bikes.
I’m 53, I’ll sick with leg power for no even if that means me struggling up the steeper hills in South Wales.
When I ride my road bike I basically aim to do as much climbing per mile as I can and couldn't be less interested in riding back down the hills. My routes are basically do I want to do lots of small hills or a few big hills, so I end up with about 120-150ft per mile. An eBike would make the hills easier, the effect is flattening the hills, which is the opposite of how I design my rides, so it makes no sense if you like a good climb.
They make sense as a range extender, but that gets blunted by the 15mph speed limit and you're turning short-blasts into longer rides, which may not work with the time you have available.
They make sense if you want to blast up climbs because you're out to enjoy the descents on your mountain bike too, so less focus on fitness, more on fun. For me I think the only option that makes sense is a gravel bike that's derestricted so I can loop in a wider range of trails in the time I have available.
Another thing that's holding me back is that I have 5 really nice bikes, the industry has decimated the value of my mountain bikes by convincing everyone that the wrong size wheels are what you need, so if I really really enjoyed eGravel I'll have 6 really nice bikes and 5 that I don't ride and aren't worth selling!
They make sense as a range extender, but that gets blunted by the 15mph speed limit and you're turning short-blasts into longer rides, which may not work with the time you have available.
They make sense if you want to blast up climbs because you're out to enjoy the descents on your mountain bike too, so less focus on fitness, more on fun. For me I think the only option that makes sense is a gravel bike that's derestricted so I can loop in a wider range of trails in the time I have available.
Another thing that's holding me back is that I have 5 really nice bikes, the industry has decimated the value of my mountain bikes by convincing everyone that the wrong size wheels are what you need, so if I really really enjoyed eGravel I'll have 6 really nice bikes and 5 that I don't ride and aren't worth selling!
Oh, another thing I'll add is that whilst out yesterday it was windy AF and because of the E it wasn't a problem. That's one of the reasons I wanted one as round my way it gets blowy AF up tops which often knocks all motivation to get out. 15-20mph winds low level are common which when you're at 500m+ they're actually clipping 30mph+ which is grim!
Pedalled into to some fair head winds yesterday and the motor completely took the sting out of it.
Pedalled into to some fair head winds yesterday and the motor completely took the sting out of it.
paulrockliffe said:
When I ride my road bike I basically aim to do as much climbing per mile as I can and couldn't be less interested in riding back down the hills. My routes are basically do I want to do lots of small hills or a few big hills, so I end up with about 120-150ft per mile. An eBike would make the hills easier, the effect is flattening the hills, which is the opposite of how I design my rides, so it makes no sense if you like a good climb.
I would dispute that. The hill that takes you ten minutes to climb is going to take me four. I am going to rack up multiples of the vertical than you in the same ride if that's the aim. It's a myth ebikes make for lazy riders, there is plenty of research that shows ebikers ride longer, further and higher than their normy brethren.https://www.bicycling.com/news/a28819663/e-bike-fi...
Broadly agree OP, I only really ride mine in the winter as a mud chugger, or on holidays with my wife. For me it's an entirely different experience from an analogue bike, and that's my approach to it's use.
I find my analogue bike loads more fun to ride, loads more control in the air and just generally a more gratifying experience.
I run my eeb in Eco or Tour most of the time to try and get my heart working harder, but it's no where near the same work out.
I find my analogue bike loads more fun to ride, loads more control in the air and just generally a more gratifying experience.
I run my eeb in Eco or Tour most of the time to try and get my heart working harder, but it's no where near the same work out.
Edited by trails on Thursday 4th May 10:50
Interesting to see some honest opinions of e mtb bikes. I've been slated on here for saying similar stuff in the past. I took the plunge and bought one on a whim in a black friday sale - its a great bike and i enjoy it very much but my fitness has taken a knock big time even though i'm doing near on double the miles on the emtb (600 on it alone since Jan). I am still riding the HT mtb, but finding hills I used to enjoy climbing up a right old struggle these days.
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