Discussion
Anyway just back from the team match at Trentham Park and happy to say we won our match 2 up, although sadly the team lost 2 - 1. We had a cracking game between us though, never more than 2 holes in it, and me and my partner dovetailed really well - I think there was only one hole neither of us really featured in.
Played really well personally - had 3 birdies and was striking the ball really well. Highlight was probably 15, a 170 yard Par 3 up hill. Struck a 5 iron really well but from where we were it looked like it had stayed on the fringe, then walked up the hill and it was 2 feet away. The guys we were playing had missed the green so were trying to hole chips and bunker shots for birdie, and they ended up conceding the putt, which put us 2 up. My partner then had a gutsy par on 16, holing a 10 footer for the half, so due to the rules of the Cup we were playing in (if it's a draw away team wins) that was that.
Got to say after 18 months I'm really seeing the value in the lessons I've been having - swing is staying solid under pressure and I'm hitting some of the best shots of my life. Just need to start proving it with a card in my hand ....
Played really well personally - had 3 birdies and was striking the ball really well. Highlight was probably 15, a 170 yard Par 3 up hill. Struck a 5 iron really well but from where we were it looked like it had stayed on the fringe, then walked up the hill and it was 2 feet away. The guys we were playing had missed the green so were trying to hole chips and bunker shots for birdie, and they ended up conceding the putt, which put us 2 up. My partner then had a gutsy par on 16, holing a 10 footer for the half, so due to the rules of the Cup we were playing in (if it's a draw away team wins) that was that.
Got to say after 18 months I'm really seeing the value in the lessons I've been having - swing is staying solid under pressure and I'm hitting some of the best shots of my life. Just need to start proving it with a card in my hand ....
bodhi said:
It was just two great players going at it down the last 9 holes of a major - someone had to win and someone had to lose. For me it came down to luck - Bryson spent his day in the waste area and never seemed to get penalised for it, Rory had a couple of horrible breaks (his second shot on 5, being left with that putt on 18) and lost.
Bryson still had to play what he called the shot of his career to win it. I can see why Rory was pissed off after that putt on 16, but for me that was his strongest major performance in a while - I have every confidence he will be back.
It wasn't the best look jumping in his car as soon as Bryson holed his putt, but given how emotional he gets (he's cried in a couple of press conferences recently, and no one really needs to see that again) I sort of understand.
Interesting interview from Scottie yesterday when asked about Pinehurst.Bryson still had to play what he called the shot of his career to win it. I can see why Rory was pissed off after that putt on 16, but for me that was his strongest major performance in a while - I have every confidence he will be back.
It wasn't the best look jumping in his car as soon as Bryson holed his putt, but given how emotional he gets (he's cried in a couple of press conferences recently, and no one really needs to see that again) I sort of understand.
https://x.com/PaulHodowanic/status/180344041508691...
Tldr: he didn't like the 'coin flip' waste areas as he didn't think it was right that the outcome of your score had that element of luck.
He's got a point of course but the other option is the typical rough we normally see. The players are so strong now that it's still playable. Yes, it's more consistent. Brysons last US open people complained it was bomb and gouge. Kind of true, but a bit of a failure to recognize the short game he also brought that week.
So if deep rough is wrong and Pinehurst scrub is wrong, what's the solution?
I think this side of the Atlantic, we actually came up with the solution a few centuries ago. Pot bunkers?
The ball typically lies in a place where you can get it back out, but not much more than that, plus the contours will usually feed the ball into the bunker, giving them a decent sized catchment area. A fitting penalty for a wayward tee shot.
I personally rank The Open as the best major but the timing of what side of the draw you end up on can also bring criticism.
So when you weigh it all up, I think we just have to accept that it's probably not possible to completely remove the element of luck from the game. I kind of agree with Scottie for the most part, but at the same time, maybe he's asking for something that favours the longer and stronger players, which isn't the best approach either.
Pot bunkers are probably better than deep rough or waste areas though. If you avoid the bunker on the correct side, you're on the fairway, but miss the fairway, it's either pot bunker or hay. I think that's as good a penalty as anything.
bodhi said:
Anyway just back from the team match at Trentham Park and happy to say we won our match 2 up, although sadly the team lost 2 - 1. We had a cracking game between us though, never more than 2 holes in it, and me and my partner dovetailed really well - I think there was only one hole neither of us really featured in.
