Football Violence
Discussion
It really is back, isn't it?
Following Gorvids thread about Uniteds' match on Wednesday More here and then more trouble at the Spurs game in Sevilla Some more, its not a good sign.
To be fair, I've watched games 'in the flesh' all my life, at many levels. You always did see the odd skirmish but over the last 2 or 3 seasons its gradually swung back round to the dark days again.
What's the deal ? Is it in some way related to world affairs, I wonder ?
Following Gorvids thread about Uniteds' match on Wednesday More here and then more trouble at the Spurs game in Sevilla Some more, its not a good sign.
To be fair, I've watched games 'in the flesh' all my life, at many levels. You always did see the odd skirmish but over the last 2 or 3 seasons its gradually swung back round to the dark days again.
What's the deal ? Is it in some way related to world affairs, I wonder ?
How come celtic managed to go to milan with no trouble at all? I t amazes me that theres still trouble wherever english teams go despite the hoodlums being banned? The mentality of these people who rush barriers and retaliate to italian hooligans then throw their hands up in horror when some local bobbies beat them up leaves a lot to be desired. Judging by the news pictures of the man u fans getting a beating, it looks like they deserved all they got and the only thing missing was the same being dished out to the roma fans.
deevlash said:
The mentality of these people who rush barriers and retaliate to italian hooligans then throw their hands up in horror when some local bobbies beat them up leaves a lot to be desired. Judging by the news pictures of the man u fans getting a beating, it looks like they deserved all they got and the only thing missing was the same being dished out to the roma fans.
And the innocent Fans in the same stand who got battered too? One woman man utd fan who was there reported on the radio this morning that one of The Italian policeman actually had to protect her from his own Policeman...That says alot to me ...
Ballistic Banana said:
deevlash said:
The mentality of these people who rush barriers and retaliate to italian hooligans then throw their hands up in horror when some local bobbies beat them up leaves a lot to be desired. Judging by the news pictures of the man u fans getting a beating, it looks like they deserved all they got and the only thing missing was the same being dished out to the roma fans.
And the innocent Fans in the same stand who got battered too? One woman man utd fan who was there reported on the radio this morning that one of The Italian policeman actually had to protect her from his own Policeman...That says alot to me ...
I take the reports from fans involved with a pinch of salt, theyre hardly likely to say they were screaming abuse and tossing chairs are they? The guys kaid up in hospital didnt exactly look like shrinking violets.
deevlash said:
How come celtic managed to go to milan with no trouble at all?
Not sure.
However, when Scotland visited Italy (Bari?) recently there was terrible violence involving Scottish fans v. Italian thugs (organised from many Italian clubs) in the city.
Don't assume this is an English problem or cause.
The 'Ultras' basically run Italian football and their clubs.
But I don't want to go down the route of blaming one country, everyone is at it. There are no shrinking violets in Scotland either, by the way. But I'm sure you're aware of that.
lazyitus said:
deevlash said:
How come celtic managed to go to milan with no trouble at all?
Not sure.
However, when Scotland visited Italy (Bari?) recently there was terrible violence involving Scottish fans v. Italian thugs (organised from many Italian clubs) in the city.
Don't assume this is an English problem or cause.
The 'Ultras' basically run Italian football and their clubs.
But I don't want to go down the route of blaming one country, everyone is at it. There are no shrinking violets in Scotland either, by the way. But I'm sure you're aware of that.
I wouldnt have said terrible violence, it barely made the news up here. Obviously Scotland has a hooligan problem aswell but its almost insignificant these days. Whilst Italy have a terrible hooligan problem and I have no idea why they havent been kicked out of european competitions yet English clubs do still seem to attract trouble. Whether this is a hangover from the old days of english hooligans and other countries wanting to give some back Im not sure but there does seem to be a lot of associated trouble creeping back into the english game.
deevlash said:
lazyitus said:
deevlash said:
How come celtic managed to go to milan with no trouble at all?
Not sure.
However, when Scotland visited Italy (Bari?) recently there was terrible violence involving Scottish fans v. Italian thugs (organised from many Italian clubs) in the city.
Don't assume this is an English problem or cause.
The 'Ultras' basically run Italian football and their clubs.
But I don't want to go down the route of blaming one country, everyone is at it. There are no shrinking violets in Scotland either, by the way. But I'm sure you're aware of that.
I wouldnt have said terrible violence, it barely made the news up here. Obviously Scotland has a hooligan problem aswell but its almost insignificant these days. Whilst Italy have a terrible hooligan problem and I have no idea why they havent been kicked out of european competitions yet English clubs do still seem to attract trouble. Whether this is a hangover from the old days of english hooligans and other countries wanting to give some back Im not sure but there does seem to be a lot of associated trouble creeping back into the english game.
