JCW engine question
Discussion
Been having a few thoughts about looking into a jcw- specifically r56 generation. I do like the r53, not so sure i could live with the fuel consumption sadly!
Prices on newer cars seem quite high- although the earlier cars ( around 2008 model year ) seem fairly reasonable now, hence my interest is starting to grow more.
My one question is, are the earlier r56 jcw cars affected by the same issues the cooper s faces, timing chain failure/coking etc?
If I were to buy an earlier car, provided it had been seen to properly and had these faults sorted, would they resurface later on?
Cheers all!
Prices on newer cars seem quite high- although the earlier cars ( around 2008 model year ) seem fairly reasonable now, hence my interest is starting to grow more.
My one question is, are the earlier r56 jcw cars affected by the same issues the cooper s faces, timing chain failure/coking etc?
If I were to buy an earlier car, provided it had been seen to properly and had these faults sorted, would they resurface later on?
Cheers all!
I have owned an R53 Cooper S and an R56 Clubman S. (so not a JCW admittedly)
I can assure you the mpg is different.
R56 best mpg - 49mpg, typical 38mpg, hooning 27mpg
R53 best mpg - 35mpg, typical 29mpg, hooning 21mpg
The argument that the price difference makes up for the fuel difference is false, unless you never intend to sell the car again? (or depreciation on these cars does something odd - which it might do!)
However, I would still buy an R53 over an R56. They are simply more fun - but sadly too small for my family commitments now!
I would not worry too much about the timing chain rattle on the R56. I think it afflicted early cars, early in their life. I have not read about an issue for a few years now. My 2007 Clubman S has just completed 45,000 miles without issue (except the tensioner replacement four years ago). They do like a drink of oil too - so keep a close eye on that......
Mike
I can assure you the mpg is different.
R56 best mpg - 49mpg, typical 38mpg, hooning 27mpg
R53 best mpg - 35mpg, typical 29mpg, hooning 21mpg
The argument that the price difference makes up for the fuel difference is false, unless you never intend to sell the car again? (or depreciation on these cars does something odd - which it might do!)
However, I would still buy an R53 over an R56. They are simply more fun - but sadly too small for my family commitments now!
I would not worry too much about the timing chain rattle on the R56. I think it afflicted early cars, early in their life. I have not read about an issue for a few years now. My 2007 Clubman S has just completed 45,000 miles without issue (except the tensioner replacement four years ago). They do like a drink of oil too - so keep a close eye on that......
Mike
Yeah- I know people who have had both gen cars- 25 from the r53, 40 from the r56. I do like the r53, but like I say with prices starting to look better on r56 cars the decreased running costs and potentially more toys in the cabin make it seem a better proposition. Could be swayed by a GP1 however...
Good news regarding the engine though- how about the decoking problem, is that something that should be done regularly?
I am aware they drink oil- so did my classic mini to be fair, it's something I'm used to, although I take it that the new cars don't just drop it from mystery gaps in the engine and ancillaries onto the driveway?
Good news regarding the engine though- how about the decoking problem, is that something that should be done regularly?
I am aware they drink oil- so did my classic mini to be fair, it's something I'm used to, although I take it that the new cars don't just drop it from mystery gaps in the engine and ancillaries onto the driveway?
N14 engined minis including the jcw varients,all suffer with timing chain issues, there were 4 revisions of tensioner in the lifetime of the engine, none of which fully cured the problem my 2010 has had a tensioner already and fully expect to have to change the chain at some point, running low on oil definitely does not help, so regular checks and top ups are needed, and I certainly wouldn't religiously follow service schedule with long intervals between changes, have an oil change yearly at least as its thought crap builds up in the tensioner body which is machined to a too tight tolerance, and the tensioner sticks allowing chain slap as it does not take up the tension straight away on start up, over time this stretches the chain beyond its serviceable limit.The one I removed certainly felt less smooth in operation than the latest version of tensioner I replaced it with.
