Rural A-Road Cycling - Road Laws
Discussion
Disclaimer - I'm not a troll. Genuinely interested in the Law/Highway Code provision...I'm not a cyclist myself.
I was just talking to my wife and she was telling me about her drive from Exeter to Tiverton today, along the Bickleigh road.
She approached a group of about 40 cyclists, obviously out for a Sunday jolly. All riding in a group, 2-4 abreast stretching for about 50m along the road.
Bear in mid this is a twisty A road following a river - not many opportunities to overtake a car, let alone a cycle-train.
She commented that tractors normally pull over if there are too many cars behind, and I get that this is not really feasible for cyclists. She followed at 15-35 mph for a good few miles, by which time the queue of cars was as far as she could see in the mirrors.
She didnt tell me how she evenually got past, or how many cyclists died in the manouver
Does the Highway code have any provision for this? Is there laws? Or is it just down to the etiquette of the cyclists?
I'm not going to write to my MP, or lie in wait for them next Sunday. Just curious.
I was just talking to my wife and she was telling me about her drive from Exeter to Tiverton today, along the Bickleigh road.
She approached a group of about 40 cyclists, obviously out for a Sunday jolly. All riding in a group, 2-4 abreast stretching for about 50m along the road.
Bear in mid this is a twisty A road following a river - not many opportunities to overtake a car, let alone a cycle-train.
She commented that tractors normally pull over if there are too many cars behind, and I get that this is not really feasible for cyclists. She followed at 15-35 mph for a good few miles, by which time the queue of cars was as far as she could see in the mirrors.
She didnt tell me how she evenually got past, or how many cyclists died in the manouver
Does the Highway code have any provision for this? Is there laws? Or is it just down to the etiquette of the cyclists?
I'm not going to write to my MP, or lie in wait for them next Sunday. Just curious.
They shouldn't be riding four abreast. They also shouldn't feel forced to ride single file allowing cars to "squeeze" past.
They should pull over when possible and let faster vehicles past.
They shouldn't ride in such a big group, 10 to 12 is a more sensible number.
There are a lot of idiots on the roads, some of them ride bikes.
They should pull over when possible and let faster vehicles past.
They shouldn't ride in such a big group, 10 to 12 is a more sensible number.
There are a lot of idiots on the roads, some of them ride bikes.
I think very few clubs will ride 4 abreast or in a group of 40 riders.
As someone below said more often max 12/15 and 2 abreast.
If/when aware of someone in a car sitting behind for a while being reasonable they will single up to allow vehicle past, if it safe to do so.
Equally if a single track road it may be safer for everyone concerned to stay 2 up until the end of the section or until it is safe to let the car past.
As someone below said more often max 12/15 and 2 abreast.
If/when aware of someone in a car sitting behind for a while being reasonable they will single up to allow vehicle past, if it safe to do so.
Equally if a single track road it may be safer for everyone concerned to stay 2 up until the end of the section or until it is safe to let the car past.
They are inconsiderate cyclists, end of. Same as there are inconsiderate car drivers, motorbike riders etc.
Even when cycling alone I will try and pull in and allow fellow road users past rather than hold them up.
If I get a safe pass, i.e. they go as far right as they can and not just give what they think is ok I'll wave and hope they see that I acknowledge their safe pass. I'm still waiting for the day they mistake it for an IQ indication but that bridge shall be crossed at the time...
Even when cycling alone I will try and pull in and allow fellow road users past rather than hold them up.
If I get a safe pass, i.e. they go as far right as they can and not just give what they think is ok I'll wave and hope they see that I acknowledge their safe pass. I'm still waiting for the day they mistake it for an IQ indication but that bridge shall be crossed at the time...
From a following vehicle, it's actually hard to tell if a group of cyclists is really cycling "4 abreast", or whether they're just riding in pairs as allowed by the highway code, but with some of the pairs offset into the middle of the road more than others.
I agree that a group of 40 is way too big though.
I agree that a group of 40 is way too big though.
mikecassie said:
They are inconsiderate cyclists, end of. Same as there are inconsiderate car drivers, motorbike riders etc.
Even when cycling alone I will try and pull in and allow fellow road users past rather than hold them up.
If I get a safe pass, i.e. they go as far right as they can and not just give what they think is ok I'll wave and hope they see that I acknowledge their safe pass. I'm still waiting for the day they mistake it for an IQ indication but that bridge shall be crossed at the time...
