Electric bicycles - who buys them?
Discussion
Hugo Stiglitz said:
Last week I was on the Surrey Hills and everyone was on full powered ebikes. Where's the fun?
You winch up to what? Where's the enjoyment coming down on a numb, soulless, thudding bike. You can't pop off anything without a herculaneum effort of strength.
You try, get it wrong and it nose plonks down.
They always grin when they pass you as well, like they are winning. Bizarre.
Sounds like you need to learn how to ride better, maybe an ebike would help?You winch up to what? Where's the enjoyment coming down on a numb, soulless, thudding bike. You can't pop off anything without a herculaneum effort of strength.
You try, get it wrong and it nose plonks down.
They always grin when they pass you as well, like they are winning. Bizarre.
You'd get so much more practice coming down the trails that you'd realise that if you need a herculaneum effort to 'pop off anything' then it's not the bike, it's you.
I ride in the Surrey Hills a few times a week. Yep, it's very ebike populated now, but that's because they are perfect for the trails there. We can lap normal bikes about 3 times on eg Fly Tip climb and have 3 times the runs they've had. None of us are coming down the trails slowly nor struggling to 'pop off anything'. Lots of pros are out in the hills practicing on ebikes. There are also lots of pros now running lead in their bottom bracket area of their downhill race bikes to replicate the feel, stability and low COG an e-bike has.
I did almost every trail on Holmbury, Pitch and Winterfold in one ride last week. We were out for 3 hours, did about 65% of a full-fat battery and about 23 miles. All of those miles climbing or coming down a trail at balls-out speed. Very few people are going to manage that on a manual bike. By the end even on an eeb you're shattered because your core, arms and shoulders have done so many trails.
573 said:
Sounds like you need to learn how to ride better, maybe an ebike would help?
You'd get so much more practice coming down the trails that you'd realise that if you need a herculaneum effort to 'pop off anything' then it's not the bike, it's you.
I ride in the Surrey Hills a few times a week. Yep, it's very ebike populated now, but that's because they are perfect for the trails there. We can lap normal bikes about 3 times on eg Fly Tip climb and have 3 times the runs they've had. None of us are coming down the trails slowly nor struggling to 'pop off anything'. Lots of pros are out in the hills practicing on ebikes. There are also lots of pros now running lead in their bottom bracket area of their downhill race bikes to replicate the feel, stability and low COG an e-bike has.
I did almost every trail on Holmbury, Pitch and Winterfold in one ride last week. We were out for 3 hours, did about 65% of a full-fat battery and about 23 miles. All of those miles climbing or coming down a trail at balls-out speed. Very few people are going to manage that on a manual bike. By the end even on an eeb you're shattered because your core, arms and shoulders have done so many trails.
I've had an E for just over a year, I love it but I'm with Hugo on this one. They're just nowhere near as nimble or agile as a regular bike. You'd get so much more practice coming down the trails that you'd realise that if you need a herculaneum effort to 'pop off anything' then it's not the bike, it's you.
I ride in the Surrey Hills a few times a week. Yep, it's very ebike populated now, but that's because they are perfect for the trails there. We can lap normal bikes about 3 times on eg Fly Tip climb and have 3 times the runs they've had. None of us are coming down the trails slowly nor struggling to 'pop off anything'. Lots of pros are out in the hills practicing on ebikes. There are also lots of pros now running lead in their bottom bracket area of their downhill race bikes to replicate the feel, stability and low COG an e-bike has.
I did almost every trail on Holmbury, Pitch and Winterfold in one ride last week. We were out for 3 hours, did about 65% of a full-fat battery and about 23 miles. All of those miles climbing or coming down a trail at balls-out speed. Very few people are going to manage that on a manual bike. By the end even on an eeb you're shattered because your core, arms and shoulders have done so many trails.
Getting weight as low as possible is nothing new in DH, manufacturers and teams have been doing it for years, saving weight wherever possible just to stick some weights around the BB area. That's very different to having a f
k off heavy battery stretching the length of the down tube that creates a bike that weighs more than a rubber duckie running super monsters. Don't get me wrong, like I say I have one and love riding it but whenever I'm at the top of a downhill on it I always wish I could magic it away and be on my Cotic instead then revert back when I'm at the bottom and need to go up again. I hope there comes a time when battery tech is so advanced that we can get the same range we have now but with much smaller and lighter batteries, e-mtbs will be absolute f
king weapons then! bobbo89 said:
I've had an E for just over a year, I love it but I'm with Hugo on this one. They're just nowhere near as nimble or agile as a regular bike.
Getting weight as low as possible is nothing new in DH, manufacturers and teams have been doing it for years, saving weight wherever possible just to stick some weights around the BB area. That's very different to having a fk off heavy battery stretching the length of the down tube that creates a bike that weighs more than a rubber duckie running super monsters.