Played really well personally - had 3 birdies and was striking the ball really well. Highlight was probably 15, a 170 yard Par 3 up hill. Struck a 5 iron really well but from where we were it looked like it had stayed on the fringe, then walked up the hill and it was 2 feet away. The guys we were playing had missed the green so were trying to hole chips and bunker shots for birdie, and they ended up conceding the putt, which put us 2 up. My partner then had a gutsy par on 16, holing a 10 footer for the half, so due to the rules of the Cup we were playing in (if it's a draw away team wins) that was that.
Got to say after 18 months I'm really seeing the value in the lessons I've been having - swing is staying solid under pressure and I'm hitting some of the best shots of my life. Just need to start proving it with a card in my hand ....
Well played fella, sounds good! Played really well personally - had 3 birdies and was striking the ball really well. Highlight was probably 15, a 170 yard Par 3 up hill. Struck a 5 iron really well but from where we were it looked like it had stayed on the fringe, then walked up the hill and it was 2 feet away. The guys we were playing had missed the green so were trying to hole chips and bunker shots for birdie, and they ended up conceding the putt, which put us 2 up. My partner then had a gutsy par on 16, holing a 10 footer for the half, so due to the rules of the Cup we were playing in (if it's a draw away team wins) that was that.
Got to say after 18 months I'm really seeing the value in the lessons I've been having - swing is staying solid under pressure and I'm hitting some of the best shots of my life. Just need to start proving it with a card in my hand ....
bodhi said:
Anyway just back from the team match at Trentham Park and happy to say we won our match 2 up, although sadly the team lost 2 - 1. We had a cracking game between us though, never more than 2 holes in it, and me and my partner dovetailed really well - I think there was only one hole neither of us really featured in.
Played really well personally - had 3 birdies and was striking the ball really well. Highlight was probably 15, a 170 yard Par 3 up hill. Struck a 5 iron really well but from where we were it looked like it had stayed on the fringe, then walked up the hill and it was 2 feet away. The guys we were playing had missed the green so were trying to hole chips and bunker shots for birdie, and they ended up conceding the putt, which put us 2 up. My partner then had a gutsy par on 16, holing a 10 footer for the half, so due to the rules of the Cup we were playing in (if it's a draw away team wins) that was that.
Got to say after 18 months I'm really seeing the value in the lessons I've been having - swing is staying solid under pressure and I'm hitting some of the best shots of my life. Just need to start proving it with a card in my hand ....
Well played. It’s nice when the work starts to kick in. I think I’m about 2 years into my swing changes and they are just about starting to feel normal. Occasionally I’ll still take it away inside all arms and no rotation then throw it over the top. Played really well personally - had 3 birdies and was striking the ball really well. Highlight was probably 15, a 170 yard Par 3 up hill. Struck a 5 iron really well but from where we were it looked like it had stayed on the fringe, then walked up the hill and it was 2 feet away. The guys we were playing had missed the green so were trying to hole chips and bunker shots for birdie, and they ended up conceding the putt, which put us 2 up. My partner then had a gutsy par on 16, holing a 10 footer for the half, so due to the rules of the Cup we were playing in (if it's a draw away team wins) that was that.
Got to say after 18 months I'm really seeing the value in the lessons I've been having - swing is staying solid under pressure and I'm hitting some of the best shots of my life. Just need to start proving it with a card in my hand ....
And I still have to really concentrate on getting the grip and setup right.
It’s amazing how many people think going for one lesson is going to fix their swing.
I can't wait for The Open, I hope the weather improves and we have a fast tight course with a bit of wind to spice it up, Bryson's going to get a warm welcome I would have thought and I hope the media take the pressure off Rory as I really don't think the pedestal/scrutiny they have put Rory on is helping him.
I do not believe Rory choked he played fantastically to score his 69 on Sunday and come from behind against a player that is on fire at the moment, that putt on 18th was one of those that many great golfers have missed, Nicklaus won 18 majors but he also came second 19 times and that's the same for most of the legends of the game, Tiger 7 times second place vs 15 wins, losing is part of winning.
For me there is nothing but positives to take from his performance in the US Open.
Bryson got the rub of the green on Sunday, Rory didn't but there aren't many majors that are won without some good fortune along the way.
