Rugby Union - the finer details
Discussion
I enjoyed playing rugby at school as a boy growing up in Wales. I was not particularly good at it which is why I ended up on the wing most of the time (least likely to get passed to!). I never carried it on into adulthood as everyone else around me grew while I remained fairly slim. I would be killed on today’s field.
Jumping the gun very much indeed seeing as he is only 2 months old, but when my son grows up I will certainly be encouraging him to try his hand at what I consider to be one of the most respectable of sports.
Despite considering myself to have a reasonable knowledge of the game and a basic underdtanifng of each positions role, I was hoping the more experienced could open my eyes to the more detailed nuances and skills sets required for each position. The general basics for all players are a given (physicality, ability to tackle etc.) but I wonder, if you were planning on training in a position, what would you want to learn from the masters?
Things I am not offay with are for example the differences between tight/loose-head props, blind/open-side flanker, inside/outside centre. I don’t mean where they are positioned, I mean what they are expected to do i.e. is the open-side expected to be the scheming ball-winner, quick and agile to the breakdown; and the blind-side the protector, the stopper of the opposition half-backs?
What I essentially mean is, I can get a position guide off the BBC Sport website, but it won’t tell me how to be the best at those positions.
So if any rugby-gurus wish to give me any information to lock away in the “training my son to be the next big inside-centre” locker then thank you in advance.
Jumping the gun very much indeed seeing as he is only 2 months old, but when my son grows up I will certainly be encouraging him to try his hand at what I consider to be one of the most respectable of sports.
Despite considering myself to have a reasonable knowledge of the game and a basic underdtanifng of each positions role, I was hoping the more experienced could open my eyes to the more detailed nuances and skills sets required for each position. The general basics for all players are a given (physicality, ability to tackle etc.) but I wonder, if you were planning on training in a position, what would you want to learn from the masters?
Things I am not offay with are for example the differences between tight/loose-head props, blind/open-side flanker, inside/outside centre. I don’t mean where they are positioned, I mean what they are expected to do i.e. is the open-side expected to be the scheming ball-winner, quick and agile to the breakdown; and the blind-side the protector, the stopper of the opposition half-backs?
What I essentially mean is, I can get a position guide off the BBC Sport website, but it won’t tell me how to be the best at those positions.
So if any rugby-gurus wish to give me any information to lock away in the “training my son to be the next big inside-centre” locker then thank you in advance.
You could start with the RFU technical manuals, being Welsh you might instantaneously combust when you click the link though.
www.rfu.com/TakingPart/Coach/CoachResourceArchive/...
After that another area, is doing your rugby ready course, maybe your level 1, and attend the coaching updates in your area. Coaching updates are usually very informative with key points such as scrum and lineout covered once a season, and a variety of other areas covered.
www.rfu.com/TakingPart/Coach/CoachResourceArchive/...
After that another area, is doing your rugby ready course, maybe your level 1, and attend the coaching updates in your area. Coaching updates are usually very informative with key points such as scrum and lineout covered once a season, and a variety of other areas covered.
Most youth clubs don't even bother thinking about what position the kids will play until much later in life. Kids bodies have too much to growing to do to say what sort of size and build they will be until in later life - you might be a prop at 9 and end up being a scrum half at 18 for instance. Saying that - I know GB rowing go around schools measuring people's thigh and arm bones to see who will grow into the perfect rowing shape so they can get them rowing early!
Minis start from around 5 up, and in the younger games of tag we play (here in England anyway), the focus in on running and passing, with no contact or "complexities" (no tackling, scrums, lineouts or kicking). These come later when introduced bit by bit from 9 upwards.
However, if you were a fly half yourself for instance, it might make sense your boy will be a similar build (unless your wife is build like Martin Johnson!), either way there's no harm in going out to the park to practice kicking (as Jonny Wilkinson was reputed to have done with his dad endlessly), although they won't be using it until much later. In general I'd focus on handling skills, passing from both hands, catching, tricks that you see being introduced to the general game like reverse passing out the back door, side steps and dummies etc.