To be fair I ride quite a bit on my own and have to say this year I've seen relatively few close passes!Even when cycling alone I will try and pull in and allow fellow road users past rather than hold them up.
If I get a safe pass, i.e. they go as far right as they can and not just give what they think is ok I'll wave and hope they see that I acknowledge their safe pass. I'm still waiting for the day they mistake it for an IQ indication but that bridge shall be crossed at the time...
Once when I did it was by a van that really was very close and I reacted badly, very swiftly followed by a car which whilst went wide really scared the bejeezus out of me as they put their siren on..... about half a mile up the road there was a van with a police car in a layby "having a chat" and I was invited to give the van drivers a cyclists perspective.
Marcellus said:
mikecassie said:
They are inconsiderate cyclists, end of. Same as there are inconsiderate car drivers, motorbike riders etc.
Even when cycling alone I will try and pull in and allow fellow road users past rather than hold them up.
If I get a safe pass, i.e. they go as far right as they can and not just give what they think is ok I'll wave and hope they see that I acknowledge their safe pass. I'm still waiting for the day they mistake it for an IQ indication but that bridge shall be crossed at the time...
To be fair I ride quite a bit on my own and have to say this year I've seen relatively few close passes!Even when cycling alone I will try and pull in and allow fellow road users past rather than hold them up.
If I get a safe pass, i.e. they go as far right as they can and not just give what they think is ok I'll wave and hope they see that I acknowledge their safe pass. I'm still waiting for the day they mistake it for an IQ indication but that bridge shall be crossed at the time...
Once when I did it was by a van that really was very close and I reacted badly, very swiftly followed by a car which whilst went wide really scared the bejeezus out of me as they put their siren on..... about half a mile up the road there was a van with a police car in a layby "having a chat" and I was invited to give the van drivers a cyclists perspective.
t myself and with the horn I knew something bad was going to happen, it was fking close. And to make it more annoying the GoPro view was obscured with rain water so I couldn't make out his numberplate. The worst one ever was the truck, 44 tonne jobbie who passed a tractor as I was coming the opposite way. If I'd not taken to the verge I'd be dead. I was too shocked to get the name of the company or numberplate. This was a couple years ago but still gives me the shivers if I think about it.
frisbee said:
They shouldn't be riding four abreast. They also shouldn't feel forced to ride single file allowing cars to "squeeze" past.
They should pull over when possible and let faster vehicles past.
They shouldn't ride in such a big group, 10 to 12 is a more sensible number.
There are a lot of idiots on the roads, some of them ride bikes.
This.They should pull over when possible and let faster vehicles past.
They shouldn't ride in such a big group, 10 to 12 is a more sensible number.
There are a lot of idiots on the roads, some of them ride bikes.
I don't think riding 4 abreast is considerate, either. My club often ride 2 abreast, but whenever a car is behind someone shouts "car back" and we all go single file. Sounds like the group were a bunch of inconsiderate plebs.
E65Ross said:
This.
I don't think riding 4 abreast is considerate, either. My club often ride 2 abreast, but whenever a car is behind someone shouts "car back" and we all go single file. Sounds like the group were a bunch of inconsiderate plebs.
Why the need to go single every time? You double the overtake time/distance and invite people to squeeze by. I don't think riding 4 abreast is considerate, either. My club often ride 2 abreast, but whenever a car is behind someone shouts "car back" and we all go single file. Sounds like the group were a bunch of inconsiderate plebs.
Make yourself as wide as a car, and they have to give you as much room as a car.
Although I fully agree that big groups and >2 abreast is f
kwit territory.Edited by Jimbo. on Monday 19th November 20:37
Jimbo. said:
E65Ross said:
This.
I don't think riding 4 abreast is considerate, either. My club often ride 2 abreast, but whenever a car is behind someone shouts "car back" and we all go single file. Sounds like the group were a bunch of inconsiderate plebs.
Why the need to go single every time? You double the overtake time/distance and invite people to squeeze by. I don't think riding 4 abreast is considerate, either. My club often ride 2 abreast, but whenever a car is behind someone shouts "car back" and we all go single file. Sounds like the group were a bunch of inconsiderate plebs.
Make yourself as wide as a car, and they have to give you as much room as a car.
Although I fully agree that big groups and >2 abreast is f
kwit territory.Edited by Jimbo. on Monday 19th November 20:37
Jimbo. said:
Why the need to go single every time? You double the overtake time/distance and invite people to squeeze by.
