Equal pay for women in sport - why/not

Equal pay for women in sport - why/not

Author
Discussion

DodgyGeezer

Original Poster:

42,391 posts

197 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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sadly I've just managed to cause a bit of a row with my daughter on the subject of equal pay for sportswomen. I know I can be a bit (lot!) of a dinosaur but I really can't see how or why women in sport can (or should) get equal pay - commercially it's not viable. As a counter to this I also haven't got a problem with women being paid more as models - it's the commercial reality.

Am I out of touch?

NDA

22,334 posts

232 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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I guess it's about eyeballs.... do more people watch mens football, for example, than women's football? Same with cricket and rugby.

Men and women win the same amount in Wimbledon - despite the fact that the mens game is a much longer affair. I recall a women's final being over in under an hour one year.

sc0tt

18,125 posts

208 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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How much revenue does womens football generate compared to mens?

I’d say therein lies the answer.

Dromedary66

1,924 posts

145 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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ESPN pays US$25 million for its TV deal with the WNBA. In comparison, the value of the rights for US men’s basketball was US$2.6 billion as of 2019.

I expect a similar ratio is in place for the majority of other sports.

944 Man

1,814 posts

139 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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I have watched very, very little womens' football, but what I have seen was poor. During the World Cup, the Dutch goalkeeper wasn't good enough to play for our school team.

toasty

7,778 posts

227 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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NDA said:
I guess it's about eyeballs.... do more people watch mens football, for example, than women's football? Same with cricket and rugby.

Men and women win the same amount in Wimbledon - despite the fact that the mens game is a much longer affair. I recall a women's final being over in under an hour one year.
I've no issue whatsoever with women earning the same as men, providing they do the same job.

Women's tennis is a great example where this is clearly not the case. But then again, I don't watch tennis, so why do I care?




HTP99

23,294 posts

147 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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DodgyGeezer said:
sadly I've just managed to cause a bit of a row with my daughter on the subject of equal pay for sportswomen. I know I can be a bit (lot!) of a dinosaur but I really can't see how or why women in sport can (or should) get equal pay - commercially it's not viable. As a counter to this I also haven't got a problem with women being paid more as models - it's the commercial reality.

Am I out of touch?
Opinionated daughter, you will never, ever win, no matter what facts you put across to her, she is right......end of.

Fact is equal pay for womens sports just isn't viable as no one watches it, therefore it has a much lower income stream.


Edited by HTP99 on Sunday 25th July 12:58

A500leroy

5,591 posts

125 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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If it was really equal, why do you need womans football, formula W, womens rugby etc, why not just have all genders playing together in whichever sport and doing with the female version?

ChocolateFrog

28,637 posts

180 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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Even in sports where they play at the same time in front of the same audience the argument is pretty weak.

Take tennis. Not only do they play a lot less the pool of talent the best players come from is a fraction of the men's talent pool, yet they get paid exactly the same at most tournaments.

Equal pay in sports like football is plain fanciful.

Vickers_VC10

6,759 posts

212 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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I'd like to see the women cycle the extra 100km they didn't have to compared to men to earn equal lol

andyA700

3,315 posts

44 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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I generally believe in parity of wages for both sexes. The problem in sport as others have pointed out is skill and watchability. Would you be able to fill a 60,000 seater stadium, charge the same as you would for Premier league, to watch a top women's football match?
Bear in mind that in 2017, the US women's team lost a friendly against an U15 boys college team.

https://www.90min.com/posts/4833646-some-people-th...

motorizer

1,503 posts

178 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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Sports like football or basketball where the men don't even get equal pay, and superstars negotiate their own salaries via agents are probably a bad example.

I'm all for the men's and women's top prizes at individual events being the same...even if like tennis they play a bit less, they still have to beat the best.

Then again who cares if a rich person gets more than another rich person? Only really matters at the lower end of the professional scale where they're not earning riches.



Edited by motorizer on Sunday 25th July 14:37

andyA700

3,315 posts

44 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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Vickers_VC10 said:
I'd like to see the women cycle the extra 100km they didn't have to compared to men to earn equal lol
They could do it, but it would just be slower. In this year's national 24 hour time trial championships, 37 people finished and a woman finished in third place with 490 miles.

https://www.velouk.net/2021/07/19/result-rttc-nati...

