Dwain Chambers

[Holst]

Im just watching the athletics and Dwain chambers is competing again.

After being banned for taking drugs (THG) he has completed his ban and is running again.

I dont understand why he wasnt given a lifetime ban, I think it would be embassasing for UK athletics to have him in the UK squad.

Do you think he deserves a second chance?

[scoobychris26]

Didnt he try and fail at American Football when he was banned?

[Holst]

scoobychris26 said:

Didnt he try and fail at American Football when he was banned?

yes

[anonymous-user]

Holst said:

Im just watching the athletics and Dwain chambers is competing again.

After being banned for taking drugs (THG) he has completed his ban and is running again.

I dont understand why he wasnt given a lifetime ban, I think it would be embassasing for UK athletics to have him in the UK squad.

Do you think he deserves a second chance?

It seemed that his words last year have done more damage than the ban itself. Essentially he was quoted as saying that you have to use drugs to be successful, or at the very least, be running against someone who's having a very bad day, whilst on steroids.

Not quite the image the UK athletics commitee want. However, assuming he's clean now, they should judge his selection based on today's performance, although his comments last year wont go away in a hurry IMO.

[Mark V8]

Is'nt this the guy who recently put himself forward as a paid consultant on drugs in sport, reasoning 'use a thief to catch a thief' or some such...? Cheeky tw@t.
Should be unceremoniously booted out of UK athletics forever with much publicity to send a deterrent message IMO.

[Broccers]

Do you feel the same about cheating in motorsport ?

[ewenm]

There are lots of people back racing after 2 year bans, as permitted by the IAAF rules. Until the IAAF or UKA change their rules (UKA are looking at changing our rules at the moment, but it takes time), Chambers should be judged within the current rule framework. It does feel wrong but right now he's within the rules.

[_ian_]

He should be banned for life no question.

He didn't accidently take drugs he knew exactly what he was doing and had the audacity to proclaim himself clean when competing.

So what if he might not be on it now, his physique has the benefits from the drugs that he took which enabled him to train harder and longer and recover faster. Thats still gonna be there in some shape or form so for me he's still benefiting from the drugs.

[tigger1]

Holst said:

scoobychris26 said:

Didnt he try and fail at American Football when he was banned?

yes

No.

He went to the training camp for NFL Europe. Got a place playing for a team (and was apparently very good for a rookie) - he then broke his foot (stress fracture) and shortly after that the NFL decided to completely drop the NFL Europe league.

So no, he didn't fail at it.

Like many in the sport, he fell into the win at all costs trap. He will have to live with suspicion for the rest of his life, but currently, as the rules stand, he has a right to compete - and should be selected for the team going to the indoors.

There's a long list of footballers who've served bans...but oddly football seems very forgiving of past drug use, unlike athletics.

[Highway Star]

ewenm said:

There are lots of people back racing after 2 year bans, as permitted by the IAAF rules. Until the IAAF or UKA change their rules (UKA are looking at changing our rules at the moment, but it takes time), Chambers should be judged within the current rule framework. It does feel wrong but right now he's within the rules.

Exactly this. Chambers is merely working within the rules as they stand currently. He served his two year ban and is now back competing.

Whether he should be able to compete again given he's been caught is a completely separate issue.

UKA need to decide how they want to deal with drugs cheats, if they want them out of the sport permanently, they (and IAAF) need to have a blanket life ban to ensure they are permanently persona non grata. They can't have a two year ban system and then carp when a guy serves his time and then wants to run again.

Chambers has been an idiot in the past, but having grown up in athletics at the same time as him (competed together at junior meets, English Schools, AAA etc.), he is a talented athlete.

Edited by Highway Star on Monday 11th February 14:27

[Fittster]

To those calling for Dwain Chambers to be banned for life want to see Christine Ohuruogu also banned?

Personally I don't think it's possible to stop sports men and women using drugs, it's been going on for years and the crack downs/testing don't seem to have any impact.

I'd like to see them allow the use of drugs, even playing field for all.

[ewenm]

Fittster said:

To those calling for Dwain Chambers to be banned for life want to see Christine Ohuruogu also banned?

Personally I don't think it's possible to stop sports men and women using drugs, it's been going on for years and the crack downs/testing don't seem to have any impact.

I'd like to see them allow the use of drugs, even playing field for all.

So it should be a competition between the best chemists then? The richest athletes/federations could employ the best pharmacist...

The difference between Chambers and Ohuruogu is that Chambers has failed a test, CO hasn't. They've both served their punishments as set out in the rules. Chambers can only be banned for life if he's caught again or the rules change.

[Fittster]

ewenm said:

Fittster said:

To those calling for Dwain Chambers to be banned for life want to see Christine Ohuruogu also banned?

Personally I don't think it's possible to stop sports men and women using drugs, it's been going on for years and the crack downs/testing don't seem to have any impact.

I'd like to see them allow the use of drugs, even playing field for all.