Make yourself as wide as a car, and they have to give you as much room as a car.
If the road is so narrow a pass of a single rider is not possible without a squeeze what do you do when a vehicle especially a large one comes the other way, do you just stay two abreast as wide as a car and play chicken in the hope the other road user gives way?Make yourself as wide as a car, and they have to give you as much room as a car.
Anyone riding a bike and deliberately blocking people by riding two abreast when they could go single file and open a gap between riders to assist people trying to get past is only increasing the chances of a dangerous overtake due to the following drivers frustrations, the longer they are stuck behind you the more chance of a dodgy overtake
Drop to single file give the car behind a invite wave to pass and you will find the driver will give you as much room as possible and wait for a safe place as they now know you are assisting their pass if you deliberately frustrate them they will drive past the group of idiots on bikes like idiots in their cars.
It's a fine call sometimes, I've been in obviously too big groups where after a couple of miles we've pulled over and split up after we've realised it's not been working. Never > 2 abreast, just no need, and single file on narrow lanes. Just general courtesy, but the club I ride with has riders that push boundaries and seemingly go out of their way to use up too much road, but I see the same from car drivers, inconsiderate people are everywhere.
Speed awareness course I was on they commented one van driver hated cyclists as they always banged his roof as he overtook, they had to point out that if he was close enough for them to bang the roof on overtake he was clearly too close!
Speed awareness course I was on they commented one van driver hated cyclists as they always banged his roof as he overtook, they had to point out that if he was close enough for them to bang the roof on overtake he was clearly too close!
I thought the question was about the law, not what various people think cyclists should do. The law says:
Highway Code, Rule 66:
...never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.
Neither narrow nor busy are defined. That's the sum total of the law in this regard.
The Highway Code has rather more to say about how drivers should behave towards cyclists (and motorcyclists and horse riders):
163
...give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car (see Rules 211 to 213 and 214 to 215).
167
...stay behind if you are following a cyclist approaching a roundabout or junction, and you intend to turn left
211
It is often difficult to see motorcyclists and cyclists, especially when they are coming up from behind, coming out of junctions, at roundabouts, overtaking you or filtering through traffic. Always look out for them before you emerge from a junction; they could be approaching faster than you think. When turning right across a line of slow-moving or stationary traffic, look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.
212
When passing motorcyclists and cyclists, give them plenty of room (see Rules 162 to 167). If they look over their shoulder it could mean that they intend to pull out, turn right or change direction. Give them time and space to do so.
213
Motorcyclists and cyclists may suddenly need to avoid uneven road surfaces and obstacles such as drain covers or oily, wet or icy patches on the road. Give them plenty of room and pay particular attention to any sudden change of direction they may have to make.
So they should not have been riding more than two abreast, and should have singled out if the road was especially busy or narrow. Your wife should then have waited until it was safe to overtake (and for all I know, she did) - as though she were overtaking a car or (in this case, given the length of the group) an artic. Note that the overall length will be longer when they are riding single file. They are under no legal obligation to pull in and let anyone pass, or to ride in a smaller group (or to break the group up into smaller units) - although both of these actions might be considerate behaviour.
Highway Code, Rule 66:
...never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.
Neither narrow nor busy are defined. That's the sum total of the law in this regard.
The Highway Code has rather more to say about how drivers should behave towards cyclists (and motorcyclists and horse riders):
163
...give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car (see Rules 211 to 213 and 214 to 215).
167
...stay behind if you are following a cyclist approaching a roundabout or junction, and you intend to turn left
211
It is often difficult to see motorcyclists and cyclists, especially when they are coming up from behind, coming out of junctions, at roundabouts, overtaking you or filtering through traffic. Always look out for them before you emerge from a junction; they could be approaching faster than you think. When turning right across a line of slow-moving or stationary traffic, look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.
212
When passing motorcyclists and cyclists, give them plenty of room (see Rules 162 to 167). If they look over their shoulder it could mean that they intend to pull out, turn right or change direction. Give them time and space to do so.
213
Motorcyclists and cyclists may suddenly need to avoid uneven road surfaces and obstacles such as drain covers or oily, wet or icy patches on the road. Give them plenty of room and pay particular attention to any sudden change of direction they may have to make.