Well I suppose the English game has a far bigger audience abroad than Scottish football.
Perhaps this is the reason that it attracts more attention ?
lazyitus said:
deevlash said:
lazyitus said:
deevlash said:
How come celtic managed to go to milan with no trouble at all?
Not sure.
However, when Scotland visited Italy (Bari?) recently there was terrible violence involving Scottish fans v. Italian thugs (organised from many Italian clubs) in the city.
Don't assume this is an English problem or cause.
The 'Ultras' basically run Italian football and their clubs.
But I don't want to go down the route of blaming one country, everyone is at it. There are no shrinking violets in Scotland either, by the way. But I'm sure you're aware of that.
I wouldnt have said terrible violence, it barely made the news up here. Obviously Scotland has a hooligan problem aswell but its almost insignificant these days. Whilst Italy have a terrible hooligan problem and I have no idea why they havent been kicked out of european competitions yet English clubs do still seem to attract trouble. Whether this is a hangover from the old days of english hooligans and other countries wanting to give some back Im not sure but there does seem to be a lot of associated trouble creeping back into the english game.
Well I suppose the English game has a far bigger audience abroad than Scottish football.
Perhaps this is the reason that it attracts more attention ?
Id argue that Rangers and Celtic in particular have a similiar appeal, they took 80,000 people to the uefa cup final and came away with the first ever fair play trophy to be awarded to a set of fans. In the case of national sides theres probably more interest in the English team, if only to see how such a team of such supposed talents can contrive to be so average!
deevlash said:
Id argue that Rangers and Celtic in particular have a similiar appeal
Yeah, maybe combined. Argue all you want but the only people interested in Scottish football are Scots and a few people in Essex who have Burberry scarves tied round their pelvis and they're that pissed that they think they've got kilts on. deevlash said:
they took 80,000 people to the uefa cup final and came away with the first ever fair play trophy to be awarded to a set of fans.
You were meant to come away with the cup ! Its a learning curve mate.
deevlash said:
In the case of national sides theres probably more interest in the English team, if only to see how such a team of such supposed talents can contrive to be so average!
I'll give you that one. England ARE currently shite. Not to worry, WE'LL go after that fair play award instead.
lazyitus said:
deevlash said:
Id argue that Rangers and Celtic in particular have a similiar appeal
Yeah, maybe combined. Argue all you want but the only people interested in Scottish football are Scots and a few people in Essex who have Burberry scarves tied round their pelvis and they're that pissed that they think they've got kilts on. deevlash said:
they took 80,000 people to the uefa cup final and came away with the first ever fair play trophy to be awarded to a set of fans.
You were meant to come away with the cup ! Its a learning curve mate.
deevlash said:
In the case of national sides theres probably more interest in the English team, if only to see how such a team of such supposed talents can contrive to be so average!
I'll give you that one. England ARE currently shite. Not to worry, WE'LL go after that fair play award instead.
Im not even a rangers or a celtic fan! Aberdeen for me
shame I was 1 year old at the time though...deevlash said:
Ballistic Banana said:
deevlash said:
The mentality of these people who rush barriers and retaliate to italian hooligans then throw their hands up in horror when some local bobbies beat them up leaves a lot to be desired. Judging by the news pictures of the man u fans getting a beating, it looks like they deserved all they got and the only thing missing was the same being dished out to the roma fans.
And the innocent Fans in the same stand who got battered too? One woman man utd fan who was there reported on the radio this morning that one of The Italian policeman actually had to protect her from his own Policeman...That says alot to me ...
I take the reports from fans involved with a pinch of salt, theyre hardly likely to say they were screaming abuse and tossing chairs are they? The guys kaid up in hospital didnt exactly look like shrinking violets.
Yep so do I..In Fact I am so open minded about most things that get in trouble for it.Always happy to see/Hear anything from from both sides of the fence. To say they deserved all they got really irks me, now I dont really know how serious or in which way you really meant that...thats text for you.
I dont know whats going on atm in Europe every one seems to be kicking of "IN" the ground.. This stopped in England a long time go. Its organised by whoever, wherever, on match day now.Thast a Northern Europe thing FWIK.
BB
Ballistic Banana said:
deevlash said:
Ballistic Banana said:
deevlash said:
The mentality of these people who rush barriers and retaliate to italian hooligans then throw their hands up in horror when some local bobbies beat them up leaves a lot to be desired. Judging by the news pictures of the man u fans getting a beating, it looks like they deserved all they got and the only thing missing was the same being dished out to the roma fans.
