Haye vs Valuev
Discussion
tuscaneer said:
haye by wide points margin, follow the blueprint laid down by holyfield.UNLESS he gets cocky and gets tagged.valuev aint no klitschko in the power stakes but then haye`s not exactly jake la motta is he?
The probelm is that the fight's in Germany so Valuev will be regarded as the home fighter. With the standard of refereeing and judging you normally see in Germany that means Haye will need to knock Valuev out to get a draw. Also, if it does go close to the distance, I'm not sure how well Haye's stamina will hold up with a big lump like Valuev leaning all over him in clinches for most of the night. If he gets tired he's more likely to get tagged and, as you said, his chin isn't great.
Unfortunately, I reckon the glandular freak is likely to take this, probably on points.
tuscaneer said:
haye by wide points margin, follow the blueprint laid down by holyfield.UNLESS he gets cocky and gets tagged.valuev aint no klitschko in the power stakes but then haye`s not exactly jake la motta is he?
Hmmmm maybe. In my opinion Holyfield won that fight but was robbed by the home judges but that said, Haye is no Holyfield.We'll see how it all pans out but I got the distinct impression that Valuev was taking Holyfield lightly due to him being a shell of his former self and by being Valuev's boxing idol. I may be wrong but it looked to me as though Valuev was afraid to pull the trigger on Holyfield in their fight..
I'd love to see Haye win in devastating fashion but he doesn't have great stamina and Valuev has an iron chin..if Haye can reach it!
Robatr0n said:
tuscaneer said:
haye by wide points margin, follow the blueprint laid down by holyfield.UNLESS he gets cocky and gets tagged.valuev aint no klitschko in the power stakes but then haye`s not exactly jake la motta is he?
Hmmmm maybe. In my opinion Holyfield won that fight but was robbed by the home judges but that said, Haye is no Holyfield.We'll see how it all pans out but I got the distinct impression that Valuev was taking Holyfield lightly due to him being a shell of his former self and by being Valuev's boxing idol. I may be wrong but it looked to me as though Valuev was afraid to pull the trigger on Holyfield in their fight..
I'd love to see Haye win in devastating fashion but he doesn't have great stamina and Valuev has an iron chin..if Haye can reach it!
i suppose i`m jumping in a bit quick there and being unkind to valuev who has shown impovement over the last few years.i don`t think valuev would first take holyfield too lightly and then back off during the fight.bottom line is holyfield frustrated the s
t out of him and he couldn`t find the answer.holyfield is also about 100 yrs old and thus haye should punch much crisper for longer.
these are all moot points anyway,look at what vitali has just done to arreola, the saviour of american boxing! vitali/wlad, regardless of lennox lewis`s comments to the contrary are better than the rest of the top 10 combined.if i was haye,valuev ,whoever, i would have watched vitali at arguably his destructive best at 38 and be thinking this guy could do this for another decade.
t out of him and he couldn`t find the answer.holyfield is also about 100 yrs old and thus haye should punch much crisper for longer.these are all moot points anyway,look at what vitali has just done to arreola, the saviour of american boxing! vitali/wlad, regardless of lennox lewis`s comments to the contrary are better than the rest of the top 10 combined.if i was haye,valuev ,whoever, i would have watched vitali at arguably his destructive best at 38 and be thinking this guy could do this for another decade.
As others have intimated, Haye should take this if he doesn't get sloppy. Might not be a knock-out but a big points win is well within his capability.
My only reservation (and its not much of one) is that he's a blown-up cruiserweight fighting at Heavyweight against the biggest heavyweight who has ever climbed into the ring.
That said, my first paragraph still stands.
My only reservation (and its not much of one) is that he's a blown-up cruiserweight fighting at Heavyweight against the biggest heavyweight who has ever climbed into the ring.
That said, my first paragraph still stands.
Speedracer329 said:
DJC said:
Is that 2 massive pints he is holding?
As opposed to a "normal" pint? 
Massive size difference but Haye's mobility & better punching power should see him home, barring a daft mistake. Valuev is huge yes, but a chin is a chin, connect & bye bye!!
Robatr0n said:
But I do happen to agree that any man can be levelled with a punch from another man of equal weight.
EFAQuestion is can a natural Cruiserweight knock out a man that no heavyweight has even vaguely looked like knocking out? I'm not so sure.
Still think Haye on (big) points but it'll take something extraordinary to topple this Big Foot.
im said:
Robatr0n said:
But I do happen to agree that any man can be levelled with a punch from another man of equal weight.
EFAQuestion is can a natural Cruiserweight knock out a man that no heavyweight has even vaguely looked like knocking out? I'm not so sure.
Still think Haye on (big) points but it'll take something extraordinary to topple this Big Foot.
This is still some way short of the 20+ stone Valuev will enter the ring with
dirty boy said:
Haye hasn't been a natural cruiserweight for quite some time, and has always found it difficult to make weight
On Soccer AM on the Saturday just gone Haye was a guest and he described himself as "A Natural Cruiserweight".
Mind you - he may just have been trying to widen the gap between himself & Valuev even more than is already glaringly obviouse to everyone with at least 1 working eye in order to sell a few more tickets.
...none-the-less HE did say it.
But I agree - I think he'll always struggle to get down to Cruiserweight from now on.
im said:
dirty boy said:
Haye hasn't been a natural cruiserweight for quite some time, and has always found it difficult to make weight
On Soccer AM on the Saturday just gone Haye was a guest and he described himself as "A Natural Cruiserweight".Mind you - he may just have been trying to widen the gap between himself & Valuev even more than is already glaringly obviouse to everyone with at least 1 working eye in order to sell a few more tickets.
...none-the-less HE did say it.
But I agree - I think he'll always struggle to get down to Cruiserweight from now on.
k!)Haye is a fantastic promoter, he'll be bigging up the size difference no doubt, he's definately not a 'natural' cruiser.
I'm interested, but not enough to pay to watch it.
Typical response by Haye after a fight he is not even in, is that he'd have destroyed them both with his Haye maker, or something or other.
Whether he is a natural cruiserweight or heavyweight, his chin certainly doesn't belong in the heavyweight division.
Remember Herbie Hide against Bowe. Every time he got tagged he got dropped. Haye should have the speed to get away but IF he is constantly running around the ring, his stamina may see him stuck in a corner, which could be disastrous.
Typical response by Haye after a fight he is not even in, is that he'd have destroyed them both with his Haye maker, or something or other.
Whether he is a natural cruiserweight or heavyweight, his chin certainly doesn't belong in the heavyweight division.
Remember Herbie Hide against Bowe. Every time he got tagged he got dropped. Haye should have the speed to get away but IF he is constantly running around the ring, his stamina may see him stuck in a corner, which could be disastrous.
haye as a heavyweight in any other era would have been fine.rocky marciano was 5ft 10 and about 13 stone.dempsey and the heavys of his era were averaging 12/13 stone.into the 60`s/70`s ali or frasier weren`t that much heavier.HOWEVER these russian/ukrainian/uzbek giants all seem to average 6ft 6 6ft 7+ and all seem to be 230-240lb+.i think it`s alittle more than just bulk though.how many american giants have tried and failed.crucially, big fellas who have switched to boxing from american football etc. are just that.big blokes with no root knowledge of the sport.look at the amateur credentials of these soviet fighters.multiple world champions with (in some cases) 100+ fights from a very young age before even turning pro.it`s all these lads know and is the root of why they are now so dominant.couple that with good old fashioned hunger.nothing produces better fighters than a depression and the old soviet block has certainly had it`s share of that
Edited by tuscaneer on Tuesday 29th September 07:39
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