So they should not have been riding more than two abreast, and should have singled out if the road was especially busy or narrow. Your wife should then have waited until it was safe to overtake (and for all I know, she did) - as though she were overtaking a car or (in this case, given the length of the group) an artic. Note that the overall length will be longer when they are riding single file. They are under no legal obligation to pull in and let anyone pass, or to ride in a smaller group (or to break the group up into smaller units) - although both of these actions might be considerate behaviour.
964Cup said:
I thought the question was about the law, not what various people think cyclists should do. The law says:
Highway Code, Rule 66:
...never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.
Neither narrow nor busy are defined. That's the sum total of the law in this regard.
The Highway Code has rather more to say about how drivers should behave towards cyclists (and motorcyclists and horse riders):
163
...give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car (see Rules 211 to 213 and 214 to 215).
167
...stay behind if you are following a cyclist approaching a roundabout or junction, and you intend to turn left
211
It is often difficult to see motorcyclists and cyclists, especially when they are coming up from behind, coming out of junctions, at roundabouts, overtaking you or filtering through traffic. Always look out for them before you emerge from a junction; they could be approaching faster than you think. When turning right across a line of slow-moving or stationary traffic, look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.
212
When passing motorcyclists and cyclists, give them plenty of room (see Rules 162 to 167). If they look over their shoulder it could mean that they intend to pull out, turn right or change direction. Give them time and space to do so.
213
Motorcyclists and cyclists may suddenly need to avoid uneven road surfaces and obstacles such as drain covers or oily, wet or icy patches on the road. Give them plenty of room and pay particular attention to any sudden change of direction they may have to make.
So they should not have been riding more than two abreast, and should have singled out if the road was especially busy or narrow. Your wife should then have waited until it was safe to overtake (and for all I know, she did) - as though she were overtaking a car or (in this case, given the length of the group) an artic. Note that the overall length will be longer when they are riding single file. They are under no legal obligation to pull in and let anyone pass, or to ride in a smaller group (or to break the group up into smaller units) - although both of these actions might be considerate behaviour.
It's important to quote the Highway Code correctly, otherwise it gets interpreted incorrectly. Must and Should proceeded a lot of the rules, you've missed off the first line of 66 that's states "You should". Highway Code, Rule 66:
...never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.
Neither narrow nor busy are defined. That's the sum total of the law in this regard.
The Highway Code has rather more to say about how drivers should behave towards cyclists (and motorcyclists and horse riders):
163
...give motorcyclists, cyclists and horse riders at least as much room as you would when overtaking a car (see Rules 211 to 213 and 214 to 215).
167
...stay behind if you are following a cyclist approaching a roundabout or junction, and you intend to turn left
211
It is often difficult to see motorcyclists and cyclists, especially when they are coming up from behind, coming out of junctions, at roundabouts, overtaking you or filtering through traffic. Always look out for them before you emerge from a junction; they could be approaching faster than you think. When turning right across a line of slow-moving or stationary traffic, look out for cyclists or motorcyclists on the inside of the traffic you are crossing. Be especially careful when turning, and when changing direction or lane. Be sure to check mirrors and blind spots carefully.
212
When passing motorcyclists and cyclists, give them plenty of room (see Rules 162 to 167). If they look over their shoulder it could mean that they intend to pull out, turn right or change direction. Give them time and space to do so.
213
Motorcyclists and cyclists may suddenly need to avoid uneven road surfaces and obstacles such as drain covers or oily, wet or icy patches on the road. Give them plenty of room and pay particular attention to any sudden change of direction they may have to make.
So they should not have been riding more than two abreast, and should have singled out if the road was especially busy or narrow. Your wife should then have waited until it was safe to overtake (and for all I know, she did) - as though she were overtaking a car or (in this case, given the length of the group) an artic. Note that the overall length will be longer when they are riding single file. They are under no legal obligation to pull in and let anyone pass, or to ride in a smaller group (or to break the group up into smaller units) - although both of these actions might be considerate behaviour.
Our club rides go out single or double according to the road conditions and traffic, split into groups of no more than 10-12. Ride that half wheel or go out three abreast get berated.
964Cup said:
I thought the question was about the law, not what various people think cyclists should do. The law says:
Highway Code, Rule 66:
...never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.
Neither narrow nor busy are defined. That's the sum total of the law in this regard.
That's guidance, not the law.Highway Code, Rule 66:
...never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends.
Neither narrow nor busy are defined. That's the sum total of the law in this regard.
The relevant legislation is provided within the first reply to this thread.
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