Rolls Royce and Bentley image.
Discussion
When I was growing up, a Rolls Royce was a revered motor car and I think I assumed that they were driven by the very wealthy and successful. "Rolls Royce" was the label attached to anything that was "the best".
Bentley was a sort of nebulous "not quite as good as a Rolls Royce" marque.
As I was sitting outside a bar last night, a Phantom with a chavtastic number plate pulled up and out fell some quite dubious looking characters. I have long pondered how the used Rolls section of Autotrader is a festival of bad taste. I cannot actually look at the Cullinan section for fear of retinal scarring.
Bentley? Footballers and nouveau riche. The Continental was a very pretty car until recently, but Bentley has spoiled it with the current iteration. Bentayga anyone?
Anyway, the point of this ramble is have Rolls and Bentley become somehow "less" or was it always the case that the people who bought them were very similar to today, and my young mind was just taken in by the hype?
No, to a large degree things have changed, although we mustn't forget John Lennon's Phantom's paintwork. Or one of Slade's (Dave Hill) car with YOB 1 regn number on his Rolls. I quite like that though, you can imagine it winding up a few Pringle-attired club members at the local golf club.
The issue now is the sheer number, particularly of Bentley, of cars produced. Their numbers made them quite exclusive a few decades ago, now they're everywhere. The first Bentayga I saw was visiting a neighbour and I was strughging for a while to work out which Audi SUV it was, until the badge 'clicked'. Just happens that it was owned by a director of the local football club, not that I'm suggesting anything, of course, just a statement of fact.
The issue now is the sheer number, particularly of Bentley, of cars produced. Their numbers made them quite exclusive a few decades ago, now they're everywhere. The first Bentayga I saw was visiting a neighbour and I was strughging for a while to work out which Audi SUV it was, until the badge 'clicked'. Just happens that it was owned by a director of the local football club, not that I'm suggesting anything, of course, just a statement of fact.
There's no doubting that the buyers of such cars have changed. My Dad worked for RR / Bentley most of his life until he retired in the late 90s. The cars up to that time were mainly bought by people wanting luxury rather than bling. That's apparent in the interiors of the cars of this and earlier eras, with a focus on comfort and 'waft' over show.
The world has changed a lot since then, and the vast majority of 'new money' seems to want to show off. More subtle cars simply don't give these people enough 'show' for their money. You can see this with the supercar morons in London most summers - they don't have cars like that to 'enjoy', they have them 'to be seen'. My own sports cars get ragged senseless on track days, but have never been in central London.
RR / Bentley are now catering to a target market that's different to their old target market. This has enabled them to shift greater volumes and make higher profits, but has also IMHO devalued their brand significantly.
The world has changed a lot since then, and the vast majority of 'new money' seems to want to show off. More subtle cars simply don't give these people enough 'show' for their money. You can see this with the supercar morons in London most summers - they don't have cars like that to 'enjoy', they have them 'to be seen'. My own sports cars get ragged senseless on track days, but have never been in central London.
RR / Bentley are now catering to a target market that's different to their old target market. This has enabled them to shift greater volumes and make higher profits, but has also IMHO devalued their brand significantly.
Magnum 475 said:
There's no doubting that the buyers of such cars have changed. My Dad worked for RR / Bentley most of his life until he retired in the late 90s. The cars up to that time were mainly bought by people wanting luxury rather than bling. That's apparent in the interiors of the cars of this and earlier eras, with a focus on comfort and 'waft' over show.
The world has changed a lot since then, and the vast majority of 'new money' seems to want to show off. More subtle cars simply don't give these people enough 'show' for their money. You can see this with the supercar morons in London most summers - they don't have cars like that to 'enjoy', they have them 'to be seen'. My own sports cars get ragged senseless on track days, but have never been in central London.
RR / Bentley are now catering to a target market that's different to their old target market. This has enabled them to shift greater volumes and make higher profits, but has also IMHO devalued their brand significantly.
I agree with all of this, but it has only devalued the brand in the nebulous and worthless terms of "tasteful". Tasteful is clearly not what the modern buyer wants. The world has changed a lot since then, and the vast majority of 'new money' seems to want to show off. More subtle cars simply don't give these people enough 'show' for their money. You can see this with the supercar morons in London most summers - they don't have cars like that to 'enjoy', they have them 'to be seen'. My own sports cars get ragged senseless on track days, but have never been in central London.
RR / Bentley are now catering to a target market that's different to their old target market. This has enabled them to shift greater volumes and make higher profits, but has also IMHO devalued their brand significantly.
It’s about making money. Appeal to the masses (well, I say masses in a relative way). You can only survive in the car game if you sell a decent number of cars. Unfortunately that dilutes the brand but overall it’s about survival.
Those that stay exclusive often end up dying a slow death. Bristol anyone? Companies like Morgan seem to manage it but overall it’s a hard game to play.
Mercedes realised this years ago as did Porsche. Reduce the quality, sell more units at a lesser price. Both Porsche and Mercedes went too far and quality dipped too much. But they survived. Without the 996 and 986 in the late 90s Porsche would have died. In the end they diluted the brand and quality but at least they are still here.
Those that stay exclusive often end up dying a slow death. Bristol anyone? Companies like Morgan seem to manage it but overall it’s a hard game to play.
Mercedes realised this years ago as did Porsche. Reduce the quality, sell more units at a lesser price. Both Porsche and Mercedes went too far and quality dipped too much. But they survived. Without the 996 and 986 in the late 90s Porsche would have died. In the end they diluted the brand and quality but at least they are still here.
It's much more noticeable now and definitely all about the bling factor, but I'd say it goes right back to the '60s with varying degrees when the Silver Shadow and Bentley T1 arrived, the 'old money' vs 'new money' cliche, the old school city and regimental types probably looked on aghast at this lot...
I'm easily pleased, I'd love a Shadow, T1 or T2.
I'm easily pleased, I'd love a Shadow, T1 or T2.
P5BNij said:
It's much more noticeable now and definitely all about the bling factor, but I'd say it goes right back to the '60s with varying degrees when the Silver Shadow and Bentley T1 arrived, the 'old money' vs 'new money' cliche, the old school city and regimental types probably looked on aghast at this lot...
I'm easily pleased, I'd love a Shadow, T1 or T2.
You are probably right. I do wonder how many "old money" drive new Rolls Royces now, though.I'm easily pleased, I'd love a Shadow, T1 or T2.
Louis Balfour said:
P5BNij said:
It's much more noticeable now and definitely all about the bling factor, but I'd say it goes right back to the '60s with varying degrees when the Silver Shadow and Bentley T1 arrived, the 'old money' vs 'new money' cliche, the old school city and regimental types probably looked on aghast at this lot...
I'm easily pleased, I'd love a Shadow, T1 or T2.
You are probably right. I do wonder how many "old money" drive new Rolls Royces now, though.I'm easily pleased, I'd love a Shadow, T1 or T2.
Pretty much yes, not sure which ones you do or don't recognise but from top to bottom they are Sammy Davis Jnr, Larry Grayson, Engleburt Humperdink, Keith Richards (if only his Bentley S3 Continental Flying Spur could talk, etc, etc...), the arty Bentley S1 belonging to the Beatles Apple Corp company, Lennon's flowery Phantom with his chauffuer Alf Bicknall, John Entwhistle, Barry Sheen, Engleburt again with Tom Jones and their manager and lastly Jimmy Tarbuck.
Yes. When Commedians could afford Rolls Royces their reputation took a dive. Bentley survived as they hardly sold any during the same time period. I think rhe Turbo R saved the marques reputation and helped them start go recover.
I dont thi k RR ever recovered until the Goodwood made cars arrived. They are, once again very special cars. But yes, I would love a silver shadow or T series.
I dont thi k RR ever recovered until the Goodwood made cars arrived. They are, once again very special cars. But yes, I would love a silver shadow or T series.
A friend and I had a really good look at a couple of Shadows and Cloud I at the NEC classics show auction last year, the bodywork of all three needed some attention but the interiors looked and smelled fantastic. They were all too big for my garage but a boy can dream occasionally, well, too often really...!
I spotted this Silver Cloud in Henley-in-Arden a few years ago, a very well dressed elderly couple were sat in it having a cup of tea, with proper cups and saucers....
NEC show pics from recent years....
Early advert....
Sheer class....
Amazing how a car like a Silver Shadow can end up in this condition....
I spotted this Silver Cloud in Henley-in-Arden a few years ago, a very well dressed elderly couple were sat in it having a cup of tea, with proper cups and saucers....
NEC show pics from recent years....
Early advert....
Sheer class....
Amazing how a car like a Silver Shadow can end up in this condition....
Edited by P5BNij on Tuesday 1st September 19:51
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