I remember as a boy, kids who had those skills drilled in at at early age were pretty handy players.
I remember a story about Will Greenwood talking about his dad (who was a pretty handy player and coach himself), knocking him out by accident as a boy when practicing how to run round an advancing open-side (his dad). Obviously that sort of training paid off!
Minis start from around 5 up, and in the younger games of tag we play (here in England anyway), the focus in on running and passing, with no contact or "complexities" (no tackling, scrums, lineouts or kicking). These come later when introduced bit by bit from 9 upwards.
However, if you were a fly half yourself for instance, it might make sense your boy will be a similar build (unless your wife is build like Martin Johnson!), either way there's no harm in going out to the park to practice kicking (as Jonny Wilkinson was reputed to have done with his dad endlessly), although they won't be using it until much later. In general I'd focus on handling skills, passing from both hands, catching, tricks that you see being introduced to the general game like reverse passing out the back door, side steps and dummies etc.
I remember as a boy, kids who had those skills drilled in at at early age were pretty handy players.
I remember a story about Will Greenwood talking about his dad (who was a pretty handy player and coach himself), knocking him out by accident as a boy when practicing how to run round an advancing open-side (his dad). Obviously that sort of training paid off!
TheGreatSoprendo said:
^^^ What he said. Don't worry too much about details like what position he should be playing. Just get a rugby ball and kick & pass it around. The most important thing at a young age is that it's fun.
This, this, this. My boy is 4 and I love spending time with him chucking a ball about. 
to all!As a coach helping to run mini-rugby at our club one of the most satisfying things was seeing apparantly hopeless kids find a niche or skill that suited them. Often they changed as they grew and experience changed.
As said above, fun is the most important thing. Getting in early at a club will help in confidence around the collision area. It's not like a football club where you can turn up week after week and not get a game. You will at a rugby club.
As said above, fun is the most important thing. Getting in early at a club will help in confidence around the collision area. It's not like a football club where you can turn up week after week and not get a game. You will at a rugby club.
You can get tiny rugby balls stress thibgs but they are fine for toddlers get then used to the shape of te ball and learn how to catch.
In fact teaching them how to catch and throw the ball are two key skills.
Learning the technical aspects well take then to watch or watch rugby on tv and make sure they understand what each move is for or why a penalty.
Also you can buy video games too which are rugby games do they would have a very good knowledge of the game.
But key is to have fun whatever the sport is forcing then to play a sport just because you like it isn't ideal.
In fact teaching them how to catch and throw the ball are two key skills.
Learning the technical aspects well take then to watch or watch rugby on tv and make sure they understand what each move is for or why a penalty.
Also you can buy video games too which are rugby games do they would have a very good knowledge of the game.
But key is to have fun whatever the sport is forcing then to play a sport just because you like it isn't ideal.
Being Welsh, you need to learn how not to dump somebody on their head and get sent off in probably the most important game in recent Welsh history. Edit: (tongue firmly in cheek BTW)
Other than that, just take your lad to watch some grass roots games when he's old enough....rugby isn't a game (in my experience) you can learn from books....you have to watch it and play it....
Getting involved in a club from an early age will be all the experience and knowledge required....
Other than that, just take your lad to watch some grass roots games when he's old enough....rugby isn't a game (in my experience) you can learn from books....you have to watch it and play it....
Getting involved in a club from an early age will be all the experience and knowledge required....
Rugby is a simple game
15 players
Ball has to go backwards
Pass the goal tine get points
Kick through the sticks points.
Line out
Scrum
Maul
Ruck
Drop kick
Offside.
Frankly that covers the basics up until a very decent age and as a child passing the ball and catching are key stills start with standing catching and throwing then try walking ten jogging then sprinting while doing the same.
Then run into a big MOFO sending him backwards as you charge through with the ball or if you have the agility sidestep him.