Coking up again is a feature of any direct injection engine, the revised N18 engine has a changed breather system which is supposed to make the the carbon build up on the inlet valves less of an issue, N14 engines need a decoke but its relativly cheap to do, mine at an mini specialist was £150, much more of course at BMW/mini at around £400
As an extra the N18 fitted to late 2010 Cooper s and 2012 jcw car's is thought not to suffer from cam change issues, but I know of a couple early on who had to have the chain cassette completely replaced, so its probably too early to say if that engine will have the same issue's, or reputation. also remember there has been a lot of reported high pressure fuel pump failures which cause port starting and lumpy running, these are the same pumps fitted to a lot of BMW car's so it begs the question why the design or manufacturer has never Ben changed.
As a final thought, a lot of these engine issues are covered under an extended warranty and are replaced free of charge up to 10 years 100k miles after the car was built .... only in America though after some class action law suits has been filed against mini America, here in the uk you get no such cover, nice that seeing as all the affected engines were assembled at Ham's hall near Birmingham uk.
Coking up again is a feature of any direct injection engine, the revised N18 engine has a changed breather system which is supposed to make the the carbon build up on the inlet valves less of an issue, N14 engines need a decoke but its relativly cheap to do, mine at an mini specialist was £150, much more of course at BMW/mini at around £400
As an extra the N18 fitted to late 2010 Cooper s and 2012 jcw car's is thought not to suffer from cam change issues, but I know of a couple early on who had to have the chain cassette completely replaced, so its probably too early to say if that engine will have the same issue's, or reputation. also remember there has been a lot of reported high pressure fuel pump failures which cause port starting and lumpy running, these are the same pumps fitted to a lot of BMW car's so it begs the question why the design or manufacturer has never Ben changed.
As a final thought, a lot of these engine issues are covered under an extended warranty and are replaced free of charge up to 10 years 100k miles after the car was built .... only in America though after some class action law suits has been filed against mini America, here in the uk you get no such cover, nice that seeing as all the affected engines were assembled at Ham's hall near Birmingham uk.
Edited by rigga on Saturday 29th November 12:16
I would steer clear of early R56's, there was a few teething problems including fuel pumps, decokes, timing chains etc. A late R53 would get my vote.
Mine always got 32-33 on the commute when I used it daily, mid to late 20s on a truly massive hoon, 36ish on a motorway cruise.
It now gets about 2mpg more thanks to the cam and remap, win-win. They run very rich stock.
Mine always got 32-33 on the commute when I used it daily, mid to late 20s on a truly massive hoon, 36ish on a motorway cruise.
It now gets about 2mpg more thanks to the cam and remap, win-win. They run very rich stock.
rigga said:
N14 engined minis including the jcw varients,all suffer with timing chain issues, there were 4 revisions of tensioner in the lifetime of the engine, none of which fully cured the problem my 2010 has had a tensioner already and fully expect to have to change the chain at some point, running low on oil definitely does not help, so regular checks and top ups are needed, and I certainly wouldn't religiously follow service schedule with long intervals between changes, have an oil change yearly at least as its thought crap builds up in the tensioner body which is machined to a too tight tolerance, and the tensioner sticks allowing chain slap as it does not take up the tension straight away on start up, over time this stretches the chain beyond its serviceable limit.The one I removed certainly felt less smooth in operation than the latest version of tensioner I replaced it with.
Coking up again is a feature of any direct injection engine, the revised N18 engine has a changed breather system which is supposed to make the the carbon build up on the inlet valves less of an issue, N14 engines need a decoke but its relativly cheap to do, mine at an mini specialist was £150, much more of course at BMW/mini at around £400
As an extra the N18 fitted to late 2010 Cooper s and 2012 jcw car's is thought not to suffer from cam change issues, but I know of a couple early on who had to have the chain cassette completely replaced, so its probably too early to say if that engine will have the same issue's, or reputation. also remember there has been a lot of reported high pressure fuel pump failures which cause port starting and lumpy running, these are the same pumps fitted to a lot of BMW car's so it begs the question why the design or manufacturer has never Ben changed.
As a final thought, a lot of these engine issues are covered under an extended warranty and are replaced free of charge up to 10 years 100k miles after the car was built .... only in America though after some class action law suits has been filed against mini America, here in the uk you get no such cover, nice that seeing as all the affected engines were assembled at Ham's hall near Birmingham uk.
