Improvements in performance down to?
Discussion
Following on from the Panorama programme tonight I'm wondering, when we talk about how athletes have got so much bigger, stronger, faster, better etc. and records continue to be broken - like the thread about rugby a while back - some claim steroids/PEDS and others refer to improvements in training, recovery, diet and supplements.
If the supplements that many athletes use have no benefit as the researchers pretty much claimed flat out then how has the human body/capacity changed so much over the past few decades?
Better training and nutrition regimes, or drugs?
If the supplements that many athletes use have no benefit as the researchers pretty much claimed flat out then how has the human body/capacity changed so much over the past few decades?
Better training and nutrition regimes, or drugs?
Training without a doubt.
I think everyone has a natural ability which training impacts to a greater or lesser degree.
Nutriition helps to a degree if you eat crap and drink beer then your performance will suffer. once you eat healthy I am not sure what is to be gained at the nth degree.
I think everyone has a natural ability which training impacts to a greater or lesser degree.
Nutriition helps to a degree if you eat crap and drink beer then your performance will suffer. once you eat healthy I am not sure what is to be gained at the nth degree.
Intelligent, specific, personalised training makes the biggest difference in endurance events IME. Everyone responds differently to training so developing an understanding of an athlete's specific requirements with a coach and having access to some analysis equipment to give it a scientific basis is key.
Combine that with more research into training techniques and more sharing of information nationally and internationally and you can tailor a program to an individual very well.
Combine that with more research into training techniques and more sharing of information nationally and internationally and you can tailor a program to an individual very well.
Overall I'd agree - training routines, periodisation etc. are so much more informed than they were, say a quarter of a century ago. But I also can't escape the nagging question about just how different have training protocols been over the past decade when records have still tended to fall even though the belief (well, official view) is that drug use has declined?
Athletes certainly trained fulltime and very hard even many years ago but the size, speed, jump ability, muscle to body weight ratio of athletes, especially those that feature the 'bigger' people in sports like rugby, NFL etc. seem to have changed drastically in a relatively short time.
Athletes certainly trained fulltime and very hard even many years ago but the size, speed, jump ability, muscle to body weight ratio of athletes, especially those that feature the 'bigger' people in sports like rugby, NFL etc. seem to have changed drastically in a relatively short time.
I know very little about power sports but from the viewpoint of a Rugby Union fan, the increased professionalism of the last decade has produced huge changes.
I'm sure drugs are present in every sport but I refuse to believe that the only way to win is to dope or that they are as rife as many like to think. That might be foolish but why else would I still compete? I've never been good enough to make it onto the out-of-competition testing lists but have been tested in competition - the stress of that was bad enough, worrying about whether I'd taken Lemsip or not, never mind if I was actually doping
I'm sure drugs are present in every sport but I refuse to believe that the only way to win is to dope or that they are as rife as many like to think. That might be foolish but why else would I still compete? I've never been good enough to make it onto the out-of-competition testing lists but have been tested in competition - the stress of that was bad enough, worrying about whether I'd taken Lemsip or not, never mind if I was actually doping
Lost_BMW said:
If the supplements that many athletes use have no benefit as the researchers pretty much claimed flat out then how has the human body/capacity changed so much over the past few decades?
Better training and nutrition regimes, or drugs?
Myself I do not believe the capacity of the body has changed. Just the amount of people being given chances. Who would have predicted that Bolt could finish races looking around at the crowds, and he isn't even close to the fastest human on record.Better training and nutrition regimes, or drugs?
As more people take part and compete in sport, we'll see advances. So many great athletes in the past, who had the right chances and didn't bottle it under pressure.
Was reading this week that the heaviest weights are lifted in the gym, the official records at events are not close. There are many factors in an athletes life, many things that go through their head on the day. There is still much capacity for progress to be made. IMO.
They didn't say they didn't work - they said they did not work any better than a balanced diet. You can spend £35 of a tub of brown powder with BCAA written on the outside or do an Obree and eat jam sandwiches and sardines on toast. One is cheaper and probably tastes better the other sounds "pro".
From my opinion of watching the program nearly everything they came out with was common sense and most people would know anyway.
Unfortunately we seem to have a lot of people in our country who aren't very bright and believe everything they see and hear. It just shows the power of targeted advertising/marketing especially when it plays right into the hands of very impressionable people. For a lot of people they are always looking for that magic ingredient - other than hard work - that will get them the physique/performance/strength that they want and are prepared to buy anything.
You tell someone if you take this x times a day and it 'might' help to improve performance then people will buy them. You just have to go on the myprotein website and look at some of the reviews for the vast range of random supplements they have - anecdotal eveidence is more than enough for a lot of people to base their opinion on.
In terms of myself I am a 400m runner and train hard and intensely so I admit I do take supplements. I take the following and the way I see it is;
Recovery drink after training = carbs + protein - I could swap this for real food but this is easier and I have a proper meal about 45mins later anyway.
Protein shake once a day when I am training very hard - could swap it for food but it is easier to have a drink.
