Electric bicycles - who buys them?

[bmwmike]

I don't get the cheat argument either, despite having used it in the past myself in jest.

My max HR on ebike is 193, HT on same route is 174. I work much, much harder on the ebike than I do on the analogue, it's more fun, and faster. It's utterly brilliant. If I want an extra workout I turn the motor off, but I can hit my max output just by absolutely gunning it up a hill.

Sure people can just plod around on them too, but... So what?

[Richtea1970]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

However you dress it up. That's the point of them, it double, trebles, quadruples your wattage input.

If that's not cheating, we'll dress me up in a clown suit and chase me out of town.

Do you class driving your car somewhere as cheating?

I don’t know anyone who’s ridden an ebike, rides past a manual bike and pretends to be much fitter than them. They are just using an ebike because it’s the best tool for them at the time. It’s not difficult.

Edited by Richtea1970 on Tuesday 2nd July 07:01

[Pistom]

When I got my ebike I thought I wouldn't use my pedal bike again but I realise now, it's just a different kind of bike.

I don't understand those who call cheat but maybe it's them who don't understand ebikes?

[Hugo Stiglitz]

Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.

As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.

I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.

[trails]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.

As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.

I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.

I guess it's your use of the words cheat/cheating that is confusing; personally I ride bikes for fun...and whilst I agree that ebikes are more cumbersome than regular bikes, I still have lots of fun, just a slightly different type of fun.

Edited by trails on Tuesday 2nd July 10:05

[TownIdiot]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.

As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.

I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.

I've got a very cumbersome and heavy e-bike.
I can do plenty of day to day stuff I couldn't do on a normal bike plus I can load it up with a weekend's worth of gear and go away.

I am mid 50s and live on the edge of the peak district - no way I could do that on a normal bike.

I am sure there are some mountain goats out there who could smash the climbs with a load of gear on their bike, but it's not a realistic prospect for many,

[RizzoTheRat]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

Driving a car somewhere isn't the same as riding a bicycle for a hobby.

As I said I can't get my head round the heavy full fat ebikes. They are cumbersome and lack finese. When I rode the Rail I was thinking I'd rather be on my motorbike. This isn't a troll, it's an opposite opinion to your own.

I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I've ridden and own an ebike. As I also said when ebikes get towards 30lb (if they ever do) it's game over for analogue bikes.

You're comparing to riding a normal bike, I bet there's a lot of people out there on e-bikes who wouldn't be out at all otherwise.

Here in the land of the cycle commuter a lot of people do use them as an alternative to the car or public transport. I share an office with someone who turned 60 the other week, she bought herself an e-bike last year to commute on as an alternative to catching the bus to work. She loves getting a bit of fresh air in the morning, but she'd never do it on a manual bike. My wife and I did about 55km last Sunday, she'd never have gone out for that long a ride on her old manual bike, and as there were a couple of specific places we wanted to go, we'd probably have taken the bikes on the train and only cycled 20km or so if she wasn't on an e-bike.

[573]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

I've got a:

- Nukeproof Mega carbon
- Bird AM9
And

A Trek Fuel EXE.

I'm not sure how I can work on my technique.

The Rail that i once hired was hideous to ride on. No sweat, no feeling of calm content afterwards, I even forgot to drink water. I literally didn't need it. I just powered up everything and rode with a frozen expression going down. I also briefly owned a Orbea Rise but didn't like the motor noise and the artificial kick in. It was also dull still.

I got a EXE recently and rode it in eco throughout. You could argue you could ride a full fat 50k+ ebike in eco but my word how painful and still soulless that would be.

I'm looking forward to the day we are on 30lb ebikes and if they are also full power? I'm in.

So it's not ebike hate.

I think both those Trek eebs are pretty horrible to be fair. Both feel like monster trucks. Mullet is pretty essential, it gets back some of the manoeuvrability. I've not ridden a full 29 ebike that I've liked.

[nickfrog]

Of course there are more cumbersome and sometimes pop less.

But there are plenty of situations where they pop more because they regain momentum so much quicker than accoustic bikes, particularly in technical stuff.

The same way as a CR250 will pop massively because it can accelerate so much quicker up a ramp than a push bike.

As said, a slightly different kind of fun and pop. But very similar IME.

[President Merkin]

As an aside, pal of mine has a Powerfly I sometimes work on & it's the worst chunk of junk I've ever seen. Two years old & it's burnt through a headset, two freehubs, a front wheel & now it has corrosion on the frame.

[Hugo Stiglitz]

573 said:

I think both those Trek eebs are pretty horrible to be fair. Both feel like monster trucks. Mullet is pretty essential, it gets back some of the manoeuvrability. I've not ridden a full 29 ebike that I've liked.

The XR5 tyres came off very quickly and yes it's mullet compatible... one of the deciding factors.


As for a poppy Rail. You would have to have some real confidence in those brakes and momentum.

It needs 4 pots upgrades.

[272BHP]

I can absolutely see why they put the limit at 15.5 mph as it has to cater for people of all ages and all abilities but it is a bit frustrating for seasoned cyclists who just want to get somewhere. I do wonder what a small motor like SL 1.1/Fazua/Bosch SX would feel like with the speed limit taken off.

At the moment in practice you get a little assist from 0 mph and coming out of junctions but if there are no killer hills then you are just riding a heavy bike for 95% of the ride.

[gangzoom]

272BHP said:

I can absolutely see why they put the limit at 15.5 mph as it has to cater for people of all ages and all abilities but it is a bit frustrating for seasoned cyclists who just want to get somewhere. I do wonder what a small motor like SL 1.1/Fazua/Bosch SX would feel like with the speed limit taken off.