I remember at school I was always matched up against a giant 6'5" and brick shot house on the tackling training. He never bothered to sidestep instead me on touchline him on 22 sprinting towards me smirking .... Ouch but in time I learnt and he started to sink like a sack of spuds. Then he learnt the hand off.... Or fist off
Then when I had the ball I did try to charge through him but he would knock me backwards full 17 stone when I was 12 stone. Not fun. But I learnt to get out of the way of the bigger men who clearly want the big hits every time against you until your still hurting a week later and then it's more training
15 players
Ball has to go backwards
Pass the goal tine get points
Kick through the sticks points.
Line out
Scrum
Maul
Ruck
Drop kick
Offside.
Frankly that covers the basics up until a very decent age and as a child passing the ball and catching are key stills start with standing catching and throwing then try walking ten jogging then sprinting while doing the same.
Then run into a big MOFO sending him backwards as you charge through with the ball or if you have the agility sidestep him.
I remember at school I was always matched up against a giant 6'5" and brick shot house on the tackling training. He never bothered to sidestep instead me on touchline him on 22 sprinting towards me smirking .... Ouch but in time I learnt and he started to sink like a sack of spuds. Then he learnt the hand off.... Or fist off
Then when I had the ball I did try to charge through him but he would knock me backwards full 17 stone when I was 12 stone. Not fun. But I learnt to get out of the way of the bigger men who clearly want the big hits every time against you until your still hurting a week later and then it's more training
Rugby, unlike football, is a game of territory. The basic premis is to move forward, keeping possession of the ball, until a scoring opportunity arises: drop, penalty, try, conversion.
Unlike most team sports it is a game where contact is not only permissable but encouraged.
The ball can go in any direction but only on condition. It can be kicked anywhere but cannot be passed forwards, and even here there are areas of doubt.
If the ball is kicked off the field the the opposing team gets to play it. If it is over the side line, the brown lines that touch judges run along, then it is thrown back in. If it is across the try line or dead ball line then other rules apply.
A referee is always right. When he is wrong and you point it out you lose 10m, and as rugby is a game of territory this hurts.
Other more technical rules for the advanced ruby player: you should not take your own alcohol to an away match and the income from beer sales is what keeps most clubs viable. You should only criticise the ref briefly so it pays to prepare a few choice words beforehand.
After the match, no matter that you are covered in stud marks from being shoed for 84 minutes - the ref forgot to look at his watch - you still have to be nice to the opposing side in the bar, even if they beat you.
The sport is one of accepted conduct. Whilst a prop can throw a punch at any forward, the scrum half is, if he is four stones lighter, off limit. You can only tackle him. A fly half is the only player who can be late tackled more than four time each half without causing a penalty to be awarded.
The players are divided into two types: forwards and backs. In reality the scrum half doesn't really know which he falls into, especially if he's been tackled a few times by a flanker.
Flankers have all the fun.
Hookers are proof that we've been visited by extra terrestrials and they left their seed. Those on the wing are picked for looks alone. Number 15s can either catch a ball dependably or kick it from hand accurately, never both.
Offsides are awarded when the ref is feeling a bit puffed.
I think that covers it all, unless anyone else has a point or two to add.
Unlike most team sports it is a game where contact is not only permissable but encouraged.
The ball can go in any direction but only on condition. It can be kicked anywhere but cannot be passed forwards, and even here there are areas of doubt.
If the ball is kicked off the field the the opposing team gets to play it. If it is over the side line, the brown lines that touch judges run along, then it is thrown back in. If it is across the try line or dead ball line then other rules apply.
A referee is always right. When he is wrong and you point it out you lose 10m, and as rugby is a game of territory this hurts.
Other more technical rules for the advanced ruby player: you should not take your own alcohol to an away match and the income from beer sales is what keeps most clubs viable. You should only criticise the ref briefly so it pays to prepare a few choice words beforehand.
After the match, no matter that you are covered in stud marks from being shoed for 84 minutes - the ref forgot to look at his watch - you still have to be nice to the opposing side in the bar, even if they beat you.
