Citroen C5 HDi, thoughts?
Discussion
Hi all,
Due to a vast increase in my commute I'm having dark thoughts about swapping the beemer for something a little less costly on the fuel front. As I want to stick with an auto (getting lazy in my old age) I pretty much have to be looking at diesels to get a significant impovement in economy. Currently I'm averaging 30mpg which is a couple of mpg over the combined figure for the 528, so something that'll crack 50mpg would do the job! My commute has about 20miles of B road followed by 40odd grinding down the M11. It's the first 20miles that kills the mpg as it's rare to get over 40mph and there's plenty of stop/start through villages.
Anyhoo, the C5 has come up as a potentially, something like this maybe:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/821014.htm
So first off, can it actually do 50mpg? Then (silly question) what's the reliability like, typical froggy electrics? Fancy air suspension too I see, how much of a pounding can that take as the roads around here are bloody awful? What's the deal with particle filters on the HDi engine? An Ebay seller was saying that the 2.2 has one and any hdi built post 2003 with a cost of around £500 to replace it and something about 'eloy' liquid.
Any thoughts are most welcome!
Cheers,
Rob
Due to a vast increase in my commute I'm having dark thoughts about swapping the beemer for something a little less costly on the fuel front. As I want to stick with an auto (getting lazy in my old age) I pretty much have to be looking at diesels to get a significant impovement in economy. Currently I'm averaging 30mpg which is a couple of mpg over the combined figure for the 528, so something that'll crack 50mpg would do the job! My commute has about 20miles of B road followed by 40odd grinding down the M11. It's the first 20miles that kills the mpg as it's rare to get over 40mph and there's plenty of stop/start through villages.
Anyhoo, the C5 has come up as a potentially, something like this maybe:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/821014.htm
So first off, can it actually do 50mpg? Then (silly question) what's the reliability like, typical froggy electrics? Fancy air suspension too I see, how much of a pounding can that take as the roads around here are bloody awful? What's the deal with particle filters on the HDi engine? An Ebay seller was saying that the 2.2 has one and any hdi built post 2003 with a cost of around £500 to replace it and something about 'eloy' liquid.
Any thoughts are most welcome!
Cheers,
Rob
My Dad has driven C5's as company cars since they were launched in 2001! Hopefully I can be of some help.
If you're going to be using it as a mile muncher, you'll realise just how badly the BMW rides in comparison! A friend of mine has a 530d of the same era as the C5s and the ride is god awful in comparison. The Hydractive 3 suspension (the corporate b
ksy name for hydraulic suspension!) is exceptionally good for ride comfort, but will not feel as sporty as the BMW (if that's what you want). Also, from memory, the suspension doesn't need any maintenance for 125,000 miles or XX years (can't remember that figure) so they have always been fully confident in the reliability of the system. Also, having been involved in the garage network with my Dad, seeing a C5 with suspension issues is extremely rare.
Further to my comment about the "sporty" drive, the C5 doesn't encourage you to hoon as it's just not that type of car. FWD and gas suspension is more a recipe for limo like luxury than hot hatch handling! However if you do find yourself pressing on a bit, you'll be impressed at how the adaptive suspension firms up, and you can go round corners alot (and I speak from experience!) faster than you think you can (especially if you get the SX trim or above with the "sport" setting on the suspension!).
In terms of fuel economy, they are as good as anything else in their class, and on a motorway commute you could easily do 50mpg if you weren't being stupid. Even the 2.2HDi with the auto box could average around 50mpg being gentle, and 40 combined. If you are able to consider a post 2004 model (with the facelift), they put the new 138bhp 2.0HDi in the C5 which is used in all current "bigger" Citroens, and is a stunning engine (quieter than anything the Germans can manage!), amazingly economical, and has such a low peak torque point that you never have to hurry it as it always seems to be on the boil! This was a direct replacement for the earlier 2.2HDi engine, with the old 2.0HDi 110bhp model being replaced with the 1.6HDi 110 (which believe it or not is as fast as, if not faster than the already impressive old 2.0, despite being only 1560cc!).
Your other point regarding the particle filter isn't something it sounds like you need to worry about, as doing the amount of miles you are, with the motorway stint, you'll always be driving it in a way that keeps it clean. They only seem to have problems with clogging when they are used for the weekly 2 mile round trip to the supermarket with Granny Smith, as they never get hot enough to burn off the st they gather. In terms of overall reliability, other than the early ones having the usual teething problems, there are no horror stories associated with them to my knowledge.