In 1967 Beryl Burton set a record in the 12 hour championship of 277.25 miles which was further than the men's record. She actually caught the winner of the men's race.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beryl_Burton

Boom78

1,325 posts

55 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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ChocolateFrog said:
Even in sports where they play at the same time in front of the same audience the argument is pretty weak.

Take tennis. Not only do they play a lot less the pool of talent the best players come from is a fraction of the men's talent pool, yet they get paid exactly the same at most tournaments.

Equal pay in sports like football is plain fanciful.
Not sure sure, Andy Murray has amassed a fortune from tennis bigger than the Williams sisters combined, I’d say the Williams sisters are more globally known and dominated tennis. Not quite a level playing or paying field.

the tribester

2,601 posts

93 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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I'm all in favour of equal pay for equal work, but in tennis, the women don't do the equal work, far fewer games to win a match, why is that? And are the ability levels the same between the sexes? I'm sure it's been argued on here before what male seeded player could beat the women's number 1 seed, it was a surprising result.

In rugby union, the game is nowhere near the same level yet, not even the place kicking. Certainly they cannot attract the crowd or sponsor numbers yet.

What are the rules for the Tour de France, is that a male only event, or is there a women's event I've never heard of?

Sporky

7,277 posts

71 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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HTP99 said:
Fact is equal pay for womens sports just isn't viable as no one watches it, therefore it has a much lower income stream.
I offer this merely for consideration; women's sport doesn't get the same level of promotion as men's, and has therefore not had the same degree of development.

Perhaps if the pay was equalised the promoters might then equalise their efforts, and everyone (who likes watching sport) might benefit.

andyA700

3,315 posts

44 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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the tribester said:
I'm all in favour of equal pay for equal work, but in tennis, the women don't do the equal work, far fewer games to win a match, why is that? And are the ability levels the same between the sexes? I'm sure it's been argued on here before what male seeded player could beat the women's number 1 seed, it was a surprising result.

In rugby union, the game is nowhere near the same level yet, not even the place kicking. Certainly they cannot attract the crowd or sponsor numbers yet.

What are the rules for the Tour de France, is that a male only event, or is there a women's event I've never heard of?
There used to be a women's TdF and it looks as though they are starting again next year.

https://www.cyclingnews.com/races/tour-de-france-f...

toasty

7,778 posts

227 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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Boom78 said:
ChocolateFrog said:
Even in sports where they play at the same time in front of the same audience the argument is pretty weak.

Take tennis. Not only do they play a lot less the pool of talent the best players come from is a fraction of the men's talent pool, yet they get paid exactly the same at most tournaments.

Equal pay in sports like football is plain fanciful.
Not sure sure, Andy Murray has amassed a fortune from tennis bigger than the Williams sisters combined, I’d say the Williams sisters are more globally known and dominated tennis. Not quite a level playing or paying field.
A quick google and the Williams sisters have a net worth of $315m compared to Andy at a measly $165m

Boom78

1,325 posts

55 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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toasty said:
Boom78 said:
ChocolateFrog said:
Even in sports where they play at the same time in front of the same audience the argument is pretty weak.

Take tennis. Not only do they play a lot less the pool of talent the best players come from is a fraction of the men's talent pool, yet they get paid exactly the same at most tournaments.

Equal pay in sports like football is plain fanciful.
Not sure sure, Andy Murray has amassed a fortune from tennis bigger than the Williams sisters combined, I’d say the Williams sisters are more globally known and dominated tennis. Not quite a level playing or paying field.
A quick google and the Williams sisters have a net worth of $315m compared to Andy at a measly $165m
Ah, maybe it was based on actual winnings rather than sponsorships and tv work etc. My bad

ARFBY

499 posts

140 months

Sunday 25th July 2021
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The problem is, that most female athletes that want and expect equal pay, deliberately ignore the fact that male sports create substantially more revenue.

In general, as a percentage of revenue created; women get paid more than man do. Male athletes get paid more money because, a smaller percentage of a significantly larger revenue, is greater than the larger percentage of the much lower revenue that women sport creates.

2019 Women's Football World Cup generated approx. $131 million. Prize fund: $30 million, winners prize: $4 million = 3% of total income generated

2018 Men's Football World cup generated approx. $5.4 billion. Prize fund: $400 million, Winners prize $38 million = less than 1% total income generated