Creatine - only supplement proven to work with intense exercise
Beta Alanine - proven (though not as well as creatine) to buffer lactic acid which is a large part of my training and therefore I feel helps me to do that extra rep in training - and Dai Greene and the other pro 400m runners use it! I accept that isn't a good reason but it works for me.
I could cover all of that with real food but it isn't practical due to cost/ease of preparation and the fact that creatine and beta alanine are only found in small doses naturally in food.
However I am fully aware that the 99.99% of doing well in any sport is hard work and regular rest but it doesn't harm to be aware of what factors can help you on your way as long as accept there is no magic ingredients. Other than erm...other things.
Unfortunately we seem to have a lot of people in our country who aren't very bright and believe everything they see and hear. It just shows the power of targeted advertising/marketing especially when it plays right into the hands of very impressionable people. For a lot of people they are always looking for that magic ingredient - other than hard work - that will get them the physique/performance/strength that they want and are prepared to buy anything.
You tell someone if you take this x times a day and it 'might' help to improve performance then people will buy them. You just have to go on the myprotein website and look at some of the reviews for the vast range of random supplements they have - anecdotal eveidence is more than enough for a lot of people to base their opinion on.
In terms of myself I am a 400m runner and train hard and intensely so I admit I do take supplements. I take the following and the way I see it is;
Recovery drink after training = carbs + protein - I could swap this for real food but this is easier and I have a proper meal about 45mins later anyway.
Protein shake once a day when I am training very hard - could swap it for food but it is easier to have a drink.
Creatine - only supplement proven to work with intense exercise
Beta Alanine - proven (though not as well as creatine) to buffer lactic acid which is a large part of my training and therefore I feel helps me to do that extra rep in training - and Dai Greene and the other pro 400m runners use it! I accept that isn't a good reason but it works for me.
I could cover all of that with real food but it isn't practical due to cost/ease of preparation and the fact that creatine and beta alanine are only found in small doses naturally in food.
However I am fully aware that the 99.99% of doing well in any sport is hard work and regular rest but it doesn't harm to be aware of what factors can help you on your way as long as accept there is no magic ingredients. Other than erm...other things.
To answer the question about what the performance improvements are down to imo is simply a much greater understanding of the body and the science/biomechanics behind it all.
Also these people are professional athletes and therefore their life revolves around training, everything they do is linked to optimum training and recovery.
For a lot of the top runners, it will be wake up, have some massage/physio before hand to get rid of any niggles, do the session, have a massage/physio afterwards, eat, have a nap, go to the gym do a session, have a massage afterwards, eat, do another run, eat, sleep etc....
There is a better understanding of the body and what the weak points are and where improvements can be made. For a runner one of the biggest things is simply being able to train consistently without injury. If you can keep your body in tip top shape by doing additional training such are core work, hip stability etc...and not get injured you can do more training and therefore run faster times.
Mo Farah is an example of that with how much additional work he does on top of just his running.
It just wasn't like that 20-30 years ago.
My coach has always told me that you have to work far harder as an 'almost elite' than an elite as you simply cannot train and recover like they can unless you have nothing else in your life but training.
IMO that's where the improvements come from.
Also these people are professional athletes and therefore their life revolves around training, everything they do is linked to optimum training and recovery.
For a lot of the top runners, it will be wake up, have some massage/physio before hand to get rid of any niggles, do the session, have a massage/physio afterwards, eat, have a nap, go to the gym do a session, have a massage afterwards, eat, do another run, eat, sleep etc....
There is a better understanding of the body and what the weak points are and where improvements can be made. For a runner one of the biggest things is simply being able to train consistently without injury. If you can keep your body in tip top shape by doing additional training such are core work, hip stability etc...and not get injured you can do more training and therefore run faster times.
Mo Farah is an example of that with how much additional work he does on top of just his running.
It just wasn't like that 20-30 years ago.
My coach has always told me that you have to work far harder as an 'almost elite' than an elite as you simply cannot train and recover like they can unless you have nothing else in your life but training.
IMO that's where the improvements come from.
0000 said:
I was quite pleased to see barefoot running got a look in, shocking how easily people trot out that cushioning and support are important and prevent injuries.
Do you mean barefoot or minimalist?There's very little of my weekly mileage I could do barefoot without shredding my feet, but plenty I can (and do) do in lightweight shoes. For me variety works best, some mileage in cushioned, supportive shoes (usually the slower stuff), some in lightweights (usually the faster stuff).
0000 said:
I was quite pleased to see barefoot running got a look in, shocking how easily people trot out that cushioning and support are important and prevent injuries.
A lot of barefoot is anecdotal though, yes some africans can run whole races at a world class level but that doesn't mean that we can or should.My view is like anything it has its good points and bad points, personally I will sometimes do a lap of the track barefoot after a session to warm down as I feel that it can help improve stability but I wouldn't do any more than that.
People have been wearing minimalist shoes for years - racing flats - but put a bit of science behind it and some 'experts' and it is suddenly the new big thing and the answer to all lower leg injuries.
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