gravel and road bike in one Help please
Discussion
Ok so I’ve been getting into cycling more and more, as has my good mate. He is looking at a full on road bike. I however want a gravel.
So my plan is this, a gravel bike and a spare set of wheels and tyres to make a road bike when I want.
Questions below.
1. Can it be done ?
2. would it be in the same ball park performance wise as an out and out road bike when in road mode ?
3. I will definitely want a gravel bike with 2 front gears, more like a rode set up I assume ?
4. My money spend is the 3k or under mark ( I’d like that to include spare wheels if possible)
5. Anything you recommend and why ?
Thanks.
So my plan is this, a gravel bike and a spare set of wheels and tyres to make a road bike when I want.
Questions below.
1. Can it be done ?
2. would it be in the same ball park performance wise as an out and out road bike when in road mode ?
3. I will definitely want a gravel bike with 2 front gears, more like a rode set up I assume ?
4. My money spend is the 3k or under mark ( I’d like that to include spare wheels if possible)
5. Anything you recommend and why ?
Thanks.
1. Yes
2. Kind of depends on rider and bike, there are variations of gravel bikes, some closer to MTBs, some closer to Road bikes, if you were a fit decent rider riding flat out a proper road bike would be quicker , otherwise not much in it. Too many variables
3. Yes, but watch out you might end up with 20 pages of 1 x setup vs 2
4. Thats a decent amount of money, stock levels are low for bikes across country
2. Kind of depends on rider and bike, there are variations of gravel bikes, some closer to MTBs, some closer to Road bikes, if you were a fit decent rider riding flat out a proper road bike would be quicker , otherwise not much in it. Too many variables
3. Yes, but watch out you might end up with 20 pages of 1 x setup vs 2
4. Thats a decent amount of money, stock levels are low for bikes across country
I have a gravel bike - Cannondale Topstone 105. I have upgraded the wheels and fitted Schwalbe G-One tyres which roll fine on the road but can feel a little draggy at times. I have ridden on some gravel tracks and light trails and this present setup has done me fine. I predominantly ride on the road and have considered a second set of (carbon) wheels (or fit road tyres to my current DT Swiss and use the originals for gravel) but have resisted the temptation to spend £ again. The G-One tyres don't wear particularly well, I think I got about 2,500 miles out of the rear and the replacement that I fitted earlier in the summer is starting to wear so I think I will look elsewhere come replacement time. Setting them up tubeless was a breeze though with a standard track pump.
I've always been a fan of the Specialized Diverge but the spec' is stingy when compared to other brands but for your budget, you could get a carbon Diverge. Another option would be the Mason Bokeh which is highly thought of, or if you're after outright speed, maybe the Cervelo Aspero which is basically a race bike that can take fatter tyres. I don't think it has mudguard mounts if that's a consideration. Other more road orientated options could be the Trek Domane which can take fat tyres and would probably do both road and gravel rather well and the Giant Revolt which appears to be a gravel version of the road endurance Defy bike.
The only downside of the one bike fits all approach if you're using gravel gearing, is you might spin out on steep downhills. I can end up peddling like a mad man and hit 40+ mph but I'm not interested in outright speed and the 40/30 gearing suits my tired legs when going up hill!
I've been more than happy with my gravel bike and like the ability to turn down a forest track and the 38mm tyres more than cope with the pothole ridden crap roads near me.
I've always been a fan of the Specialized Diverge but the spec' is stingy when compared to other brands but for your budget, you could get a carbon Diverge. Another option would be the Mason Bokeh which is highly thought of, or if you're after outright speed, maybe the Cervelo Aspero which is basically a race bike that can take fatter tyres. I don't think it has mudguard mounts if that's a consideration. Other more road orientated options could be the Trek Domane which can take fat tyres and would probably do both road and gravel rather well and the Giant Revolt which appears to be a gravel version of the road endurance Defy bike.
The only downside of the one bike fits all approach if you're using gravel gearing, is you might spin out on steep downhills. I can end up peddling like a mad man and hit 40+ mph but I'm not interested in outright speed and the 40/30 gearing suits my tired legs when going up hill!
I've been more than happy with my gravel bike and like the ability to turn down a forest track and the 38mm tyres more than cope with the pothole ridden crap roads near me.
My gravel bike has road gearing anyway, 52/36 and 11-32.
I switch to carbon wheels with road tyres but I have done road rides with gravel tyres on and they are ok but a bit more of a workout.
I also change pedals to road ones as the pedals and shoes are more comfortable for long distances.
Ultimately it's a little slower than my road bike, which has a more extreme position and is a few kgs lighter but it is brilliant for long rides.
It takes proper mudguards as well, which are well worth it if you ride with groups or commute in the winter.