Just to expand on this, I have had two JCW, an R56(hatch) and R55(clubman) and both have suffered the issues with timing chains etc on N14 engines.Coking up again is a feature of any direct injection engine, the revised N18 engine has a changed breather system which is supposed to make the the carbon build up on the inlet valves less of an issue, N14 engines need a decoke but its relativly cheap to do, mine at an mini specialist was £150, much more of course at BMW/mini at around £400
As an extra the N18 fitted to late 2010 Cooper s and 2012 jcw car's is thought not to suffer from cam change issues, but I know of a couple early on who had to have the chain cassette completely replaced, so its probably too early to say if that engine will have the same issue's, or reputation. also remember there has been a lot of reported high pressure fuel pump failures which cause port starting and lumpy running, these are the same pumps fitted to a lot of BMW car's so it begs the question why the design or manufacturer has never Ben changed.
As a final thought, a lot of these engine issues are covered under an extended warranty and are replaced free of charge up to 10 years 100k miles after the car was built .... only in America though after some class action law suits has been filed against mini America, here in the uk you get no such cover, nice that seeing as all the affected engines were assembled at Ham's hall near Birmingham uk.
Edited by rigga on Saturday 29th November 12:16
First JCW was a 2010 hatch, averages 38mpg on my 25 mile each way commute which consisted of A roads and motorway but a lot of stop/start traffic.
This needed:
Camchain/Tensioner
Decoked
Valve Stem Seals
Short block - The bores had apparently "Ovaled" and so was losing compression.
Car was on ~28k iirc when all this was done
Second is a 2011 Clubman, average 38-40mpg on the same commute, get high 40's on a run.
This needed:
Camchain/Tensioner
Decoked
Valve Stem Seals
Short block - Bores had been polished so bottom end was scrap
I have just got it back and its in 22k.
As you can probably tell, there is only specific issues to keep an eye on. If you do regular long runs and a service @10k rather than 20k miles you should avoid most of the issues from happening.
Extremely unlucky to say the least about needing replacement blocks on both car's, as I've not heard too many stories about that, but it can happen, don't get me wrong and think the r56 mini is a pile of junk, its not, but there are things to watch out for, not all cara suffer these problems, as with all things like this, you only hear the bad news, there's not ques of thousand's of owner's stating their car's are wonderful, and never missing a beat, its not how these things work is it .....the car is a hoot to drive though, and when specced up is a great place to be in, pops and bangs on lift off brings out the kid in you.
rigga said:
Extremely unlucky to say the least about needing replacement blocks on both car's, as I've not heard too many stories about that, but it can happen, don't get me wrong and think the r56 mini is a pile of junk, its not, but there are things to watch out for, not all cara suffer these problems, as with all things like this, you only hear the bad news, there's not ques of thousand's of owner's stating their car's are wonderful, and never missing a beat, its not how these things work is it .....the car is a hoot to drive though, and when specced up is a great place to be in, pops and bangs on lift off brings out the kid in you.
I totally agree, the first was down to an incompetent dealership who, because they didn't know their arse from their elbows, couldn't spot the engine not running correctly. The second was just bad luck I think.I love mine, can't even think of anything to replace it with and it is so much fun to drive and own! I needed the practically of the clubman and after buying it, found there was only 231 of them registered in this country!
All I would say is to go in with eyes open and wait for the spec you want, I waited a few months to find the one with the right spec in it and in a colour other than black. Most dealers are excellent and always happy to chat about the cars, many of them are MINI owners themselves and can recommend spec's and packages to look for.
Sorry for returning to an old thread here but it seems to include a load of relevant points. So....wife bought a 09 jcw clubman last year and it has been a great little package. But it has been burning a bit of oil and exhaust smoking. Also had occasional rattle on start up recently so suspect chain tensioner. Local garage i use have fears that it has had a hard life and we should move on so we test drove an F56 cooper s today. Nice but we were both totally underwhelmed and on the drive home agreed to keep our jcw clubby and spend the money to rejuvinate. Please can i have informed suggestions as to what we should be looking to do (short engine, tensioner, valve guides, etc?) And who or where would you recommend and what general costs should we expect. I am north of border but prepared to travel for the right fix. Thanks
I have been having all the R53 vs R56 thoughts, just been waiting for the right one to come along. Just could not find a low mileage JCW R53, have just got rid of a supercharged car so had already ticked that box off my list, so have just got a 2007 R56 Copper S with the JCW body and tuning pack.