So it should be a competition between the best chemists then? The richest athletes/federations could employ the best pharmacist...

The difference between Chambers and Ohuruogu is that Chambers has failed a test, CO hasn't. They've both served their punishments as set out in the rules. Chambers can only be banned for life if he's caught again or the rules change.

Today the richest employee the best coaches, have the bst facilities and the best pharmacist...

Ohuruogu missed/forgot/avoided drug tests which according to the rule book is as bad. If the organises want to be consistent she has to face the same treatment.

[ewenm]

Fittster said:

ewenm said:

Fittster said:

To those calling for Dwain Chambers to be banned for life want to see Christine Ohuruogu also banned?

Personally I don't think it's possible to stop sports men and women using drugs, it's been going on for years and the crack downs/testing don't seem to have any impact.

I'd like to see them allow the use of drugs, even playing field for all.

So it should be a competition between the best chemists then? The richest athletes/federations could employ the best pharmacist...

The difference between Chambers and Ohuruogu is that Chambers has failed a test, CO hasn't. They've both served their punishments as set out in the rules. Chambers can only be banned for life if he's caught again or the rules change.

Today the richest employee the best coaches, have the bst facilities and the best pharmacist...

Not true - Kenya and Ethiopia aren't the richest or have the best facilities but dominate the distance world. Cynics say this is drugs, realists (and those that know the athletes personally) say most of it is talent and hard work. Of course there will be cheats - there are in every walk of life. After all, why have any laws in society at all? Just make everything legal and see who does best.

Fittster said:

Ohuruogu missed/forgot/avoided drug tests which according to the rule book is as bad. If the organises want to be consistent she has to face the same treatment.

And she served the punishment according to the rule book. Don't see your point; the authorities have to be consistent to the rules, not to individual athletes. She got a lifetime ban from the BOA, appealed it (as Chambers almost certainly will do too) and won the appeal. IIRC the appeal cited that at no point had any of the authorities detected any "intent to deceive" on her part. I don't think Chambers will be able to say the same...

[Chrispy Porker]

I think there should be 2 classes of athletics, and 2 sets of records.
1, Take what you like.
2. Clean. With rigourous testing. Test positive life ban. No ifs, no buts.

[Fittster]

ewenm said:

Not true - Kenya and Ethiopia aren't the richest or have the best facilities but dominate the distance world. Cynics say this is drugs, realists (and those that know the athletes personally) say most of it is talent and hard work. Of course there will be cheats - there are in every walk of life. After all, why have any laws in society at all? Just make everything legal and see who does best.

Kenya and Ethiopian athletes have a physiological advantage in long distance events, as those with a west african heritage do in sprints (or maybe all white sprinters are lazy gits). There is no even playing field.

Currently some people use drugs and some don't, bans have had no effect.

ewenm said:

And she served the punishment according to the rule book. Don't see your point; the authorities have to be consistent to the rules, not to individual athletes. She got a lifetime ban from the BOA, appealed it (as Chambers almost certainly will do too) and won the appeal. IIRC the appeal cited that at no point had any of the authorities detected any "intent to deceive" on her part. I don't think Chambers will be able to say the same...

Chambers biggest crime is to be honest unlike virtually all others who have failed or dodged drugs tests. There is no reason why he shouldn't compete in the trials when the following list of people can who also failed/missed drugs tests are welcome:

Carl Myerscough,
Tim Don,
Peter Cousins,
Christine Ohuruogu

[rupert the dog]

Fittster said:

To those calling for Dwain Chambers to be banned for life want to see Christine Ohuruogu also banned?

One word reply: Yes.

[ewenm]

Fittster - I still don't understand your point. Everyone you listed (inc Chambers) broke the rules, be it a failed test or 3 missed tests (these are DIFFERENT transgressions of the rules remember) and each of them has served the required ban and can now compete at the trials.

The only lifetime ban around is the BOA one which is appealable, but no guarantee of that being successful.

As for East Africans being unbeatable over endurance events - Paula Radcliffe and Craig Mottram immediately spring to mind. 2 athletes who show what can be done with talent and a LOT of very hard work, just like most athletes in Ethiopia/Kenya.

Anyway, Chambers has been picked for Valencia - the only decision UKA could reasonably reach within their own rules. It seems to me he's been treated exactly equally to everyone else.

If people want a different outcome, they need to CHANGE the rules not make exceptions to them. We may see this happen in the next few months. Personally I'd like a lifetime ban for any athlete caught, but then I don't agree that most athletes are on drugs.

[Fittster]

ewenm said:

Fittster - I still don't understand your point. Everyone you listed (inc Chambers) broke the rules, be it a failed test or 3 missed tests (these are DIFFERENT transgressions of the rules remember) and each of them has served the required ban and can now compete at the trials.

The difference is that Dwain Chambers is being treated with vastly more hostility by UK Athletics than other people who either failed tests or avoided them.

[tigger1]

BBC story

Looks like Chambers is going to struggle for race practice, as he's going to be black-balled by the promoters.