I switch to carbon wheels with road tyres but I have done road rides with gravel tyres on and they are ok but a bit more of a workout.
I also change pedals to road ones as the pedals and shoes are more comfortable for long distances.
Ultimately it's a little slower than my road bike, which has a more extreme position and is a few kgs lighter but it is brilliant for long rides.
It takes proper mudguards as well, which are well worth it if you ride with groups or commute in the winter.
I'm fairly new to the gravel/road bike thing but my 2p...
I have the above mentioned carbon Specialized Diverge and it is very good IMHO (though I have little with which to compare it) and doable for <3k. The people I ride with have road bikes, the serious ones I would have no chance of keeping up with on anything, and the less serious ones I have no issues keeping up, even with the gravel tyres. I am running 1X. I know Yorkshire is lumpy but so far I have been ok, and my riding has been in the South of France and Northumberland, so not exactly flat. With a wide rear cassette I get near to 1:1 which is decent enough for most climbs. It spins out about 40kph on the flat which is fast enough for me (coming from more of a MTB background). If both you and your mate are relatively new to cycling I don't think there will be a huge gulf in performance between the two types of bike. Besides, with a gravel bike you can save loads of time taking all the interesting shortcuts!
I have the above mentioned carbon Specialized Diverge and it is very good IMHO (though I have little with which to compare it) and doable for <3k. The people I ride with have road bikes, the serious ones I would have no chance of keeping up with on anything, and the less serious ones I have no issues keeping up, even with the gravel tyres. I am running 1X. I know Yorkshire is lumpy but so far I have been ok, and my riding has been in the South of France and Northumberland, so not exactly flat. With a wide rear cassette I get near to 1:1 which is decent enough for most climbs. It spins out about 40kph on the flat which is fast enough for me (coming from more of a MTB background). If both you and your mate are relatively new to cycling I don't think there will be a huge gulf in performance between the two types of bike. Besides, with a gravel bike you can save loads of time taking all the interesting shortcuts!
After 8 or so years of roadbikes (and 15 MTB before that), and ~1 year of a 'gravel' bike, I'm about to take the plunge and sell the roadbike. It's great for up to about 3hrs of going hard, but I keep taking the gravel bike because it's a sight more comfortable for long/easier paced stuff, especially as I'm getting old and fat.
Definitely get 2 sets of wheels. I'm inclined to suggest that the folks who think 40mm tyres roll well have a) swallowed too much cool aid, and b) haven't much experience of skinny slicks.
Otherwise, yes. My budget 'interim' bike (tiagra topstone temporary replacement for the nicked kinesis 'cos I couldn't get what I wanted in time for my hols) is a good 2kg heavier than the roadbike. Subjectively feels a lot less sharp (probably why more comfy), and I wouldn't race on it, but realistically I do the same rides with the same people and a lot less whining. I may suffer a little bit more on the climbs, but compared to the amount of extra padding I carry, it's negligible. Could probably take a kg out of it without too much spend too.
Definitely get 2 sets of wheels. I'm inclined to suggest that the folks who think 40mm tyres roll well have a) swallowed too much cool aid, and b) haven't much experience of skinny slicks.
Otherwise, yes. My budget 'interim' bike (tiagra topstone temporary replacement for the nicked kinesis 'cos I couldn't get what I wanted in time for my hols) is a good 2kg heavier than the roadbike. Subjectively feels a lot less sharp (probably why more comfy), and I wouldn't race on it, but realistically I do the same rides with the same people and a lot less whining. I may suffer a little bit more on the climbs, but compared to the amount of extra padding I carry, it's negligible. Could probably take a kg out of it without too much spend too.
i was put off the 2 sets of wheels idea, one for gravel and one for road, because someone mentioned different wear levels between the cassette and chain.
say i do 3000km on the road wheels and 500km on the gravel wheels in a year, the wear on the chain and the cassette will be greater on the road set, switch to the gravel wheels and the wear on the chain is mismatched to the cassette.
is that actually a thing and how will it affect the ride?
say i do 3000km on the road wheels and 500km on the gravel wheels in a year, the wear on the chain and the cassette will be greater on the road set, switch to the gravel wheels and the wear on the chain is mismatched to the cassette.
is that actually a thing and how will it affect the ride?
^^ Indeed, CX bikes are generally a more roadish geometry whereas gravel is less racy (albeit pretty subtle IMO)
campionissimo said:
i was put off the 2 sets of wheels idea, one for gravel and one for road, because someone mentioned different wear levels between the cassette and chain.
say i do 3000km on the road wheels and 500km on the gravel wheels in a year, the wear on the chain and the cassette will be greater on the road set, switch to the gravel wheels and the wear on the chain is mismatched to the cassette.
is that actually a thing and how will it affect the ride?