The sport is one of accepted conduct. Whilst a prop can throw a punch at any forward, the scrum half is, if he is four stones lighter, off limit. You can only tackle him. A fly half is the only player who can be late tackled more than four time each half without causing a penalty to be awarded.
The players are divided into two types: forwards and backs. In reality the scrum half doesn't really know which he falls into, especially if he's been tackled a few times by a flanker.
Flankers have all the fun.
Hookers are proof that we've been visited by extra terrestrials and they left their seed. Those on the wing are picked for looks alone. Number 15s can either catch a ball dependably or kick it from hand accurately, never both.
Offsides are awarded when the ref is feeling a bit puffed.
I think that covers it all, unless anyone else has a point or two to add.
Derek Smith said:
Rugby, unlike football, is a game of territory. The basic premis is to move forward, keeping possession of the ball, until a scoring opportunity arises: drop, penalty, try, conversion.
Unlike most team sports it is a game where contact is not only permissable but encouraged.
The ball can go in any direction but only on condition. It can be kicked anywhere but cannot be passed forwards, and even here there are areas of doubt.
If the ball is kicked off the field the the opposing team gets to play it. If it is over the side line, the brown lines that touch judges run along, then it is thrown back in. If it is across the try line or dead ball line then other rules apply.
A referee is always right. When he is wrong and you point it out you lose 10m, and as rugby is a game of territory this hurts.
Other more technical rules for the advanced ruby player: you should not take your own alcohol to an away match and the income from beer sales is what keeps most clubs viable. You should only criticise the ref briefly so it pays to prepare a few choice words beforehand.
After the match, no matter that you are covered in stud marks from being shoed for 84 minutes - the ref forgot to look at his watch - you still have to be nice to the opposing side in the bar, even if they beat you.
The sport is one of accepted conduct. Whilst a prop can throw a punch at any forward, the scrum half is, if he is four stones lighter, off limit. You can only tackle him. A fly half is the only player who can be late tackled more than four time each half without causing a penalty to be awarded.
The players are divided into two types: forwards and backs. In reality the scrum half doesn't really know which he falls into, especially if he's been tackled a few times by a flanker.
Flankers have all the fun.
Hookers are proof that we've been visited by extra terrestrials and they left their seed. Those on the wing are picked for looks alone. Number 15s can either catch a ball dependably or kick it from hand accurately, never both.
Offsides are awarded when the ref is feeling a bit puffed.
I think that covers it all, unless anyone else has a point or two to add.
Quite possibily the best description of the game ever!Unlike most team sports it is a game where contact is not only permissable but encouraged.
The ball can go in any direction but only on condition. It can be kicked anywhere but cannot be passed forwards, and even here there are areas of doubt.
If the ball is kicked off the field the the opposing team gets to play it. If it is over the side line, the brown lines that touch judges run along, then it is thrown back in. If it is across the try line or dead ball line then other rules apply.
A referee is always right. When he is wrong and you point it out you lose 10m, and as rugby is a game of territory this hurts.
Other more technical rules for the advanced ruby player: you should not take your own alcohol to an away match and the income from beer sales is what keeps most clubs viable. You should only criticise the ref briefly so it pays to prepare a few choice words beforehand.
After the match, no matter that you are covered in stud marks from being shoed for 84 minutes - the ref forgot to look at his watch - you still have to be nice to the opposing side in the bar, even if they beat you.
The sport is one of accepted conduct. Whilst a prop can throw a punch at any forward, the scrum half is, if he is four stones lighter, off limit. You can only tackle him. A fly half is the only player who can be late tackled more than four time each half without causing a penalty to be awarded.
The players are divided into two types: forwards and backs. In reality the scrum half doesn't really know which he falls into, especially if he's been tackled a few times by a flanker.
Flankers have all the fun.
Hookers are proof that we've been visited by extra terrestrials and they left their seed. Those on the wing are picked for looks alone. Number 15s can either catch a ball dependably or kick it from hand accurately, never both.
