Tubeless set up question.
Discussion
I’m setting up some tubeless wheels for the first time.
I have some new tubeless ready wheels (Mavic Carbon Cosmic Pros) that have never been on the road.
I have some new tubeless tyres (Conti 5000 TLs).
I have some new Tubeless valves (Lezyne cnc tlr valves)
I have some Tubeless gunk (Stans).
I wasn’t too sure on how it all goes together and heard that the Contis can be a bugger to get on to the wheels so thought I’d assemble without the gunk to check.
I think I’ve done everything correctly but the tyre doesn’t hold pressure.
I put the wheel on a water bath and there are no big leaks (ie tyre is seated correctly all the way round and the valve looks to have a good seal) but all the way around the tyre wall there are literally thousands of tiny bubbles, which if I wipe off reappear.
This to me suggests that the wall of the tyres aren’t airtight so I’m wondering if this is normal and that when I put the gunk in for the first time it actually seals the tyre.
Also the gunk says don’t pour through a valve but pour into the tyre and then seat the tyre.... will it be ok to do this or once the tyre is on you can’t take it off/put it back on?
I have some new tubeless ready wheels (Mavic Carbon Cosmic Pros) that have never been on the road.
I have some new tubeless tyres (Conti 5000 TLs).
I have some new Tubeless valves (Lezyne cnc tlr valves)
I have some Tubeless gunk (Stans).
I wasn’t too sure on how it all goes together and heard that the Contis can be a bugger to get on to the wheels so thought I’d assemble without the gunk to check.
I think I’ve done everything correctly but the tyre doesn’t hold pressure.
I put the wheel on a water bath and there are no big leaks (ie tyre is seated correctly all the way round and the valve looks to have a good seal) but all the way around the tyre wall there are literally thousands of tiny bubbles, which if I wipe off reappear.
This to me suggests that the wall of the tyres aren’t airtight so I’m wondering if this is normal and that when I put the gunk in for the first time it actually seals the tyre.
Also the gunk says don’t pour through a valve but pour into the tyre and then seat the tyre.... will it be ok to do this or once the tyre is on you can’t take it off/put it back on?
I tried a set of tubeless tyres for the first time recently.
Both tyres went on very easily. Both tyres pretty much seated themselves and inflated with a track pump.
The first wheel was leaking air all over the place, just little leaks. I put the Sealant (Stans) in through the valve and pumped it up again. A little bit of sealant was visible on the rim from one pinhole leak. I gave it a good shake and spin and left it overnight, the next day the tyre had gone down a bit.
With the second tyre on the other wheel I couldn't hear any air leaking at all.
I've done a few commutes and a few longer rides both tyres have behaved exactly the same and I've only pumped the tyres up once in a month.
I'm really impressed with them.
Both tyres went on very easily. Both tyres pretty much seated themselves and inflated with a track pump.
The first wheel was leaking air all over the place, just little leaks. I put the Sealant (Stans) in through the valve and pumped it up again. A little bit of sealant was visible on the rim from one pinhole leak. I gave it a good shake and spin and left it overnight, the next day the tyre had gone down a bit.
With the second tyre on the other wheel I couldn't hear any air leaking at all.
I've done a few commutes and a few longer rides both tyres have behaved exactly the same and I've only pumped the tyres up once in a month.
I'm really impressed with them.
You don't mention rim tape. You'll need that to help a good seal.
My schwalbe pros are a bugger to seat on my prime rims but once the bead has seated they seal OK. I've used co2 to give a big volume of air. Then deflate and pump up with a track pump. Stans don't recommend keeping the co2 in the tyre with their sealant. I always inject it through the valve core.
They lose about 10psi over a week. Ive never had a puncture on a ride but have come out to a flat once since I've been using tubeless (2 years). The sealant was very old and I hadn't topped it up. It had sprayed out of a 2mm hole and not solidified. A fresh top up sealed it and it's been fine since.
My schwalbe pros are a bugger to seat on my prime rims but once the bead has seated they seal OK. I've used co2 to give a big volume of air. Then deflate and pump up with a track pump. Stans don't recommend keeping the co2 in the tyre with their sealant. I always inject it through the valve core.
They lose about 10psi over a week. Ive never had a puncture on a ride but have come out to a flat once since I've been using tubeless (2 years). The sealant was very old and I hadn't topped it up. It had sprayed out of a 2mm hole and not solidified. A fresh top up sealed it and it's been fine since.