The Fazua motor has no issues with maintain 20mph on the flat with abit of human input, bare-in mind my Boardman is 20kg+ running Marathon+ tires, so very much a commuter bike, and I do the commute in work cloths. I can barely hit 18mph average on my analogue Trek Madone, so to be able to average 19mph on the commuting run shows how much support these motors can/do give if allowed.

[573]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

The XR5 tyres came off very quickly and yes it's mullet compatible... one of the deciding factors.


As for a poppy Rail. You would have to have some real confidence in those brakes and momentum.

It needs 4 pots upgrades.

They all do. Loads of ebikes are under-braked, tired, suspended etc to meet a price. They need DH carcass tyres, 4 pots and a burly fork to work with the extra weight IMO.

[Davie]

I really don't get the whole eBike debate / cheating...

Fitness wise... if you're at either ends of the scale, you'll get very different experiences. If you're overweight, unfit, struggling to ride due to injury or health then an eBike can be massively beneficial in opening up opportunity to ride and thus, exercise and progress. If however you're a super fit, slim, machine of a human then an eBike likely won't benefit you, you'll regress as it'll be less of a challenge.

As for the ride itself... there are opposing ends of the scale. If you relish in climbs, watts, heart rates and the like then you'll be happy on your analogue bike. Or if you like coming back down flicking massive tail whips, popping off things, moving a bike around in the air then you'll be happy on your analogue bike.

But... there's also the middle ground and that's where I am. I don't care about watts, I don't care about heart rates and I have no desire to kill myself on climbs and I'm not brave or skilled enough to fly a bike off huge jumps.

All I want to do is ride an MTB and enjoy it, scare myself, work hard and have a huge amount of fun from the moment my arse hits the saddle to the time it gets back off. I'm probably not getting massively fitter quickly but I'm not getting fatter. I'm not dying on climbs... or on the way back down.

I didn't get that from my analogue bikes.

[bobbo89]

It's only cheating if you're competing and there are separate categories for that.

Outside of that we're all just playing out on our bikes like we did as kids, it's not a competition, we're all just out playing.

So long as it's fun that's all that matters.

Edited by bobbo89 on Tuesday 2nd July 21:57

[Pizzaeatingking]

I didn't realise there are people out there who actually think an eBike is 'cheating'

[bmwmike]

Davie said:

I really don't get the whole eBike debate / cheating...

Fitness wise... if you're at either ends of the scale, you'll get very different experiences. If you're overweight, unfit, struggling to ride due to injury or health then an eBike can be massively beneficial in opening up opportunity to ride and thus, exercise and progress. If however you're a super fit, slim, machine of a human then an eBike likely won't benefit you, you'll regress as it'll be less of a challenge.

As for the ride itself... there are opposing ends of the scale. If you relish in climbs, watts, heart rates and the like then you'll be happy on your analogue bike. Or if you like coming back down flicking massive tail whips, popping off things, moving a bike around in the air then you'll be happy on your analogue bike.

But... there's also the middle ground and that's where I am. I don't care about watts, I don't care about heart rates and I have no desire to kill myself on climbs and I'm not brave or skilled enough to fly a bike off huge jumps.

All I want to do is ride an MTB and enjoy it, scare myself, work hard and have a huge amount of fun from the moment my arse hits the saddle to the time it gets back off. I'm probably not getting massively fitter quickly but I'm not getting fatter. I'm not dying on climbs... or on the way back down.

I didn't get that from my analogue bikes.

Respectfully disagree on the fitness, as I'm pretty fit (relative to my earlier years) and moved into an ebike and work just as hard, and still get a lot out of it. I sweat like crazy, max HR etc. It's just everywhere faster, not necessarily easier. I accept there are those that just boost everywhere and sometimes if the mood takes me I'll do that too, but used properly they can be an effective fitness tool as well as a lot of fun.

[272BHP]

bmwmike said:

Respectfully disagree on the fitness, as I'm pretty fit (relative to my earlier years) and moved into an ebike and work just as hard, and still get a lot out of it. I sweat like crazy, max HR etc. It's just everywhere faster, not necessarily easier.I accept there are those that just boost everywhere and sometimes if the mood takes me I'll do that too, but used properly they can be an effective fitness tool as well as a lot of fun.

My experience was entirely the other way around. its easier, not necessarily faster.

Unless you live in a place with killer hills of course

[bmwmike]

272BHP said:

bmwmike said:

Respectfully disagree on the fitness, as I'm pretty fit (relative to my earlier years) and moved into an ebike and work just as hard, and still get a lot out of it. I sweat like crazy, max HR etc. It's just everywhere faster, not necessarily easier.I accept there are those that just boost everywhere and sometimes if the mood takes me I'll do that too, but used properly they can be an effective fitness tool as well as a lot of fun.

My experience was entirely the other way around. its easier, not necessarily faster.

Unless you live in a place with killer hills of course

Maybe it depends on the type of motor? Mine is only 60nm. In the mid power mode, it only really amplifies what you put in using its torque sensor, so if you pedal like an old lady, you won't get anywhere. If you put the power in, you get power out, up to 15.5mph of course, but that gets me faster everywhere [inclines] compared to my old analogue mtb, and i'm putting more effort in (confirmed via heart rate, sweat rate, etc).

Of course, with any emtb, you can just stick em in boost and pedal lightly and not put any effort in, or turn the motor off and put 100% of your own energy in.

Thats the beauty of them i think.