Going out for a solo 9 holes this evening as the weather looks to be perfect can't wait having not played for a few weeks.
48Valves said:
Well played. It’s nice when the work starts to kick in. I think I’m about 2 years into my swing changes and they are just about starting to feel normal. Occasionally I’ll still take it away inside all arms and no rotation then throw it over the top.
And I still have to really concentrate on getting the grip and setup right.
It’s amazing how many people think going for one lesson is going to fix their swing.
Cheers chap (and to Ray) - I'm finding there are still some of my old flippy swings in there, but they mainly come about when I'm getting tired towards the end of the round and I can't quite shift my weight and turn in the way I need to - but they are getting less and less frequent. And I still have to really concentrate on getting the grip and setup right.
It’s amazing how many people think going for one lesson is going to fix their swing.
The thing that gets me, is the lessons are every month and cost around £30, which sounds like a lot until you compare it to buying new clubs. Over 18 months they've cost about the same as a new driver or half a new set of irons, and I don't think I'd see anywhere near the same benefits as if I bought either of those.
Whilst I do still love looking at new shiny, I'm not longer convinced new kit is the way forwards.
It's not stopping me thinking about a new driving iron and gap wedge tho
bodhi said:
Cheers chap (and to Ray) - I'm finding there are still some of my old flippy swings in there, but they mainly come about when I'm getting tired towards the end of the round and I can't quite shift my weight and turn in the way I need to - but they are getting less and less frequent.
The thing that gets me, is the lessons are every month and cost around £30, which sounds like a lot until you compare it to buying new clubs. Over 18 months they've cost about the same as a new driver or half a new set of irons, and I don't think I'd see anywhere near the same benefits as if I bought either of those.
Whilst I do still love looking at new shiny, I'm not longer convinced new kit is the way forwards.
It's not stopping me thinking about a new driving iron and gap wedge tho
That's great Bodhi, and nice that you've seen genuine improvements from the lessons.The thing that gets me, is the lessons are every month and cost around £30, which sounds like a lot until you compare it to buying new clubs. Over 18 months they've cost about the same as a new driver or half a new set of irons, and I don't think I'd see anywhere near the same benefits as if I bought either of those.
Whilst I do still love looking at new shiny, I'm not longer convinced new kit is the way forwards.
It's not stopping me thinking about a new driving iron and gap wedge tho
I used to love having lessons, a great coach, pleasure to spend time with, brilliant place to spend your golf budget.
soupdragon1 said:
Interesting interview from Scottie yesterday when asked about Pinehurst.
https://x.com/PaulHodowanic/status/180344041508691...
Tldr: he didn't like the 'coin flip' waste areas as he didn't think it was right that the outcome of your score had that element of luck.
He's got a point of course but the other option is the typical rough we normally see. The players are so strong now that it's still playable. Yes, it's more consistent. Brysons last US open people complained it was bomb and gouge. Kind of true, but a bit of a failure to recognize the short game he also brought that week.
So if deep rough is wrong and Pinehurst scrub is wrong, what's the solution?
I think this side of the Atlantic, we actually came up with the solution a few centuries ago. Pot bunkers?
The ball typically lies in a place where you can get it back out, but not much more than that, plus the contours will usually feed the ball into the bunker, giving them a decent sized catchment area. A fitting penalty for a wayward tee shot.
I personally rank The Open as the best major but the timing of what side of the draw you end up on can also bring criticism.
So when you weigh it all up, I think we just have to accept that it's probably not possible to completely remove the element of luck from the game. I kind of agree with Scottie for the most part, but at the same time, maybe he's asking for something that favours the longer and stronger players, which isn't the best approach either.
Pot bunkers are probably better than deep rough or waste areas though. If you avoid the bunker on the correct side, you're on the fairway, but miss the fairway, it's either pot bunker or hay. I think that's as good a penalty as anything.
Complete sacrilege but I honestly am not that keen on pot bunkers.. it’s always just a chip sideways which imo is the same as typical us open rough.https://x.com/PaulHodowanic/status/180344041508691...
Tldr: he didn't like the 'coin flip' waste areas as he didn't think it was right that the outcome of your score had that element of luck.
He's got a point of course but the other option is the typical rough we normally see. The players are so strong now that it's still playable. Yes, it's more consistent. Brysons last US open people complained it was bomb and gouge. Kind of true, but a bit of a failure to recognize the short game he also brought that week.