Don't get me wrong, like I say I have one and love riding it but whenever I'm at the top of a downhill on it I always wish I could magic it away and be on my Cotic instead then revert back when I'm at the bottom and need to go up again. I hope there comes a time when battery tech is so advanced that we can get the same range we have now but with much smaller and lighter batteries, e-mtbs will be absolute fking weapons then!
Normally bike is definitely more agile, but you can still use pop on an eeb, it's just a bit more challenging and harder to recover when it starts going wrong Getting weight as low as possible is nothing new in DH, manufacturers and teams have been doing it for years, saving weight wherever possible just to stick some weights around the BB area. That's very different to having a f
k off heavy battery stretching the length of the down tube that creates a bike that weighs more than a rubber duckie running super monsters. Don't get me wrong, like I say I have one and love riding it but whenever I'm at the top of a downhill on it I always wish I could magic it away and be on my Cotic instead then revert back when I'm at the bottom and need to go up again. I hope there comes a time when battery tech is so advanced that we can get the same range we have now but with much smaller and lighter batteries, e-mtbs will be absolute f
king weapons then! 
Edited by trails on Tuesday 2nd July 08:55
I've got a:
- Nukeproof Mega carbon
- Bird AM9
And
A Trek Fuel EXE.
I'm not sure how I can work on my technique.
The Rail that i once hired was hideous to ride on. No sweat, no feeling of calm content afterwards, I even forgot to drink water. I literally didn't need it. I just powered up everything and rode with a frozen expression going down. I also briefly owned a Orbea Rise but didn't like the motor noise and the artificial kick in. It was also dull still.
I got a EXE recently and rode it in eco throughout. You could argue you could ride a full fat 50k+ ebike in eco but my word how painful and still soulless that would be.
I'm looking forward to the day we are on 30lb ebikes and if they are also full power? I'm in.
So it's not ebike hate.
- Nukeproof Mega carbon
- Bird AM9
And
A Trek Fuel EXE.
I'm not sure how I can work on my technique.
The Rail that i once hired was hideous to ride on. No sweat, no feeling of calm content afterwards, I even forgot to drink water. I literally didn't need it. I just powered up everything and rode with a frozen expression going down. I also briefly owned a Orbea Rise but didn't like the motor noise and the artificial kick in. It was also dull still.
I got a EXE recently and rode it in eco throughout. You could argue you could ride a full fat 50k+ ebike in eco but my word how painful and still soulless that would be.
I'm looking forward to the day we are on 30lb ebikes and if they are also full power? I'm in.
So it's not ebike hate.
nuyorican said:
Richtea1970 said:
I wonder who were enjoying themselves more?
Oh absolutely 
To clarify, I wasn’t making a judgement about using e-bikes or whatever, to each their own… It was more that it was a strange experience being slowly overtaken by what appeared at first glance to be quite out of shape guys on mountain bikes, sitting down and barely pedalling. I don’t think I’ve experienced that before and for a moment was worrying that I must be seriously out of shape before the penny dropped that they were on electric bikes. They don’t look as obvious these days.
I can certainly see the appeal in them. For me personally, during the summer months I like to keep fit by long bike rides rather than the gym. So I must suffer on the hills
I have a couple of e-bikes and a ‘normal’ so see both sides of the argument. What I do take issue with is the notion that anyone who is on an ebike is somehow ‘cheating’, in the same way that by driving to the shops, you are cheating as you could easily have walked.
I ride the e-bikes as I have fun on them, in the same way I’d ride my non electric bike if I wanted to get a sweat on and put some miles in.
I don't get the cheat argument either, despite having used it in the past myself in jest.
My max HR on ebike is 193, HT on same route is 174. I work much, much harder on the ebike than I do on the analogue, it's more fun, and faster. It's utterly brilliant. If I want an extra workout I turn the motor off, but I can hit my max output just by absolutely gunning it up a hill.
Sure people can just plod around on them too, but... So what?
My max HR on ebike is 193, HT on same route is 174. I work much, much harder on the ebike than I do on the analogue, it's more fun, and faster. It's utterly brilliant. If I want an extra workout I turn the motor off, but I can hit my max output just by absolutely gunning it up a hill.
Sure people can just plod around on them too, but... So what?
Hugo Stiglitz said:
However you dress it up. That's the point of them, it double, trebles, quadruples your wattage input.
If that's not cheating, we'll dress me up in a clown suit and chase me out of town.
Do you class driving your car somewhere as cheating?If that's not cheating, we'll dress me up in a clown suit and chase me out of town.
I don’t know anyone who’s ridden an ebike, rides past a manual bike and pretends to be much fitter than them. They are just using an ebike because it’s the best tool for them at the time. It’s not difficult.