IMO this falls under the sounds beliveable, but is mostly nonsense category. Your cassette wears totally differently to your chain anyway, and at a different rate. It's also the insides of the joints (rollers, pins) that wear, not the outside (where it bears on the cassette). I tend to go about 3 chains to a cassette (roughly), and not convinced the cassettes are dead at that; most say at least 2 chains to a cassette, unless they're trying to rip you off. If you've got a direct drive trainer you have the same problem anyway. Probably do double that spread between the trainer, race wheels, training wheels and two bikes. Replace chains whenever marginal 'cos 105/kmc equivalent are not expensive, and run 105 cassettes. Simply not an issue.say i do 3000km on the road wheels and 500km on the gravel wheels in a year, the wear on the chain and the cassette will be greater on the road set, switch to the gravel wheels and the wear on the chain is mismatched to the cassette.
is that actually a thing and how will it affect the ride?
Barchettaman said:
I’d be looking for a nice CX bike with rim brakes and get a second (matching) wheelset.
50/34 up front, long cage rear mech, and 11-28 cassette on the road wheelset, 12-32 on the gravel wheelset.
Something like that.
If I had different cassette would gear still change ok on each cassette 50/34 up front, long cage rear mech, and 11-28 cassette on the road wheelset, 12-32 on the gravel wheelset.
Something like that.
So long as the cassetes are both individually compatible with the drivetrain (i.e. same number of speeds, and type), and installed correctly (right spacers etc), yes. You shouldn't need adjustment if that's what's on your mind.
Chain sizing - not sure I've heard of small-small? I always use the 'round the biggest chainring, the biggest sprocket on the cassette without going through the rear derailleur, and pick the shortest length that actually overlaps' method - maybe we mean the same thing. Either way, the chain should be properly sized for the 'longest' combination, and it will likely not give problems on the smaller. You should probably avoid the extreme small/small and large/large combinations anyway!
Chain sizing - not sure I've heard of small-small? I always use the 'round the biggest chainring, the biggest sprocket on the cassette without going through the rear derailleur, and pick the shortest length that actually overlaps' method - maybe we mean the same thing. Either way, the chain should be properly sized for the 'longest' combination, and it will likely not give problems on the smaller. You should probably avoid the extreme small/small and large/large combinations anyway!
Barchettaman said:
I’d be looking for a nice CX bike with rim brakes and get a second (matching) wheelset.
50/34 up front, long cage rear mech, and 11-28 cassette on the road wheelset, 12-32 on the gravel wheelset.
Something like that.
It's 2020, you'll have a job finding a brand new CX bike with rim/cantilever brakes - unless you go to premium bike builder. 50/34 up front, long cage rear mech, and 11-28 cassette on the road wheelset, 12-32 on the gravel wheelset.
Something like that.
I replaced a road bike with a gravel bike, but admittedly I'm a Mtb rider at heart. Road/gravel is just easier to get riding time in without travelling. I find the gravel bike quicker for me. The roads I tend to ride are urban if commuting and tight lanes if out training. I'm not much of a fan of bigger roads so the gravel bike means rough surfaces don't slow me down at all. I know I have the grip to stop on the lanes and urban I can hop up the kerb if I ever need to
upsidedownmark said:
So long as the cassetes are both individually compatible with the drivetrain (i.e. same number of speeds, and type), and installed correctly (right spacers etc), yes. You shouldn't need adjustment if that's what's on your mind.
Chain sizing - not sure I've heard of small-small? I always use the 'round the biggest chainring, the biggest sprocket on the cassette without going through the rear derailleur, and pick the shortest length that actually overlaps' method - maybe we mean the same thing. Either way, the chain should be properly sized for the 'longest' combination, and it will likely not give problems on the smaller. You should probably avoid the extreme small/small and large/large combinations anyway!
The small-small method is what Shimano currently specifies.Chain sizing - not sure I've heard of small-small? I always use the 'round the biggest chainring, the biggest sprocket on the cassette without going through the rear derailleur, and pick the shortest length that actually overlaps' method - maybe we mean the same thing. Either way, the chain should be properly sized for the 'longest' combination, and it will likely not give problems on the smaller. You should probably avoid the extreme small/small and large/large combinations anyway!
Use the small chainring/smallest cassette sprocket in combination, make the chain the shortest possible length that it is not sagging (that is, the jockey cage is just starting to take tension) and then set the chain at that length. Run thru the various cog / chainwheel combinations and confirm that you have enough chain and that shifting is good. Sometimes too much chain tension will inhibit shifting to a smaller cog.
No one rule covers all possibilities, but this approach yields good results in most cases and with a long cage RD is guaranteed to work in the above situation.