Pro's are I like the interior, it's the dealer fitted JCW kit so I like the Works engraving on the exhaust. Its the cheaper car tax band, does about 40 mpg and was a bargain to buy compared to the slightly later factory JCW's for a few extra BHP.
Con's are I needed to check it had the timing chain guide replaced, and its only done 50K miles but needed a needed a clutch, that also seems quite common on these but that was what I suspected when I bought it.
First impressions are great, had a new clutch that is really smooth, handles like a go kart, goes really well, the JCW exhaust has a nice tone but is a little quiet to what I'm used to. Finish is good with some nice options like mood lighting, xenon's, carbon fiber scoop and mirrors. Overall a nice size, I'm sure the R53 would be more fun but not quite as practical, and the latest generation are I believe just too big for a Mini.
As a long time petrol head and new MIni owner I'm pleased, be it R53's or R56's, I think go with what happens to float your boat at the time as I don't think you will be disappointed.
Pro's are I like the interior, it's the dealer fitted JCW kit so I like the Works engraving on the exhaust. Its the cheaper car tax band, does about 40 mpg and was a bargain to buy compared to the slightly later factory JCW's for a few extra BHP.
Con's are I needed to check it had the timing chain guide replaced, and its only done 50K miles but needed a needed a clutch, that also seems quite common on these but that was what I suspected when I bought it.
First impressions are great, had a new clutch that is really smooth, handles like a go kart, goes really well, the JCW exhaust has a nice tone but is a little quiet to what I'm used to. Finish is good with some nice options like mood lighting, xenon's, carbon fiber scoop and mirrors. Overall a nice size, I'm sure the R53 would be more fun but not quite as practical, and the latest generation are I believe just too big for a Mini.
As a long time petrol head and new MIni owner I'm pleased, be it R53's or R56's, I think go with what happens to float your boat at the time as I don't think you will be disappointed.
Dear all,
I have just acquired a 62plate N18 JCW, just below 52K on the clock. I would like to do oil and filter, gearbox fluid change just to be save than sorry. It is just about half way till annual service due next February.
Will any of you recommend a particular engine oil grade or brand for me please?
Same question for the gear box fluid (if any).
Thanks
KC
I have just acquired a 62plate N18 JCW, just below 52K on the clock. I would like to do oil and filter, gearbox fluid change just to be save than sorry. It is just about half way till annual service due next February.
Will any of you recommend a particular engine oil grade or brand for me please?
Same question for the gear box fluid (if any).
Thanks
KC
Edited by Keawe8221 on Tuesday 24th September 15:37
HI there - I am using Castrol Edge 0w-30 (fully synthetic) for the engine oil in my 2011 JCW (N14).
Castrol was an approved oil and it notes the same on the dipstick holder. It also has the 'BMW Longlife-04' label as prescribed by Mini in the handbook.... However, when it was in for the last oil service I noticed that Shell Helix had been used.
Castrol was an approved oil and it notes the same on the dipstick holder. It also has the 'BMW Longlife-04' label as prescribed by Mini in the handbook.... However, when it was in for the last oil service I noticed that Shell Helix had been used.
GaryF said:
HI there - I am using Castrol Edge 0w-30 (fully synthetic) for the engine oil in my 2011 JCW (N14).
Castrol was an approved oil and it notes the same on the dipstick holder. It also has the 'BMW Longlife-04' label as prescribed by Mini in the handbook.... However, when it was in for the last oil service I noticed that Shell Helix had been used.
Cheer Mate. Yes I notice the Castrol recommended text are literally everywhere in the car or handbook. But I am not sure if that will still be the best oil (economically) for my intension of doing oil change at every 5K.Castrol was an approved oil and it notes the same on the dipstick holder. It also has the 'BMW Longlife-04' label as prescribed by Mini in the handbook.... However, when it was in for the last oil service I noticed that Shell Helix had been used.
I have seen forum discussion about the eurocarpart's TripleQX. One of those has actually got BMW Longlife12 certification on. I always wonder if that would be any good.
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