Marcellus said:
Cheers frisbee; was that stans race sealant and what do you need to apply through the valve?
I bought two of the small bottles of sealant, they were just the right size for the valve once the core had been removed.It was all going so smoothly I even ended up doing it in the living room. I think my easy experience cursed a friend though, he spent an evening struggling to get a tyre back on for a ride yesterday morning.
I run Conti 5000TLs and they’re different to get on to different wheels.
Over the years I’ve run tubeless I’ve now got it down to always putting them on dry, everything clean etc. Then I bring them up to pressure, never had an issue to do this, sometimes with the valve core out to save time. Make sure they pop onto the bead. Then deflate slowly, if possible. Sometimes I need a lever, not always.
Then add sealant of choice through the valve with the core out. Then reflate with the core in. I have a syringe with screw on tube thing, works well.
I always inflate to pressure and then make sure I’ve kind of shaken the wheels and rotated it to make they’re coated inside with the sealant, then all done.
Doing my latest wheel build, I had a Conti stay inflated without sealant for several days. The second wheel was 24hrs, then I added sealant to them. So I’m surprised to hear the tyres are leaking through the sidewalls.
Over the years I’ve run tubeless I’ve now got it down to always putting them on dry, everything clean etc. Then I bring them up to pressure, never had an issue to do this, sometimes with the valve core out to save time. Make sure they pop onto the bead. Then deflate slowly, if possible. Sometimes I need a lever, not always.
Then add sealant of choice through the valve with the core out. Then reflate with the core in. I have a syringe with screw on tube thing, works well.
I always inflate to pressure and then make sure I’ve kind of shaken the wheels and rotated it to make they’re coated inside with the sealant, then all done.
Doing my latest wheel build, I had a Conti stay inflated without sealant for several days. The second wheel was 24hrs, then I added sealant to them. So I’m surprised to hear the tyres are leaking through the sidewalls.
BrundanBianchi said:
Continental have really screwed up. The side walls are porous, to just about every sealant I’ve encountered. They are ‘performance’ tyres. They roll superbly, they weigh next to nothing, but they really are cack in terms of sealant ‘tightness’ and resilience.
I’ve found nothing of the sort, currently have 3 wheel sets with them on and had no issues, certainly no worse than other tubeless tyres.Maybe a bad batch? Odd isn’t it ....
I think the only difference putting the sealant into the tyre directly is that there's perhaps less chance of the sealant fouling up the valve threads? The disadvantage is that you need to seat the bead with the sealant in place, which might spill some perhaps.
My Mavic wheels came with a syinge and tube to pump it into the valve, and I have always done it that way myself (using Stan's now, the Mavic stuff is too thin and doesn't have the flecks which help in sealing holes)
My Mavic wheels came with a syinge and tube to pump it into the valve, and I have always done it that way myself (using Stan's now, the Mavic stuff is too thin and doesn't have the flecks which help in sealing holes)
Tubeless can be a real mixed bag.
I've fitted Mavic tyres and Conti GP5000 to my Mavic Cosmics with absolutely no faff whatsoever - easiest tyre fitting I've ever done.
Getting my Vittoria Corsa Speed tyres onto my Aerocoach wheels - an exercise in futility. I've never managed to get them to seat unless I run with tubes.
I've fitted Mavic tyres and Conti GP5000 to my Mavic Cosmics with absolutely no faff whatsoever - easiest tyre fitting I've ever done.
Getting my Vittoria Corsa Speed tyres onto my Aerocoach wheels - an exercise in futility. I've never managed to get them to seat unless I run with tubes.
I fitted TL 5000 to my Bontrager rims ... really went on easily ... tyres were new so I put a tube in and left them mounted and inflated overnight. Removed the tubes in the morning, mounted the valve stem, poured fluid in and they went up no bother. Had 4/5 months puncture free and only removed to put on tubes and standard tyres for my trip to Italy.
JEA1K said:
I fitted TL 5000 to my Bontrager rims ... really went on easily ... tyres were new so I put a tube in and left them mounted and inflated overnight. Removed the tubes in the morning, mounted the valve stem, poured fluid in and they went up no bother. Had 4/5 months puncture free and only removed to put on tubes and standard tyres for my trip to Italy.
You need to give more information about the rims. My Bontrager Aeolus Pro 3 with the white rim strip were a nightmare to fit. That was with 32mm GP5000 TL. Master Bean said:
You need to give more information about the rims. My Bontrager Aeolus Pro 3 with the white rim strip were a nightmare to fit. That was with 32mm GP5000 TL.