So if deep rough is wrong and Pinehurst scrub is wrong, what's the solution?
I think this side of the Atlantic, we actually came up with the solution a few centuries ago. Pot bunkers?
The ball typically lies in a place where you can get it back out, but not much more than that, plus the contours will usually feed the ball into the bunker, giving them a decent sized catchment area. A fitting penalty for a wayward tee shot.
I personally rank The Open as the best major but the timing of what side of the draw you end up on can also bring criticism.
So when you weigh it all up, I think we just have to accept that it's probably not possible to completely remove the element of luck from the game. I kind of agree with Scottie for the most part, but at the same time, maybe he's asking for something that favours the longer and stronger players, which isn't the best approach either.
Pot bunkers are probably better than deep rough or waste areas though. If you avoid the bunker on the correct side, you're on the fairway, but miss the fairway, it's either pot bunker or hay. I think that's as good a penalty as anything.
Perfection for me is scots pines or similar which are close enough to be in play rather than just framing the hole. Woburn dukes and the now shut lamerwood spring to mind. You usually end up with the choice of a hero shot, a chip out, or something in between
soupdragon1 said:
Bryson choked, only about 50% of his shots were good ones on Sunday. Rory hit fewer bad shots. Even on 18 where finally Bryson got a bad lie off another missed fairway, he fluffed his recovery shot. Rory got a bad lie too on 18 but hit a great recovery and a great chip.
Both stood on 18 at minus 6. Rory hit 2 good shots on that hole, Bryson only hit 1 good shot.
Don't let the final score on the scorecard dictate the narrative. Bryson hit some fantastic shots on Sunday, but he hit quite a number of stinkers.
If choking means winning the US Open, then yes, Bryson choked. Both stood on 18 at minus 6. Rory hit 2 good shots on that hole, Bryson only hit 1 good shot.
Don't let the final score on the scorecard dictate the narrative. Bryson hit some fantastic shots on Sunday, but he hit quite a number of stinkers.
Fluffed recovery shot? His ball was right next to a massive tree root… that punch shot was about all he had open to him.
Yes Rory hit a great recovery and a great chip. And they were all for nothing because he choked his final, most important putt.
Stats tell the story. He was 496 for 496 inside 3ft before that inexplicable miss on the 16th. The 18th putt was 3ft 9”. I hope he gets another chance but that was as close a he’s been in a decade and he blew it.
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/golf/2024/06/17/r...
“Missing two putts inside four feet in any round is bad for any pro golfer. Doing it in the final three holes to lose a US Open by a shot means everything else melts away. Every other factor in the result becomes irrelevant.”
The putt on 16 was the one that cost Rory. The one on 18 was extremely difficult. Listen to what Rahm had to say about it.
I agree Bryson was falling apart on the back 9. He got very lucky a number of times, including off the tee on 18. But, hit hit an amazing shot out of the bunker which stayed below the hole. Sometimes you win by someone scoring slightly worse than you scoring better.
I agree Bryson was falling apart on the back 9. He got very lucky a number of times, including off the tee on 18. But, hit hit an amazing shot out of the bunker which stayed below the hole. Sometimes you win by someone scoring slightly worse than you scoring better.
A real mixed bag over the 11 holes I managed last night a mate joined me and was the same, my miss is a block to the right, my putting was good though just one 3 putt and a few single putt greens, it's always nice walking to the next tee having not messed it up on the previous green, but the blocks cost me plenty of shots on the way there as the rough is punishing at the moment.
No chunks or thins though but got to sort the blocks out.
No chunks or thins though but got to sort the blocks out.
milesgiles said:
Complete sacrilege but I honestly am not that keen on pot bunkers.. it’s always just a chip sideways which imo is the same as typical us open rough.
Perfection for me is scots pines or similar which are close enough to be in play rather than just framing the hole. Woburn dukes and the now shut lamerwood spring to mind. You usually end up with the choice of a hero shot, a chip out, or something in between
Pot bunkers are the perfect links protection though. Positioned to make you think very carefully about trying to hit anywhere near their distance. More of them in the middle of fairways at 320 yards please - never going to be an issue for me... Perfection for me is scots pines or similar which are close enough to be in play rather than just framing the hole. Woburn dukes and the now shut lamerwood spring to mind. You usually end up with the choice of a hero shot, a chip out, or something in between
Greenside they can be marginal - especially for higher handicaps when there isn't a shot anywhere.
