What r the boost readings off the GT3 ? BOOST INFO

[daves_gt3]

Im being told various figures by people here.
Think i need a GT3 owner for this one.

Looking for the stock figures of the boost on a GT3.
With and without the wastegate disconnected if possible.
Ive recently had problems with the boost and i unsure if i have got it set right.
is it the same as the s4 engine?

id be interested to know the stock boost when the solenoid is disconnected because i have recently changed the actuator. original garrett one. the one they sent which was for the turbo (i gave them the numbers). they sent a 0.5 bar opening actuator.

i always believed that it should be 0.65 bar so i sent it back and they re sent a 0.65 bar actuator.

i do have 0.65 bar now with it adjusted correctly and the waste gate solenoid disconnected but only 0.85 bar at WOT.

I am getting 100% throttle (tps set correct)
charge cooler temp ok (electric pump)

just wondering if it is supposed to be like this or whether it should go to 0.97 bar at WOT like the s4 etc:

anyone?

dave

[Paula&Marcus]

Dave,
I sent you the original/stock boost map/table (max. boost vs. rpm) via email.

If you donot get max. allowed boost (but still more than 0.65 bar AND no fault codes stored AND no CEL lit) you should look at the following:

- MAT too high (= c/cooler pump may be defective) VERY LIKELY !
- restricted exhaust path (= maybe blocked Cat, partially closed EBPV, ...)
- tired turbo
- air intake hose (the one between air filter box and turbo inlet) blocked/collapsed
- too many recorded knocks
- bad fuel
- faulty MAP-sensor
- faulty BARO-sensor
...

Cheers
Marcus (www.PUKesprit.de)

[daves_gt3]

hi marcus,
sorry i emailed you after posing this message.
info is very helpful u sent.

the MAT temp is ok. and i have an electric pump as well.

no nock counts

no errors in the ecu

map and baro sensors reading ok on freescan

injectors ok unsure how to check the rest of the fuel ststem, any tips?

inlet hose from filter to turbo all ok

i have had a de-cat pipe in to test the cat and it made no difference. the cat hadnt broke up inside or rattle at all. and the gt3 doesnt have a ebpv vale

i can get 1 bar with the hose off the actuator so im presuming the turbo is ok

its baffling me a bit

i do have a freescan log file if anyone is interested?


just to add. the 0.65 bar i am getting is with the wastegate solenoid disconnected. max boost with it connected is 0.85 bar

dave



>> Edited by daves_gt3 on Tuesday 12th July 15:05

>> Edited by daves_gt3 on Tuesday 12th July 15:07

[adrianmugridge]

I thought it was 0.75 and 0.84 with overboost.

Adrian
Sport 350, ex GT3

[DAVES_GT3]

that is how i understood it from some people but others tell me different. :s dont want to sound like i dont believe anyone thats all.
getting mixed responses
i could have swore that the 2.2 had higher boost than the 2.0.
is that how your gt3 was when you had it then?
cheers
dave

[Paula&Marcus]

Hi All,
The max. boost for the 2.0 litre GT3 engine is 1 bar !

If you like you may also verify this on Andy´s (= Mr. Freescan) website. He also used to own a GT3, when he developed Freescan:

www.andywhittaker.com/ecu/tables_main.htm

Of course you will only get 1bar when ALL sensor data and parametres are 100%.

If you never get beyond 0.8 bar and everything else is 100% fine I would suspect the wastegate capsule (= spring inside has become too weak).

Cheers
Marcus (www.PUKesprit.de)

[DAVES_GT3]

i dunno then
all i know is the capsule is brand new and giving 0.65 bar without the aid of the wastegate solenoid. which is correct.
its not the first capsule i brought that i had in marcus which was only giving me 0.5 bar. they send me the wrong one so it was replaced free of charge by garrett.

dave

[adrianmugridge]

Well, I did not think it went to 1 bar. I only saw that happen after I had a chip from Marcus installed.

[DAVES_GT3]

thats what i want to do is get it chipped but i didnt want to do that unless in was running correctly.


dave

[Htown]

Not to hijack the thread, but is it normal to throw a CEL when disconnecting the WGFV connector to verify .65bar? Is the ECU really out of the loop with the check light on?

Let us know how you get along Dave...I've been 'tweaking' my wastgate settings a bit since the new turbo, but need to verify.

Also, a couple of years ago when I had a new clutch put in, the tech forgot to re-connect the WGFV to actuator hose, leading to massive overboost...If the spring is set to .65bar, and you take that hose off, how the heck can the car overboost? are the springs cranked down that much from the factory? I guess it would be nice to have an 'adjusted' value to shoot for instead of this 1/3 of a millimeter crap...

Craig

[DAVES_GT3]

i know mate. its not a good idea to run it with the actuator hose off. dermot did give me a bolockin 4 that but i wanted to see if the turbo was capable of giving 1 bar. which it is.

im hoping or wishing, unsure which, that it is supposed to be 0.84 at WOT because it would be spot on then. gould do with a bit of good luck after all the trouble i had.
if so then onto the puk upgrade #11 chip

ill keep informed and if anyone who has a gt3 can confirm there boost for me id be greatful

dave

[Paula&Marcus]

Htown said:

Not to hijack the thread, but is it normal to throw a CEL when disconnecting the WGFV connector to verify .65bar? Is the ECU really out of the loop with the check light on? Let us know how you get along Dave...I've been 'tweaking' my wastgate settings a bit since the new turbo, but need to verify. Also, a couple of years ago when I had a new clutch put in, the tech forgot to re-connect the WGFV to actuator hose, leading to massive overboost...If the spring is set to .65bar, and you take that hose off, how the heck can the car overboost? are the springs cranked down that much from the factory? I guess it would be nice to have an 'adjusted' value to shoot for instead of this 1/3 of a millimeter crap... Craig

Craig,
Sorry, but you are bit wrong here ...