Bontrager Aelous 3 TLR (before the pro + XXX models). GP5000's in 25mm guise. I have to say that I tried the Schwalbe One's on those rims and they were an absolute pig to mount. Also, punctured and didn't seal after two rides. I have some Mavic tubeless tyres and wheels but have put tubes in them for now, couple of questions.
Should I get the Mavic sealant or are there better options ?
Do you need a specific tubeless pump or will a Joe Blow track pump do it ?
Is it worth carrying a tube/pump/tyre levers just in case you get a flat that the slime wont sort or are you screwed and its not worth taking all that stuff ?
Anyone had punctures on Tubeless tyres ?
Should I get the Mavic sealant or are there better options ?
Do you need a specific tubeless pump or will a Joe Blow track pump do it ?
Is it worth carrying a tube/pump/tyre levers just in case you get a flat that the slime wont sort or are you screwed and its not worth taking all that stuff ?
Anyone had punctures on Tubeless tyres ?
J4CKO said:
I have some Mavic tubeless tyres and wheels but have put tubes in them for now, couple of questions.
Should I get the Mavic sealant or are there better options ?
Do you need a specific tubeless pump or will a Joe Blow track pump do it ?
Is it worth carrying a tube/pump/tyre levers just in case you get a flat that the slime wont sort or are you screwed and its not worth taking all that stuff ?
Anyone had punctures on Tubeless tyres ?
I also run the Mavic Tubeless tyres on Mavic wheels. I have always used Orange Race sealant and had zero issues in nearly 2,000 miles.Should I get the Mavic sealant or are there better options ?
Do you need a specific tubeless pump or will a Joe Blow track pump do it ?
Is it worth carrying a tube/pump/tyre levers just in case you get a flat that the slime wont sort or are you screwed and its not worth taking all that stuff ?
Anyone had punctures on Tubeless tyres ?
In terms of carrying a tube, I did to start with as this was my first foray into Tubeless but for the last 1,000 miles or so, I simply haven't bothered. I don't think i would be able to get the tyre off, tube in and tyre back on successfully. I've encountered no issues so far and would keep the same tyes for next year when they'll need replacing..
J4CKO said:
Should I get the Mavic sealant or are there better options ?
Don't get it, it's too thin. I use Stan's, which many people use, friends swear by Orange (as suggested above).J4CKO said:
Do you need a specific tubeless pump or will a Joe Blow track pump do it ?
I have a compressor for seating beads so I'm not sure... I think for road tyres it's possible to do it with a pump, you could try wrapping a nylon strap around the tyre to help push the beads out if you can't get it to inflate.J4CKO said:
Is it worth carrying a tube/pump/tyre levers just in case you get a flat that the slime wont sort or are you screwed and its not worth taking all that stuff ?
Anyone had punctures on Tubeless tyres ?
I had one, I pointed the hole down and it sealed with enough air left (this was the Mavic sealant which came with the wheels, which I think is too thin and doesn't have the "flecks" of latex that Stans does). I then tried a permanent repair later with an "anchovy", but that blew out miles from home and drained all the sealant. Luckily I had a tube/CO2/levers and got the tube in ok. I think it's either a lesson it just LEAVE sealed holes as they are, or to always carry a tube, I'm not sure which though Anyone had punctures on Tubeless tyres ?
I haven't had a puncture since though, in about 5,000km.If you have somebody with a car who can usually pick you up then it's probably not worth the hassle of carrying a tube. For me it would be calling a taxi or something (if there's a phone signal) so I'd rather have the chance of sorting it myself.
Edited by Gareth79 on Wednesday 23 September 01:05
Johno said:
BrundanBianchi said:
Continental have really screwed up. The side walls are porous, to just about every sealant I’ve encountered. They are ‘performance’ tyres. They roll superbly, they weigh next to nothing, but they really are cack in terms of sealant ‘tightness’ and resilience.
I’ve found nothing of the sort, currently have 3 wheel sets with them on and had no issues, certainly no worse than other tubeless tyres.Maybe a bad batch? Odd isn’t it ....
Hello mate
I went to Conti GP5000TLs on my DT Swiss road wheels. Forget any kind of "test" without sealant, you are wasting your time.
Make sure that if your valves come with different seals for inside the rim, you have chosen the one that gives the maximum rubber contact, not the one that is the most flush/hidden, a mistake I made and changed. Also don't go mad on screwing the valve in as hard as possible, or you will start to distort the rubber seal.