Came back to Earth with a bump last night in my single's knockout match, losing 3 and 2. Was playing a guy off 16 so giving 6 shots, and he was properly steady - didn't hit the ball a long way but rarely off the fairway and a good bogey golfer. I ended up 4 down after 7, got it back to level after 12, then started getting a bit loose off the tee and lost 3 of the next 4 holes (all shot holes).
I say loose off the tee, but I was missing fairways by 10 yards or so, just in the wrong places leaving myself punching out of trees. Struggled on the greens as well.
Ah well, as a wiser man than me once said sometimes you eat the bar, and sometimes, well the bar eats you.
Got a couple of days to recover from play a lot of golf, then got a scramble on Sunday morning.
I say loose off the tee, but I was missing fairways by 10 yards or so, just in the wrong places leaving myself punching out of trees. Struggled on the greens as well.
Ah well, as a wiser man than me once said sometimes you eat the bar, and sometimes, well the bar eats you.
Got a couple of days to recover from play a lot of golf, then got a scramble on Sunday morning.
Leithen said:
Pot bunkers are the perfect links protection though. Positioned to make you think very carefully about trying to hit anywhere near their distance. More of them in the middle of fairways at 320 yards please - never going to be an issue for me...
Greenside they can be marginal - especially for higher handicaps when there isn't a shot anywhere.
Yes you don’t have much choice on a links. I enjoy the tradition but tbh if there was no such thing and someone built the Old Course now I think it would shut in a year lol Greenside they can be marginal - especially for higher handicaps when there isn't a shot anywhere.
bodhi said:
Came back to Earth with a bump last night in my single's knockout match, losing 3 and 2
.....
Got a couple of days to recover from play a lot of golf, then got a scramble on Sunday morning.
Unlucky - from 4 down to get to level thru 12 was a pretty decent comeback mind......
Got a couple of days to recover from play a lot of golf, then got a scramble on Sunday morning.
For me - another hcap cut on its way after playing this morning in the best conditions of the year so far - 7:40am tee off - warm, completely still air, and no-one in front of us - just perfect conditions for golf. We didn't rush, but made it round comfortably in 3 1/2 hours.
I shot my best front 9 of the year and a decent back 9 apart from two bad holes - where I managed to trickle into a greenside bunker on 13 (should never have been near it in the first place) and took 3 to get out...... Then lost a ball on the next tee shot. Also had at least 4 putts that would have dropped on another day.
I know I shouldn't say it, but it feels so close at the moment - Driver is good when it works, Irons are solid, and my short game and putting is so far improved over last year it's like a different game. (Arccos is stil showing me that length of the tee is my weakness, but once today I hit driver 245 yds so even that bit is getting there)
Last year, I was pleased if I could shoot a 98, and today, I'm disappointed with my (joint) best round of an 86........If everything worked at the same time....
bodhi said:
Came back to Earth with a bump last night in my single's knockout match, losing 3 and 2. Was playing a guy off 16 so giving 6 shots, and he was properly steady - didn't hit the ball a long way but rarely off the fairway and a good bogey golfer. I ended up 4 down after 7, got it back to level after 12, then started getting a bit loose off the tee and lost 3 of the next 4 holes (all shot holes).
I say loose off the tee, but I was missing fairways by 10 yards or so, just in the wrong places leaving myself punching out of trees. Struggled on the greens as well.
Ah well, as a wiser man than me once said sometimes you eat the bar, and sometimes, well the bar eats you.
Got a couple of days to recover from play a lot of golf, then got a scramble on Sunday morning.
This is where matchplay with shots is so difficult, it's easy to get wound up by someone like this then you are shaking hands on the 15th. I say loose off the tee, but I was missing fairways by 10 yards or so, just in the wrong places leaving myself punching out of trees. Struggled on the greens as well.
Ah well, as a wiser man than me once said sometimes you eat the bar, and sometimes, well the bar eats you.
Got a couple of days to recover from play a lot of golf, then got a scramble on Sunday morning.
I have played some decent matches where I gave shots and just kept up as much as I can and put the pressure on down the back 3/4 holes to win. It is a great feeling.
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