When you disconnect the wastegate-solenoid electrically a code 26 will be set and the CEL light will be ON. This has nothin to do with open loop !!! Open loop is something totally different !!! When the CEL light is ON you will be still in closd loop.

If you disconnect the boost pressure line you will get massive overboost, of course !!! ... The pressure in the boost line OPENS the wastegate inside the turbo (which actually is a bypass path). This means, if you disconnect this boost line the wastegate cannot open and you will get massive overboost ...

Cheers
Marcus (www.PUKesprit.de)

[Htown]

Gotcha...thanks.

Shouldn't have used the word 'loop' insert "equation"...tha's what I meant.

Not that I'm going to (cough) but, if the line from the WGFV to actuator is disconnected, and the car does NOT overboost...ever... is it safe to assume that the wastegate rod needs shortening? Assuming that all other systems are 100%?

Craig

>> Edited by Htown on Tuesday 12th July 22:12

[Paula&Marcus]

Htown said:

Gotcha...thanks. Shouldn't have used the word 'loop' insert "equation"...tha's what I meant. Not that I'm going to (cough) but, if the line from the WGFV to actuator is disconnected, and the car does NOT overboost...ever... is it safe to assume that the wastegate rod needs shortening? Assuming that all other systems are 100%? Craig >> Edited by Htown on Tuesday 12th July 22:12

Heeeee .............. ?????????????????????

If you disconnect the boost-line (=hose) from the wastegate capsule and you donot get overboost, then you have a massive problem !

Assuming that your wastegate-capsule-rod is still connected properly to the wastgate lever arm, of course.

Marcus

>> Edited by Paula&Marcus on Wednesday 13th July 10:10

[daves_gt3]

ok
so heres the info i needed. just found it in the service manual

Turbocharged 2.2 litre engine type: 910 0.84 bar
:910 S4S & sport 300 1.00 bar

Turbocharged 2.0 litre engine type: 920 0.97 bar

so it does look lik its is 0.97 bar on the gt3.

sorry marcus

looks like im back to finding a fault again then

dave

[Paula&Marcus]

Hi Dave,
Yes its exactly like I told you ;o)

Look here is the original/stock Lotus code boost vs. rpm map/table:


You see, its 0.97 bar for the normal rpm range and slightly more on the top end.

Cheers
Marcus (www.PUKesprit.de)

PS: Did you notice the 7800rpm -> 1.1 bar mapping ? Strange istn´t it ? The 2.0 litre engine actually is limited (fuel shutoff via ECU) redline to 7500rpm .... The reason for this is that initially Lotus intended to have a higher max rpm range for the 2.0 litre engine, but they aparently decided to set the rpm limiter very conservative in the end ;o)

>> Edited by Paula&Marcus on Wednesday 13th July 19:43

[DAVES_GT3]

hi marcus

i wondered about the 7800 rpm bit. thats one of the reasons i was not 100% about it. but also how the hell do you get 0.97 bar at 1600rpm. is that possible? certainly not with a stock turbo surely?

anyway im not getting those figures and freescan is telling me that everything is ok so i think im buggered! a technical term ive been using a lot recently.

also just buggered up my IAC vale so ill be ordering one of those tommorow pulled it to hard and pulled the end off. oops. now it is idling crap.

would be interested to see if anyone wants to help me persure my boost problem. its certainly a strange one if those figures are right.
anyone like a challenge?

dave

[inno]

I'm going through the same problem with my 90 SE. I used to get a momentary 1.2 bar with the stock turbo.
I just installed a hybrid T3/4 and I'm only getting 1.0 bar. Everything checks out fine on freescan (I have the log), no check engine lights, chargecooler MAT(electric pump) & TPS are fine. I have a de-cat pipe as well as a freeflow exhaust.
I adjusted the wastegate on the high side, perhaps about .75, and ran it with the solenoid disconnected and got .65 bar.
Freescan shows MAP at about 2.24, what does yours read?
I'm going to replace my boost gauge with this one (150-104),
www.egauges.com/vdo_mult.asp?Type=Turbo_Boost&Series=Vision&Cart=

I also bought a manual boost controller if all else fails. I'll let you know how it all turns out.

Pete

[daves_gt3]

hi pete

thanks for the info.
MAP is showing MAX 2.1 I know that is slightly low but i wouldnt have thought it would have made that much difference. or would it?

dave

[inno]

Dave,

Here's what my little mind is thinking. If I'm reading 2.24 on freescan then I'm actually achieving 1.24 BAR (according to the ECU). Now seat of the pants it doesn't feel like 1.24 BAR. So... my MAP sensor may be off and giving the ECU false high readings. The stock boost gauge setup is crap. I want to buy the VDO boost gauge and hook it directly to the manifold. Then I can verify that I'm really getting that high of a boost. If so then no probs. I would really hate to change out the MAP sensor, its in a tough spot to get at.
I hope this all makes sense. I'll keep you posted.

Pete