And the innocent Fans in the same stand who got battered too? One woman man utd fan who was there reported on the radio this morning that one of The Italian policeman actually had to protect her from his own Policeman...That says alot to me ...
I take the reports from fans involved with a pinch of salt, theyre hardly likely to say they were screaming abuse and tossing chairs are they? The guys kaid up in hospital didnt exactly look like shrinking violets.
Yep so do I..In Fact I am so open minded about most things that get in trouble for it.Always happy to see/Hear anything from from both sides of the fence. To say they deserved all they got really irks me, now I dont really know how serious or in which way you really meant that...thats text for you.
I dont know whats going on atm in Europe every one seems to be kicking of "IN" the ground.. This stopped in England a long time go. Its organised by whoever, wherever, on match day now.Thast a Northern Europe thing FWIK.
BB
Its happened again in a different country this time, http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/footb In the ground again too. european wide conspiracy by the police against england fans? Or a worrying return to a bunch of louts who dont know how to behave in a foreign country? Doesnt happen at rugby matches.
deevlash said:
Doesnt happen at rugby matches.
And??? Unfortunately whilst it seems England has by and large put its house in order at home with respect to football violence, it appears a lot of countries abroad are no further on than where we were in the late 70s and 80s. The protection and stewarding of away fans in European games is appalling compared to here, where police can disperse crowds and get the away fans on their way very quickly indeed - when was the last time you heard of away fans having to be locked in for 90 minutes after a match?
Football violence has NEVER and i'll repeat NEVER fully gone from the English game.
A very good mate of mine was battered unconscious in a nightclub in Croydon a couple of months ago and it was a result of organised football violence, some Charlton supporters had come back from Portsmouth and had pre-arranged a meet with a group of Palace supporters in Croydon who said they were going to be in a certain nightclub but but turned out to be some mix up over the nightclub and they ended up in the same nightclub as my mates were in (also Palace supporters) the result was my mate was in hospital for a couple of weeks he has been signed off of work for 2 months, he suffered from a fractured skull in several places, i was told that cctv shows several people standing over him kicking him in the head and body while he was defenceless on the floor, Blood was pouring out of his ears, he has memory loss from the night and 2 weeks he was in hospital (good job too) he suffers short memory loss (always repeating himself) he is on 15 tablets a day to relieve pain etc and doesn't understand that he has these injuries.
To say that violence is back....................it never left..........i have witnessed other occations (not this bad) in recent times that prove it has never left the game.
A very good mate of mine was battered unconscious in a nightclub in Croydon a couple of months ago and it was a result of organised football violence, some Charlton supporters had come back from Portsmouth and had pre-arranged a meet with a group of Palace supporters in Croydon who said they were going to be in a certain nightclub but but turned out to be some mix up over the nightclub and they ended up in the same nightclub as my mates were in (also Palace supporters) the result was my mate was in hospital for a couple of weeks he has been signed off of work for 2 months, he suffered from a fractured skull in several places, i was told that cctv shows several people standing over him kicking him in the head and body while he was defenceless on the floor, Blood was pouring out of his ears, he has memory loss from the night and 2 weeks he was in hospital (good job too) he suffers short memory loss (always repeating himself) he is on 15 tablets a day to relieve pain etc and doesn't understand that he has these injuries.
To say that violence is back....................it never left..........i have witnessed other occations (not this bad) in recent times that prove it has never left the game.
The Hood said:
Football violence has NEVER and i'll repeat NEVER fully gone from the English game.
A very good mate of mine was battered unconscious in a nightclub in Croydon a couple of months ago and it was a result of organised football violence, some Charlton supporters had come back from Portsmouth and had pre-arranged a meet with a group of Palace supporters in Croydon who said they were going to be in a certain nightclub but but turned out to be some mix up over the nightclub and they ended up in the same nightclub as my mates were in (also Palace supporters) the result was my mate was in hospital for a couple of weeks he has been signed off of work for 2 months, he suffered from a fractured skull in several places, i was told that cctv shows several people standing over him kicking him in the head and body while he was defenceless on the floor, Blood was pouring out of his ears, he has memory loss from the night and 2 weeks he was in hospital (good job too) he suffers short memory loss (always repeating himself) he is on 15 tablets a day to relieve pain etc and doesn't understand that he has these injuries.
To say that violence is back....................it never left..........i have witnessed other occations (not this bad) in recent times that prove it has never left the game.
