205 GTI Turbo?
Discussion
The GTI6 conversion makes 205's nose heavy and the Mi16 is a well tried and tested way of spending shed loads of time and money for little more than a well tuned XU engine. Currently my car has a 2.1 bored out block, ported gas flowed head, 285 degree (I believe piper fast road/race) cam, chipped ecu, stock induction, with a free flowing exhaust and Piper cross filter. Adjustable shocks, lowered front springs, 309 GTI rear beam with new tortion bars lowered to the same height as the front, polly bushes all round and a new front anti-roll bar. She's quicker than my mates 306 GTI6, Clio Williams II and holds her own against my brothers Civic Type R apart from long straights. I'd guess about 170 to 180 bhp-ish. Just googled the Technics conversion 250 bhp is Do-able. :-) But the reason I have the 205 is I have a very limited budget. The car is excellent how she is right now, just wondered if I could turbo the car with the bits I have or sell the Uno and use the money for something else like a Supercharger.
Robert060379 said:
The GTI6 conversion makes 205's nose heavy and the Mi16 is a well tried and tested way of spending shed loads of time and money for little more than a well tuned XU engine. Currently my car has a 2.1 bored out block, ported gas flowed head, 285 degree (I believe piper fast road/race) cam, chipped ecu, stock induction, with a free flowing exhaust and Piper cross filter. Adjustable shocks, lowered front springs, 309 GTI rear beam with new tortion bars lowered to the same height as the front, polly bushes all round and a new front anti-roll bar. She's quicker than my mates 306 GTI6, Clio Williams II and holds her own against my brothers Civic Type R apart from long straights. I'd guess about 170 to 180 bhp-ish. Just googled the Technics conversion 250 bhp is Do-able. :-) But the reason I have the 205 is I have a very limited budget. The car is excellent how she is right now, just wondered if I could turbo the car with the bits I have or sell the Uno and use the money for something else like a Supercharger.
I was getting between 169 and 175bhp ( depended which rr) from my Mi16 with the only mods being a pair of 262 cams! Even the management was the trusty Motronic.Have a look around 205gtidrivers site for more info, you may find some more info. A 2.1 (diesel crank?) would go well with a turbo. There are a few threads involving the Eaton supercharger.
Robert060379 said:
The GTI6 conversion makes 205's nose heavy and the Mi16 is a well tried and tested way of spending shed loads of time and money for little more than a well tuned XU engine. Currently my car has a 2.1 bored out block, ported gas flowed head, 285 degree (I believe piper fast road/race) cam, chipped ecu, stock induction, with a free flowing exhaust and Piper cross filter. Adjustable shocks, lowered front springs, 309 GTI rear beam with new tortion bars lowered to the same height as the front, polly bushes all round and a new front anti-roll bar. She's quicker than my mates 306 GTI6, Clio Williams II and holds her own against my brothers Civic Type R apart from long straights. I'd guess about 170 to 180 bhp-ish. Just googled the Technics conversion 250 bhp is Do-able. :-) But the reason I have the 205 is I have a very limited budget. The car is excellent how she is right now, just wondered if I could turbo the car with the bits I have or sell the Uno and use the money for something else like a Supercharger.
If you have even close to 170bhp with that set-up on an 8v then I'll eat Sime's hat! The extra torque from the additional cc's and cam will certainly be noticeable and given the low weight of the 205, I'm in NO (sorry - typo)doubt that it will outperform GTi-6s/CTR - this I know from experience 
Limiting factor on the 8v will always be airflow, the induction and management. You could go twin carbs or throttle bodies. A mate used to have a 2.0 8v on twin carbs with-headwork (and a whole lot more) pushing 185+bhp - pulled like a train - cost a fortune! Inlet manifold, TB, linkages, proper management, mapping etc - £1500+ easily. And for not a huge gain. You could turbocharge your engine for the same cost and have 230+bhp.
Either way you look at it, to get any appreciable increase in power on your engine, you'll definitely need to junk the standard induction. The clock-work j-tronic ignition can be made to work with carbs or turbo, but it's really not very good and will cost you a lot of power. So, factor in £700 for mappable fuel and ignition system before you even think about the induction side. Options for making the 8v go quicker for minimum outlay are a lightened flywheel, lowered gear ratios and stripped interior. There is no cheap route for your 8v now - your at the limits of what can be done before you have to spend big.