Here's another 2c worth...
I've been riding a Norco Search for about 4 years, over a complete mix of terrain and surfaces, from smooth Tarmac to rocky, rooty singletrack. Its suited me perfectly.
Gearing is 2x11 Shimano 105 with 50/34T chainrings with an 11-32 cassette. Never found wanting. Except when trying to get up a hill that was mostly sand. But on the road, its been fine for cruising with groups and for having a blast on my own. My local area means that a 50km ride will take in about 700m of climbing, so I'm aware of gearing, tyres, wheels and brakes. Its comfy for 100km+
Tyres/wheels is perhaps trickier, and I can't be arsed to change wheels according to what or where I might ride, especially as I often change my mind mid ride, so I've compromised on the tyres. Something with a decent centre that will allow fast rolling at higher pressures, with some light knobbly bits around the shoulders to help when you lower the pressures and give it some stick.
Current pair are both 35mm and are a Clement XPlor USH on the front, with a Schwalbe Marathon on the back. 90psi on the road and around 40-50 for off-road. One puncture in 4 years, even if it did take three tubes to fix, but that's something else.
Wheels are mtb 29er spec 23mm AlexRims with 15mm thru axles. Bit chunkier than pure road wheels, but its just extra training on the road, and they don't fall apart at the sight of rocks. I get them tightened a couple of times a year, whereas the original 17mm rims lasted about 6 months before needing to be completely respoked.
Its not the lightest or prettiest bike out there. But it will get you to and from most places, at a decent lick, regardless of surface. It has taken a hell of a bashing over that time, and doesn't seem to be falling apart yet. I just need the legs to keep up!
I've been riding a Norco Search for about 4 years, over a complete mix of terrain and surfaces, from smooth Tarmac to rocky, rooty singletrack. Its suited me perfectly.
Gearing is 2x11 Shimano 105 with 50/34T chainrings with an 11-32 cassette. Never found wanting. Except when trying to get up a hill that was mostly sand. But on the road, its been fine for cruising with groups and for having a blast on my own. My local area means that a 50km ride will take in about 700m of climbing, so I'm aware of gearing, tyres, wheels and brakes. Its comfy for 100km+
Tyres/wheels is perhaps trickier, and I can't be arsed to change wheels according to what or where I might ride, especially as I often change my mind mid ride, so I've compromised on the tyres. Something with a decent centre that will allow fast rolling at higher pressures, with some light knobbly bits around the shoulders to help when you lower the pressures and give it some stick.
Current pair are both 35mm and are a Clement XPlor USH on the front, with a Schwalbe Marathon on the back. 90psi on the road and around 40-50 for off-road. One puncture in 4 years, even if it did take three tubes to fix, but that's something else.
Wheels are mtb 29er spec 23mm AlexRims with 15mm thru axles. Bit chunkier than pure road wheels, but its just extra training on the road, and they don't fall apart at the sight of rocks. I get them tightened a couple of times a year, whereas the original 17mm rims lasted about 6 months before needing to be completely respoked.
Its not the lightest or prettiest bike out there. But it will get you to and from most places, at a decent lick, regardless of surface. It has taken a hell of a bashing over that time, and doesn't seem to be falling apart yet. I just need the legs to keep up!
Edited by PomBstard on Monday 28th September 08:03
1. Yes
2. Depends, but probably yes (it is in my case). The main watch-out is weight if you find that affects your road speed a great deal. A decent gravel bike will be maybe 1.5kg heavier than a similarly-specced road bike. My 3T Exploro comes in at 9kg+ on 700c Fulcrum 4s with GP5000s, SRAM Force bits and some bolt-on tat. Heavier on 650s with 38mm tyres.
3. That is more like a road set-up, for sure, and I can see why it would seem appealing if you're fussed about gapping or the extreme ratios. But the longer I run 1x (and I have been for a couple of years now) the less it bothers me. The gaps seemed awful at first, but I got used to them in six months. Currently I'm using 46 chainring and 11/36 cassette, so pretty road focused, but the biggest gear doesn't get used much other than downhill and the smallest gear is an arse-ache off-road. Could easily go 12/42 at the back, or to a 42 at the front to give better gravel capability without caning my road pace all that much though.
4. No idea what £3k buys in the UK, but it sounds like a decent budget. Once again though, look at the weight.
5. Haha ... of course, a 3T Exploro. Why? Because that's what I chose (duh!). Seriously though, just like any other bike choice, buy the one that fits you. The Exploro is quite stretched out, so if you have short arms and long legs it probably won't work all that well for you. Otherwise, I can recommend the Focus Paralane and Specialized Diverge, both of which are comparatively light and work really well in road configuration.
k
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