Offsides are awarded when the ref is feeling a bit puffed.
I think that covers it all, unless anyone else has a point or two to add.
Bravo Derek!
Derek Smith said:
Rugby, unlike football, is a game of territory. The basic premis is to move forward, keeping possession of the ball, until a scoring opportunity arises: drop, penalty, try, conversion.
Unlike most team sports it is a game where contact is not only permissable but encouraged.
The ball can go in any direction but only on condition. It can be kicked anywhere but cannot be passed forwards, and even here there are areas of doubt.
If the ball is kicked off the field the the opposing team gets to play it. If it is over the side line, the brown lines that touch judges run along, then it is thrown back in. If it is across the try line or dead ball line then other rules apply.
A referee is always right. When he is wrong and you point it out you lose 10m, and as rugby is a game of territory this hurts.
Other more technical rules for the advanced ruby player: you should not take your own alcohol to an away match and the income from beer sales is what keeps most clubs viable. You should only criticise the ref briefly so it pays to prepare a few choice words beforehand.
After the match, no matter that you are covered in stud marks from being shoed for 84 minutes - the ref forgot to look at his watch - you still have to be nice to the opposing side in the bar, even if they beat you.
The sport is one of accepted conduct. Whilst a prop can throw a punch at any forward, the scrum half is, if he is four stones lighter, off limit. You can only tackle him. A fly half is the only player who can be late tackled more than four time each half without causing a penalty to be awarded.
The players are divided into two types: forwards and backs. In reality the scrum half doesn't really know which he falls into, especially if he's been tackled a few times by a flanker.
Flankers have all the fun.
Hookers are proof that we've been visited by extra terrestrials and they left their seed. Those on the wing are picked for looks alone. Number 15s can either catch a ball dependably or kick it from hand accurately, never both.
Offsides are awarded when the ref is feeling a bit puffed.
I think that covers it all, unless anyone else has a point or two to add.
Think you missed the most important Law of all - The 'Advantage Law'. The one that allows the Ref to ignore ALL the other Laws for the benefit of the game.Unlike most team sports it is a game where contact is not only permissable but encouraged.
The ball can go in any direction but only on condition. It can be kicked anywhere but cannot be passed forwards, and even here there are areas of doubt.
If the ball is kicked off the field the the opposing team gets to play it. If it is over the side line, the brown lines that touch judges run along, then it is thrown back in. If it is across the try line or dead ball line then other rules apply.
A referee is always right. When he is wrong and you point it out you lose 10m, and as rugby is a game of territory this hurts.
Other more technical rules for the advanced ruby player: you should not take your own alcohol to an away match and the income from beer sales is what keeps most clubs viable. You should only criticise the ref briefly so it pays to prepare a few choice words beforehand.
After the match, no matter that you are covered in stud marks from being shoed for 84 minutes - the ref forgot to look at his watch - you still have to be nice to the opposing side in the bar, even if they beat you.
The sport is one of accepted conduct. Whilst a prop can throw a punch at any forward, the scrum half is, if he is four stones lighter, off limit. You can only tackle him. A fly half is the only player who can be late tackled more than four time each half without causing a penalty to be awarded.
The players are divided into two types: forwards and backs. In reality the scrum half doesn't really know which he falls into, especially if he's been tackled a few times by a flanker.
Flankers have all the fun.
Hookers are proof that we've been visited by extra terrestrials and they left their seed. Those on the wing are picked for looks alone. Number 15s can either catch a ball dependably or kick it from hand accurately, never both.
Offsides are awarded when the ref is feeling a bit puffed.
I think that covers it all, unless anyone else has a point or two to add.
Of course, this is more prevelant in higher standards of the game where Refs tend to be fitter and can keep up with play
BB
ExChrispy Porker said:
Derek Smith said:
You are suggesting that the props know there is any scoring? It is a concept that never occurred to me.
True enough!I quite often had no idea what the score was! I knew how many we had taken against the head though.
BB
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