Edited by Richtea1970 on Tuesday 2nd July 07:01
Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.
As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.
As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
I guess it's your use of the words cheat/cheating that is confusing; personally I ride bikes for fun...and whilst I agree that ebikes are more cumbersome than regular bikes, I still have lots of fun, just a slightly different type of fun.As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
Edited by trails on Tuesday 2nd July 10:05
Hugo Stiglitz said:
Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.
As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
I've got a very cumbersome and heavy e-bike. As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
I can do plenty of day to day stuff I couldn't do on a normal bike plus I can load it up with a weekend's worth of gear and go away.
I am mid 50s and live on the edge of the peak district - no way I could do that on a normal bike.
I am sure there are some mountain goats out there who could smash the climbs with a load of gear on their bike, but it's not a realistic prospect for many,
Hugo Stiglitz said:
Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.
As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
You're comparing to riding a normal bike, I bet there's a lot of people out there on e-bikes who wouldn't be out at all otherwise. As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.
I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.
Here in the land of the cycle commuter a lot of people do use them as an alternative to the car or public transport. I share an office with someone who turned 60 the other week, she bought herself an e-bike last year to commute on as an alternative to catching the bus to work. She loves getting a bit of fresh air in the morning, but she'd never do it on a manual bike. My wife and I did about 55km last Sunday, she'd never have gone out for that long a ride on her old manual bike, and as there were a couple of specific places we wanted to go, we'd probably have taken the bikes on the train and only cycled 20km or so if she wasn't on an e-bike.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
I've got a:
- Nukeproof Mega carbon
- Bird AM9
And
A Trek Fuel EXE.
I'm not sure how I can work on my technique.
The Rail that i once hired was hideous to ride on. No sweat, no feeling of calm content afterwards, I even forgot to drink water. I literally didn't need it. I just powered up everything and rode with a frozen expression going down. I also briefly owned a Orbea Rise but didn't like the motor noise and the artificial kick in. It was also dull still.
I got a EXE recently and rode it in eco throughout. You could argue you could ride a full fat 50k+ ebike in eco but my word how painful and still soulless that would be.
I'm looking forward to the day we are on 30lb ebikes and if they are also full power? I'm in.
So it's not ebike hate.
I think both those Trek eebs are pretty horrible to be fair. Both feel like monster trucks. Mullet is pretty essential, it gets back some of the manoeuvrability. I've not ridden a full 29 ebike that I've liked.- Nukeproof Mega carbon
- Bird AM9
And
A Trek Fuel EXE.
I'm not sure how I can work on my technique.
The Rail that i once hired was hideous to ride on. No sweat, no feeling of calm content afterwards, I even forgot to drink water. I literally didn't need it. I just powered up everything and rode with a frozen expression going down. I also briefly owned a Orbea Rise but didn't like the motor noise and the artificial kick in. It was also dull still.
I got a EXE recently and rode it in eco throughout. You could argue you could ride a full fat 50k+ ebike in eco but my word how painful and still soulless that would be.
I'm looking forward to the day we are on 30lb ebikes and if they are also full power? I'm in.
So it's not ebike hate.
Of course there are more cumbersome and sometimes pop less.
But there are plenty of situations where they pop more because they regain momentum so much quicker than accoustic bikes, particularly in technical stuff.
The same way as a CR250 will pop massively because it can accelerate so much quicker up a ramp than a push bike.
As said, a slightly different kind of fun and pop. But very similar IME.
But there are plenty of situations where they pop more because they regain momentum so much quicker than accoustic bikes, particularly in technical stuff.
The same way as a CR250 will pop massively because it can accelerate so much quicker up a ramp than a push bike.
As said, a slightly different kind of fun and pop. But very similar IME.
573 said:
I think both those Trek eebs are pretty horrible to be fair. Both feel like monster trucks. Mullet is pretty essential, it gets back some of the manoeuvrability. I've not ridden a full 29 ebike that I've liked.
The XR5 tyres came off very quickly and yes it's mullet compatible... one of the deciding factors. As for a poppy Rail. You would have to have some real confidence in those brakes and momentum.
It needs 4 pots upgrades.
I can absolutely see why they put the limit at 15.5 mph as it has to cater for people of all ages and all abilities but it is a bit frustrating for seasoned cyclists who just want to get somewhere. I do wonder what a small motor like SL 1.1/Fazua/Bosch SX would feel like with the speed limit taken off.
At the moment in practice you get a little assist from 0 mph and coming out of junctions but if there are no killer hills then you are just riding a heavy bike for 95% of the ride.
At the moment in practice you get a little assist from 0 mph and coming out of junctions but if there are no killer hills then you are just riding a heavy bike for 95% of the ride.
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