205 GTI brake failure

[Nige_GTI]

Seeing as you lot were so helpful last time (and I can't get on the 205 forum yet)

I have just been out for a drive, brakes were working fine, then as I was stopping from about 60ish, the pedal went to the floor and I lost all brakes. Managed to limp the remaining 2 miles home, by using the gears, but not good.

Does anybody know what it might be (ie common problems) the disks and pads are both ok.

I'm thinking snapped brake line or fluid leak somewhere?

Thanks in advance

Nigel

Edited by Nige_GTI on Wednesday 15th July 23:12

[andye30m3]

I've had this in the past on my 1.6 and it turned out to be the master cylinder

[TEKNOPUG]

Master cylinder – any issue with the brake lines/fluid would be obvious (you’d see the leak!) and not as dramatic as it wouldn’t effect all 4 brakes simultaneously (unlike the master cylinder). It’s probably blown a seal. Pretty straightforward to replace.

[sorrento205]

dont know if it applies to you, possibly not, but some people in the past have lost the rear pads out of the caliper if they havent been fitted correctly and that can have the same effect as you are just pumping the slave cylinder out continuously

[Nige_GTI]

Thanks for the help, I have ordered a master cylinder now (only £25), but I will check out the rear brake pads.

Extremely scary situation though when the car starts stopping, then nothing!

[DiscoStu]

I once had this on a 205 and it to was the MC at fault. Easy to change, just the bolt on the pedal, the two 13mm's in the engine bay and the brake pipes to undo. Dont forget to bleed your brakes.

Never heard of losing a pad, that cant be good lol

[Soton Pug]

DiscoStu said:

Never heard of losing a pad, that cant be good lol

Ruins the inside of the rim...

[andye30m3]

I've also lost two rear pads on a Renault 5 GT turbo (same rear caliper as the 205 i think)

not good as the piston can pop out and you then loose the fluid.

[TEKNOPUG]

The disc retaining pins can go and you get a loose pad. Symptoms are a clonk when braking in reverse. I always wired mine up for peace of mind.

[sorrento205]

DiscoStu said:

Never heard of losing a pad, that cant be good lol

it's the 1/4" x 1" bar that sits in the bottom of the caliper that can come free and then the pads will eventually bid for freedom. Aslong as the small pinch pins have been fitted correctly then there shouldnt be a problem, but wirelocking them is a much safer solution.

[DiscoStu]

Cheers for that, think i'l wire lock mine when i change the pads and discs. Don't fancy them falling out on me.

[Nige_GTI]

The old master cylinder looks like it has been bought up from the titanic, I suspect it been leaking for some time.

Does anybody have a guide on how to change it?

It will be first attempt, and although I am pretty sure I can do, a guide would be good (it is the braking system after all)

[DiscoStu]

It really is pretty straight forward Nige. I'd start off inside the car at your pedal box.

Undo the nylock nut and bolt that run through your brake pedal (16mm iirc) this will release the MC from the pedal.

Next your heading under the bonnet. Firstly undo the brake fixings from the MC, 11mm (i think) open ended spanner should do it and pull the brake pipes out of the MC. It might be worth wrapping the ends of the pipes in some old rags to stop them from dripping brake fluid everywhere,

Next undo the two 13mm nuts that hold the MC to the brake servo, this will release the MC so you might want to hold it when you undo the last one.

Now trying to keep it upright (so you dont make too much mess) remove the MC from the servo by pulling it forward and out. Empty any left over fluid from the reservior and pull it out of the MC (it is simply a tight fit into rubber seals).

Refitting is simply a reversal of removal. Plus you'll need to bleed your brakes. Does that help?

[Nige_GTI]

Yes thanks, exactly what I needed, the order of removal.

Going to be fun trying remove it all after 20years!

[TEKNOPUG]

I’d suggest replacing the reservoir and cap whilst you’re at it.

[Nige_GTI]

The parts people just rang me up and said that there are 4 different parts for the master cylinder (peugeout have now said the same thing), Is this the correct part from GSF?

65269F BRAKE MAS CYL-20.6mm 205 19mm 22.50

As it seems much cheaper than the options on Autofive below?
http://www.autofive.co.uk/home.htm

The old one is soo corroded I don't think the part number is visable!

[DiscoStu]

Is your 205 a 1.6 or 1.9 and does it have abs?

edit:- if you dont want to fork out for a brand new one i have a few good used ones here. email me if you want one, it wont cost you much

Edited by DiscoStu on Friday 17th July 16:34

[Nige_GTI]

1.9 1989 'G' reg no ABS

[Simes205]

DiscoStu said:

Undo the nylock nut and bolt that run through your brake pedal (16mm iirc) this will release the MC from the pedal.

I didn't think that there was any physical locking connection?
On the two I've done - after draining and then removing the copper lines from the M/C, I've simply undone both M8 nuts and removed the MC from the servo.
Maybe I've missed something?

Edited by Simes205 on Friday 17th July 18:13

[Simes205]

Nige_GTI said:

1.9 1989 'G' reg no ABS

20.6mm