Make sure the rim tape is suitable and the valve hole is perfectly concentric around the corresponding one in the rim.
I used a £9 PX sealant injector...a worthwhile investment for the toolbox, especially as you can measure out the required amount be it road or MTB. Shake the sealant well before you add it.
Over-inflate to seat the tyre, listen for the sharp "pop" as it seats. A track pump pumped enthusiastically should be fine.
Don't just throw the wheels on and ride. Hold the wheel flat like a bus steering wheel with the valve at 6 o'clock. Give it an enthusiastic shake so your hands at 3 and 9 stay flat and 12 and 6 go up and down. Rotate the wheel a bit and repeat until you've gone all the way round.
Do the valves up tight with a valve core tool.
I've used tubeless on MTB for years, and once I sorted out the valve seal issue I love the road version. The GP5000TLs are great, even as a not particularly fit MAMIL I was fairly sure I could feel that they were faster than the GP4000s I took off (albeit narrower despite both being 28mm). As I am still waiting for my gravel bike delivery from Dolan (goodbye summer) I've used them bikepacking and gravel riding too on my Canyon and being frank I've totally taken the piss in terms of what I've asked them to do, and they have been absolutely fantastic off road (in the dry) as well as on.
Persevere...it is worth it!
I went to Conti GP5000TLs on my DT Swiss road wheels. Forget any kind of "test" without sealant, you are wasting your time.
Make sure that if your valves come with different seals for inside the rim, you have chosen the one that gives the maximum rubber contact, not the one that is the most flush/hidden, a mistake I made and changed. Also don't go mad on screwing the valve in as hard as possible, or you will start to distort the rubber seal.
Make sure the rim tape is suitable and the valve hole is perfectly concentric around the corresponding one in the rim.
I used a £9 PX sealant injector...a worthwhile investment for the toolbox, especially as you can measure out the required amount be it road or MTB. Shake the sealant well before you add it.
Over-inflate to seat the tyre, listen for the sharp "pop" as it seats. A track pump pumped enthusiastically should be fine.
Don't just throw the wheels on and ride. Hold the wheel flat like a bus steering wheel with the valve at 6 o'clock. Give it an enthusiastic shake so your hands at 3 and 9 stay flat and 12 and 6 go up and down. Rotate the wheel a bit and repeat until you've gone all the way round.
Do the valves up tight with a valve core tool.
I've used tubeless on MTB for years, and once I sorted out the valve seal issue I love the road version. The GP5000TLs are great, even as a not particularly fit MAMIL I was fairly sure I could feel that they were faster than the GP4000s I took off (albeit narrower despite both being 28mm). As I am still waiting for my gravel bike delivery from Dolan (goodbye summer) I've used them bikepacking and gravel riding too on my Canyon and being frank I've totally taken the piss in terms of what I've asked them to do, and they have been absolutely fantastic off road (in the dry) as well as on.
Persevere...it is worth it!
You don't need to inject the sealant, you can just put it in while the tyre is 90% on, just pour it in the bit that's not on the rim yet, rotate, and then pop the last bit of tyre on.
Re 5000TL, I've got Reynolds TL wheels at the mo, and they're quite tough. Obviously with TL you can use levers without worrying about pinching though, so it should be pretty easy. Always found it was worth putting tyre on and inflating first to stretch it out a touch, made it easier to then do it after that point.
Pinching the tyre into the middle of the rim all the way round is crucial in giving you that little bit of extra slack to pop the last bit on I've found.
I've had two big issues with TL and that has been sidewall related, hitting big rocks that blow the wall. So I'd certainly recommend carrying a decent tyre boot, as without this, you may well be in trouble. Obviously you should also carry a tube with you (as lightweight as you can find so as ti get the tyre back on with least hassle).
Re 5000TL, I've got Reynolds TL wheels at the mo, and they're quite tough. Obviously with TL you can use levers without worrying about pinching though, so it should be pretty easy. Always found it was worth putting tyre on and inflating first to stretch it out a touch, made it easier to then do it after that point.
Pinching the tyre into the middle of the rim all the way round is crucial in giving you that little bit of extra slack to pop the last bit on I've found.
I've had two big issues with TL and that has been sidewall related, hitting big rocks that blow the wall. So I'd certainly recommend carrying a decent tyre boot, as without this, you may well be in trouble. Obviously you should also carry a tube with you (as lightweight as you can find so as ti get the tyre back on with least hassle).
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