For someone who loves cars, and enjoys driving, most people would think of any car in this class as their worst nightmare! As one of these people myself, I however think, for what they are, they are a seriously underrated car, and if I had a long commute, I'd buy one without hesitation. For what you pay for them (especially these days) you won't find more comfort (and space) for your money. My advice would be try one and see what you think. Unless you need the extra performance, the older 2.0HDi and the newer 1.6 have more than enough guts in them for the outside lane. If you're feeling flush and can get hold of a late 2006 onwards 2.2HDi, this is the new bi-turbo 173bhp engine which is more economical than the 2.0 and goes like stink, but that's a whole different matter I guess
!
Any more questions, fire away and I'll give them a go (or ask my Dad!). Hope this helps.
If you're going to be using it as a mile muncher, you'll realise just how badly the BMW rides in comparison! A friend of mine has a 530d of the same era as the C5s and the ride is god awful in comparison. The Hydractive 3 suspension (the corporate b
ksy name for hydraulic suspension!) is exceptionally good for ride comfort, but will not feel as sporty as the BMW (if that's what you want). Also, from memory, the suspension doesn't need any maintenance for 125,000 miles or XX years (can't remember that figure) so they have always been fully confident in the reliability of the system. Also, having been involved in the garage network with my Dad, seeing a C5 with suspension issues is extremely rare.Further to my comment about the "sporty" drive, the C5 doesn't encourage you to hoon as it's just not that type of car. FWD and gas suspension is more a recipe for limo like luxury than hot hatch handling! However if you do find yourself pressing on a bit, you'll be impressed at how the adaptive suspension firms up, and you can go round corners alot (and I speak from experience!) faster than you think you can (especially if you get the SX trim or above with the "sport" setting on the suspension!).
In terms of fuel economy, they are as good as anything else in their class, and on a motorway commute you could easily do 50mpg if you weren't being stupid. Even the 2.2HDi with the auto box could average around 50mpg being gentle, and 40 combined. If you are able to consider a post 2004 model (with the facelift), they put the new 138bhp 2.0HDi in the C5 which is used in all current "bigger" Citroens, and is a stunning engine (quieter than anything the Germans can manage!), amazingly economical, and has such a low peak torque point that you never have to hurry it as it always seems to be on the boil! This was a direct replacement for the earlier 2.2HDi engine, with the old 2.0HDi 110bhp model being replaced with the 1.6HDi 110 (which believe it or not is as fast as, if not faster than the already impressive old 2.0, despite being only 1560cc!).
Your other point regarding the particle filter isn't something it sounds like you need to worry about, as doing the amount of miles you are, with the motorway stint, you'll always be driving it in a way that keeps it clean. They only seem to have problems with clogging when they are used for the weekly 2 mile round trip to the supermarket with Granny Smith, as they never get hot enough to burn off the s
t they gather. In terms of overall reliability, other than the early ones having the usual teething problems, there are no horror stories associated with them to my knowledge.For someone who loves cars, and enjoys driving, most people would think of any car in this class as their worst nightmare! As one of these people myself, I however think, for what they are, they are a seriously underrated car, and if I had a long commute, I'd buy one without hesitation. For what you pay for them (especially these days) you won't find more comfort (and space) for your money. My advice would be try one and see what you think. Unless you need the extra performance, the older 2.0HDi and the newer 1.6 have more than enough guts in them for the outside lane. If you're feeling flush and can get hold of a late 2006 onwards 2.2HDi, this is the new bi-turbo 173bhp engine which is more economical than the 2.0 and goes like stink, but that's a whole different matter I guess
!Any more questions, fire away and I'll give them a go (or ask my Dad!). Hope this helps.
All i would add to andrews post is i would stear clear of the 2.2 because of the £500 bill for the replacement particle filter ,which do have a tendency to clog up through lack of high rev usage.It beats me how a car that's designed for economy has to be thrashed to stop the particle filter blocking therefore ruining the fuel consumption.
Thanks for that Paul. Looks like 2l is where I'd be ending up as I'm trying to keep the budget under £4k which keeps the 1.6 out of range, and as I'm after the best economy I can get then the 2l trumps the 2.2l, I can't say I'm too fussed about the extra second or 2 it takes to trundle up to 60.
I just need to get in to the right sort of mindset first before taking the plunge in to oil-burnerville. I'll definitely miss the old 5er
I s'pose I can always chip the bugger
Cheers,
Rob
I just need to get in to the right sort of mindset first before taking the plunge in to oil-burnerville. I'll definitely miss the old 5er
I s'pose I can always chip the bugger
Cheers,
Rob
Parents run a C5 petrol version from new (Oct. 2001) - some insignificant teething troubles that took a bit longer for the dealer network to sort than they should, peeling soft lacquer trim on the inside door handles but apart from that they do exactly what is says on the tin. It won't win any beauty contests but it's a large, very comfortable, sturdy motor that offered lots of technology, space and comfort for the money back then and given depreciation to bargain barge levels now, if you like that sort of thing why not... 
Edited by 900T-R on Monday 29th December 19:29
Gassing Station | French Bred | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff