Another problem with my clio 172, wahey!
Discussion
Over the last week or so my car has not started first time in the mornings and the 2 weeks before that I noticed the start was quite rough. I turn the key and the revs reach about 200, it chugs and stops. Then I turn the key almost instantly again and it starts as it should. Any other time in the day it will start first time, this is just in the morning after its been off for about 14 hours.
I'm guessing it's a faulty sensor of some sort as the starter motor is turning?
I'm guessing it's a faulty sensor of some sort as the starter motor is turning?
eybic said:
does it sound rattly first thing for a few seconds? not sure if a 172 has a camshaft dephaser but these are knwon to cause cold start issues.
Thanks for the quick reply.Rattly when it fails to start or rattly when it eventually does? It does actually rattle a bit when it starts but then after a minute or so it sounds smooth. When it fails to start it just sounds like a normal stall.
Edited by MSTRBKR on Thursday 17th June 09:39
markcp said:
Mine has started doing exactly the same thing over the last few weeks. Its happened previously and it was the ignition relay that time so I carry a few spares in the car just in case. It'll eventually get to the point where it doesn't start at all!
Thanks for the info. Ignition relay you say, I will look into it. How much was this and can I fit it with a few tools and a couple of hours work myself?ETA: It started sweet as a nut after work today 9 hours after I got to work. Those extra 5 hours sitting overnight really make the difference.
jonnydm said:
As I'm in the market for a budget 172 at the moment, this is all fairly worrying. I've had cars with rough edges before but don't want something with potentially major issues. Surely correctly serviced examples should be ok?
Mine has a full renault or rentech service history every 12k, cambelt change on time, oil changes on time and all kinds of other engine work receipts. Some things just need replacing at some point or another I suppose - it is approaching 80k after all.Please don't let it put you off buying one, they are brilliant. Although I admit my thread title does sound like its a terrible car to maintain, it isn't at all. It's that I've just sorted the speedo sensor and this has cropped up. I've had mine 5 months and so far it's had new rear brake pads (£30) fitted myself, and a new speedo sensor (£25) also fitted myself. It's not even had oil in that time, the oil guage on the trip computer indicates it is topped right up.
Edited by MSTRBKR on Thursday 17th June 18:32
MSTRBKR said:
Please don't let it put you off buying one, they are brilliant.
I'll echo that. I've had mine a few months and love it. I've replaced the rear dampers, had the cambelt done and about to have the clutch cable replaced. Other than the dampers the other jobs could have been left for a bit longer but I'm about to start tracking the car and want it on top form.Mine always surprises me how capable it is when I drive it, over 4,000rpm the engine comes alive, for the money I don't think there's much else like it.
Get one bought
eybic said:
I think the dephaser rattles for a few seconds when it actually starts then gets quiet. It's definately an issue on meganes but could be on a 172 also but I'm not sure.
They do not use the same dephaser as the K4m's. The problem with the 172 sounds like a TDC sensor. Not un-common, a cheap and easy fix.
GTP rpm said:
eybic said:
I think the dephaser rattles for a few seconds when it actually starts then gets quiet. It's definately an issue on meganes but could be on a 172 also but I'm not sure.
They do not use the same dephaser as the K4m's. The problem with the 172 sounds like a TDC sensor. Not un-common, a cheap and easy fix.
http://www.parkers.co.uk/advice/forum/topic.asp?TO...
Symptoms of a faulty TDC are:
1) Engine cranks but won’t start
2) Engine begins to idle roughly
This is pretty much what I have at the moment. Glad that it is located on top of the bell housing, it must be right next to the speedometer sensor! £17 fix, love it.
from my time hunting the forums on Clio Sport.net it does sound like the TDC sensor - my 172 Cup is in the garage tomorrow to have that very sensor checked as mine has a mis-fire at low revs & the plugs & leads have been changed. wicked little cars though - only had it a few months & done a few hillclimbs with it - completely standard bar a loud & annoying induction kit that I will get around to changing sometime!
faboka said:
Hello,
Just stumbled across this thread from a google search. My wifes 2004 182 has started to not fire the first time in the morning. Second time it fires straight away. Been looking on cliosport and it sounds like the TDC sesnor is at fault.
Question is where about is it?
Cheers
From what I've read it is located on the bell housing of the gearbox/dif on the right hand side of the engine. You need to take off the air box to get to it. It's attached with a brass banana shaped bracket. I took my air box off the other week to take the sensor off and clean it but I ran out of time as there are also 3 pipes to remove. I'm going to take it completely off in a couple of weekends time, I'll post pictures in this thread when I do.Just stumbled across this thread from a google search. My wifes 2004 182 has started to not fire the first time in the morning. Second time it fires straight away. Been looking on cliosport and it sounds like the TDC sesnor is at fault.
Question is where about is it?
Cheers
faboka said:
Thats would be really helpful thanks.
The last couple of days, in the morning I turn the igintion on then off and back on and again and then start the engine. Starts striaght away that way.
I have a new trick as well. I turn the ignition on as soon as I open the door, then sit down, belt on, put my iPod into the dock and then start the engine. It's worked every day this week but it's still idling like a dog The last couple of days, in the morning I turn the igintion on then off and back on and again and then start the engine. Starts striaght away that way.
Really sorry but I completely forgot to take pictures of this today, but it is easy to do if you have the right tools.
The airbox needs to come completely off the car to have enough space to undo the bolts. The 2 pipes that draw air from the front pull out of the airbox with a bit of wiggling. The pipe that draws air from the top of the bumper behind the N/S light cluster simply pops off the car. Optional whether you want to take it off but it gives you more room which you need, trust me!
The sensor is fixed to the banana shaped bracket and the bracket fits to the block by a couple of bolts. Problem is these are both behind some radiator pipes but if you have a socket set with and extender you can reach the bolts and use the space where the airbox used to be to rotate the handle. The bolts are VERY easy to lose in the engine bay as you cant really get your hand and the socket in there at the same time. So loosen the bolts with the socket set, then get your hand in there to finish so you can hold on to the bolts.
So I got the sensor out and it was very, very dirty. The metal end which I presume does the sensing was entirely blackened so I cleaned that up so it was shiny metal again and bolted it back on.
On cliosport.net it is suggested that you also clean the throttle body because it can stick and cause this issue. So I took mine off and sure enough, thick black oil around the butterfly valve which I'm sure doesn't help the thing move very easily. So I took that off and gave it a damn good clean with WD40 and a rag, spotless now.
So after all that the engine started first time, but I would expect it to as I had already run the car today. However, it was a much smoother start than normal (usally jolts the car) and it just sounds better generally. Only time will tell over the next few days to see if it starts any better.
Hope that helps.
The airbox needs to come completely off the car to have enough space to undo the bolts. The 2 pipes that draw air from the front pull out of the airbox with a bit of wiggling. The pipe that draws air from the top of the bumper behind the N/S light cluster simply pops off the car. Optional whether you want to take it off but it gives you more room which you need, trust me!
The sensor is fixed to the banana shaped bracket and the bracket fits to the block by a couple of bolts. Problem is these are both behind some radiator pipes but if you have a socket set with and extender you can reach the bolts and use the space where the airbox used to be to rotate the handle. The bolts are VERY easy to lose in the engine bay as you cant really get your hand and the socket in there at the same time. So loosen the bolts with the socket set, then get your hand in there to finish so you can hold on to the bolts.
So I got the sensor out and it was very, very dirty. The metal end which I presume does the sensing was entirely blackened so I cleaned that up so it was shiny metal again and bolted it back on.
On cliosport.net it is suggested that you also clean the throttle body because it can stick and cause this issue. So I took mine off and sure enough, thick black oil around the butterfly valve which I'm sure doesn't help the thing move very easily. So I took that off and gave it a damn good clean with WD40 and a rag, spotless now.
So after all that the engine started first time, but I would expect it to as I had already run the car today. However, it was a much smoother start than normal (usally jolts the car) and it just sounds better generally. Only time will tell over the next few days to see if it starts any better.
Hope that helps.
The TDC sensors should, in my opinion be replaced along with a new connector wiring kit from Renault.
Countless times we've had back street garages replacing TDC sensor, but not the connector mod from Renault.
You'll be alright, I expect - but for the sake of an extra £20 and a bit of soldering/heat shrinking, it's worth it.
Countless times we've had back street garages replacing TDC sensor, but not the connector mod from Renault.
You'll be alright, I expect - but for the sake of an extra £20 and a bit of soldering/heat shrinking, it's worth it.
With the sensor costing £60 and £20 on top I thought I'd first clean everything up to save myself some money if possible, thanks for the info though.
I'm quite happy with it at the moment. After over a week not being driven the car started first time extremely smoothly with the idle returning to ~800rpm almost straight away and significantly reduced vibration. This was all from cleaning the sensor and throttle body as above.
One other thing I did was to fill it will Sainsurys super unleaded (BP supplied I think?) instead of Tesco super (I've heard the stories, I know I should never have run it on that now) and I think that has also played its part in how sweet it is now running.
Always nice to sort out a problem without spending any money
I'm quite happy with it at the moment. After over a week not being driven the car started first time extremely smoothly with the idle returning to ~800rpm almost straight away and significantly reduced vibration. This was all from cleaning the sensor and throttle body as above.
One other thing I did was to fill it will Sainsurys super unleaded (BP supplied I think?) instead of Tesco super (I've heard the stories, I know I should never have run it on that now) and I think that has also played its part in how sweet it is now running.
Always nice to sort out a problem without spending any money
Hi all,
My 172 Clio cup has the mentioned intermittent starting problems. There is no common pattern,it can be problematic from warm or cold. I have taken it to the main dealer who have advised they have detected no problems after a full engine analysis. However as a precautionary step Renault have suggested replacing the TDC sensor although no faults have been found. I have been quoted £200 for supply and fit! I was led to believe from previous posts that the sensors were reasonably priced? Are Renault taking me for a ride with this quote? Any advice would be much appreciated.
My 172 Clio cup has the mentioned intermittent starting problems. There is no common pattern,it can be problematic from warm or cold. I have taken it to the main dealer who have advised they have detected no problems after a full engine analysis. However as a precautionary step Renault have suggested replacing the TDC sensor although no faults have been found. I have been quoted £200 for supply and fit! I was led to believe from previous posts that the sensors were reasonably priced? Are Renault taking me for a ride with this quote? Any advice would be much appreciated.
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