Alternatively, an engine swap opens up a whole new range of low cost possibilites. Have no idea where you are going with your comment that an Mi16 is a well tried and tested way of spending shed loads of time and money for little more than a well tuned XU engine. The Mi16 IS an XU engine - bottom end is no different to an 8v - bar the better crank. It's an 16v XU - makes 160bhp out of the box, has an alloy bottom end, revs to 8k, is cheap and available, drops straight in. 190+ with cams and headwork with standard induction and management. True, it has oil surges issues on track, although the number of people who have actually experienced this is far less than the actual perceived problem. Gti-6? Yeah, it has an iron-block - 20kg's heavier. But unless you are a racing driver pushing the car to it's limits - you AREN'T going to notice it. Blind test an alloy Mi16 205 and an Iron Mi16 205 and see how many people can actually tell the difference - very, very few I'd imagine! Coupled to that, you get a modern engine (exotic oil-squirters on the cams!), with no oil surge, 167bhp stock, 200+ with cams and head on standard induction - cambelt change, drop engine in - thrash tits off it
Either flavour of 16v engine should be able to be bought and fitted for £500 - which will probably leave you with a lot of change from selling your 8v, for more go faster bits. Finally, you could fit an XU10 turbo from a 406/XM for peanuts. Couple of cheap tweaks and you are running 200+bhp with a load of torque to match. Hardly sophisticated but it gets the job done and can be the basis for serious power once funds allow (bottom ends have been proved to run over 300bhp).
Personally, I'd sell the 285cam and fit a standard one, TT Manifold from 205parts, GT25R turbo, Cossie intercooler, Emerald injection, standard compression, 1bar should see 230+bhp, shed loads of torque and nice off-boost characteristics too.
Oh and no, your Uno bits only good for selling and putting towards the Pug budget.
BTW - re: Supercharger - the ones from the Mini (the cheaply available ones) simply aren't big enough to get appreciable gains from your already tuned engine. Can be done but it's easier and more beneficial to turbocharge the engine.
Edited by TEKNOPUG on Friday 13th February 12:14
lol - didn't mean to come across as dismissive, it's just that I think that spending money on the 8v XU is a real waste of time unless you go forced induction (which works very well). Don't get me wrong, you CAN get good power from an 8v but it's gonna cost a lot - whereas you can drop in a 16v for £500 and you've got 160+bhp before you even think about mods.
Edited my original post due to typo - a tuned 205 WILL outperform GTI-6's/CTR - Boxsters too!
Edited my original post due to typo - a tuned 205 WILL outperform GTI-6's/CTR - Boxsters too!
Edited by TEKNOPUG on Friday 13th February 12:15
Thank you for all the advice.
Just had the car on the rolling road, 163bhp so Simes hat is safe. The car is running rich at idle (knackered filter) and seems to even itself out further up the rev range (168bhp without a filter at all). Good torque curve. My estimate wasn't far out considering it felt more due to the lack of weight.
It's a bloody good little car but still not as quick as my Uno was (still is if I don't mind the view through the floor). The Uno was a bit "all or nothing" as far as power delivery goes, the 205 is far more sedate and well behaved until you remember what your right foot does. Got a new filter ordered and I think I'll get my pipe bender out next day off to make a new exhaust manifold.
Just had the car on the rolling road, 163bhp so Simes hat is safe. The car is running rich at idle (knackered filter) and seems to even itself out further up the rev range (168bhp without a filter at all). Good torque curve. My estimate wasn't far out considering it felt more due to the lack of weight.
It's a bloody good little car but still not as quick as my Uno was (still is if I don't mind the view through the floor). The Uno was a bit "all or nothing" as far as power delivery goes, the 205 is far more sedate and well behaved until you remember what your right foot does. Got a new filter ordered and I think I'll get my pipe bender out next day off to make a new exhaust manifold.
165bhp is a good figure on standard induction. Search ebay and forums for bike bodies or twin carbs if you are after more, cheaply. May as well make sure everything else is running properly so give it a full service - plugs, leads, filters, fluids etc.
Lightened flywheels aren't too pricey and will make a difference, as will putting the car on a diet. Uno will feel quicker due to the big dollop of midrange torque but probably no difference in speed through a 0-100 run.
Oh and join here www.205gtidrivers.com
Lightened flywheels aren't too pricey and will make a difference, as will putting the car on a diet. Uno will feel quicker due to the big dollop of midrange torque but probably no difference in speed through a 0-100 run.
Oh and join here www.205gtidrivers.com
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