A sad story and I wish your friend well, but this is completely different to what used to happen in the bad old days. The violence has been driven underground and away from the stadia. It is now loosely connected to football, as opposed to once really having been a part.A very good mate of mine was battered unconscious in a nightclub in Croydon a couple of months ago and it was a result of organised football violence, some Charlton supporters had come back from Portsmouth and had pre-arranged a meet with a group of Palace supporters in Croydon who said they were going to be in a certain nightclub but but turned out to be some mix up over the nightclub and they ended up in the same nightclub as my mates were in (also Palace supporters) the result was my mate was in hospital for a couple of weeks he has been signed off of work for 2 months, he suffered from a fractured skull in several places, i was told that cctv shows several people standing over him kicking him in the head and body while he was defenceless on the floor, Blood was pouring out of his ears, he has memory loss from the night and 2 weeks he was in hospital (good job too) he suffers short memory loss (always repeating himself) he is on 15 tablets a day to relieve pain etc and doesn't understand that he has these injuries.
To say that violence is back....................it never left..........i have witnessed other occations (not this bad) in recent times that prove it has never left the game.
puggit said:
The Hood said:
Football violence has NEVER and i'll repeat NEVER fully gone from the English game.
A very good mate of mine was battered unconscious in a nightclub in Croydon a couple of months ago and it was a result of organised football violence, some Charlton supporters had come back from Portsmouth and had pre-arranged a meet with a group of Palace supporters in Croydon who said they were going to be in a certain nightclub but but turned out to be some mix up over the nightclub and they ended up in the same nightclub as my mates were in (also Palace supporters) the result was my mate was in hospital for a couple of weeks he has been signed off of work for 2 months, he suffered from a fractured skull in several places, i was told that cctv shows several people standing over him kicking him in the head and body while he was defenceless on the floor, Blood was pouring out of his ears, he has memory loss from the night and 2 weeks he was in hospital (good job too) he suffers short memory loss (always repeating himself) he is on 15 tablets a day to relieve pain etc and doesn't understand that he has these injuries.
To say that violence is back....................it never left..........i have witnessed other occations (not this bad) in recent times that prove it has never left the game.
A sad story and I wish your friend well, but this is completely different to what used to happen in the bad old days. The violence has been driven underground and away from the stadia. It is now loosely connected to football, as opposed to once really having been a part.A very good mate of mine was battered unconscious in a nightclub in Croydon a couple of months ago and it was a result of organised football violence, some Charlton supporters had come back from Portsmouth and had pre-arranged a meet with a group of Palace supporters in Croydon who said they were going to be in a certain nightclub but but turned out to be some mix up over the nightclub and they ended up in the same nightclub as my mates were in (also Palace supporters) the result was my mate was in hospital for a couple of weeks he has been signed off of work for 2 months, he suffered from a fractured skull in several places, i was told that cctv shows several people standing over him kicking him in the head and body while he was defenceless on the floor, Blood was pouring out of his ears, he has memory loss from the night and 2 weeks he was in hospital (good job too) he suffers short memory loss (always repeating himself) he is on 15 tablets a day to relieve pain etc and doesn't understand that he has these injuries.
To say that violence is back....................it never left..........i have witnessed other occations (not this bad) in recent times that prove it has never left the game.
I know what your saying re. the underground and away from stadia but i disagree with the loosely connected to football, the fact that the reference i made was organised by two groups of thugs one from Charlton and one from Palace.
Another story in recent times (well about 4 or 5 years ago)............Crystal Palace have always had a rivalry with Brighton and i have been to lots of games between the two teams since the 80's and whan the two teams eventually came across each other in the same division there was all sorts of trouble inside and outside the ground, on a game at The Withdean we (Palace) were held in after the game and we were pelted with bricks and stones while the Brighton fans were dispersing from the ground (we were sitting ducks) then when we were escorted back to the station there was several incidents in the escort with Brighton fans that had managed to get into the escort.
antony moxey said:
deevlash said:
Doesnt happen at rugby matches.
And??? Unfortunately whilst it seems England has by and large put its house in order at home with respect to football violence, it appears a lot of countries abroad are no further on than where we were in the late 70s and 80s. The protection and stewarding of away fans in European games is appalling compared to here, where police can disperse crowds and get the away fans on their way very quickly indeed - when was the last time you heard of away fans having to be locked in for 90 minutes after a match?
well the fact theres no trouble with hooligans or overzealous police at rugby matches despite them being policed by the same people would seem to suggest that the problematic factor in the recent problems would be moronic football fans.
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