Clio 182 Engine woes...

[docter fox]

Evening All,

I'm after a bit of advice, I've done lots of searching but seem to be running out of ideas... My 182 failed it's MOT on a few things, the main one being emissions. It's always had a very lumpy idle and if left idling for a long time, the EML would come on but went off after turning it off and on. Recently, the light has been coming on more often but goes went straight off under load when it got to around 4k rpm. It failed the MOT on emissions to the garage suggested putting some additive in to clean it. I plugged in my cheap OBD reader and using the Piston App, discovered an 02 sensor fault and a misfire on cylinder 3, it was still running fine at this point but the light was coming on more frequently than it used to. I got a 2 part assistive pack from Halfords, put the first bottle in and ran it through a full tank (with 98 RON). I used that tank and then put the second part in, it may well be coincidence but over this time I think it's been getting worse.

What I've done since then:
Changed the Pre Cat Lambda - 02 sensor no longer a fault but still got a misfire on cylinder 3.
Swapped injector 2 with injector 3 - still got a misfire on cylinder 3
Changed the spark plugs - still got a misfire on cylinder 3
Changed the coil pack - still got a misfire on cylinder 3
Changed the ignition leads - misfire on cylinder 2
Put the old number 2 lead back on - still got a misfire on cylinder 2

Next thoughts are that I could switch spark plugs between 1 and 2 to see if it's still spark related but I'm running out of ideas... HELP???

[xu5]

Are you sure the leads are on the coil pack in the right order? Not shorting to the engine?

[docter fox]

It has numbering on the coil but I could well have got the leads mixed up... Thanks, I'll double check!

[Oliiiiiiiii]

Are the plugs NGK PFR6E-10? Due to their price people often try to use cheaper plugs. As far as i am aware the car will not run properly on any other plugs. if it's not that, i'd wait until you get a reply on your cliosport.net thread

http://www.renaultpartsdirect.co.uk/product/renaul...

[fivepointnine]

Often times bad injectors will give you misfire codes.

[megamaniac]

On the 2.0 PSA XU10 engine you get these faults due to gummed up tappets, an engine flush usually sorts them out.Worth a try.

[docter fox]

It used to run fine on the old Bosch plugs and I've replaced with Bosch plugs, is there really that much difference?

Tonight I might try swapping injector 1 with injector 2 and swapping plug 2 with plug 4 and see what code it gives me then...

[Feirny]

docter fox said:

It used to run fine on the old Bosch plugs and I've replaced with Bosch plugs, is there really that much difference?

Tonight I might try swapping injector 1 with injector 2 and swapping plug 2 with plug 4 and see what code it gives me then...

Yes, the wrong plugs can cause all sorts of misfire issues. One of my old 182's came with Bosch and wasn't running right, put the PFR6E-10 in and it ran sweet.

[xu5]

Feirny said:

docter fox said:

It used to run fine on the old Bosch plugs and I've replaced with Bosch plugs, is there really that much difference?

Tonight I might try swapping injector 1 with injector 2 and swapping plug 2 with plug 4 and see what code it gives me then...

Yes, the wrong plugs can cause all sorts of misfire issues. One of my old 182's came with Bosch and wasn't running right, put the PFR6E-10 in and it ran sweet.

Defo only use PFR6E-10 plugs. When I had my 172 cup I used the bosch equivalent. Ran fine for a couple of hundred miles but then turned into a complete bag of spanners.

[docter fox]

I hate searching to find threads without the solution posted so thought I'd post an update in case it's useful for anyone else.

I first swapped plug 2 with plug 4 - cleared codes and misfire still on cylinder 2
I then swapped injector 2 with injector 1 - cleared codes and misfire now in cylinder 1! Promising news...

I had bought a spare injector to keep in the tool bag after a previous issue that was resolved with replacing an injector so swapped this over and the change in sound was immediate. It's been running well for a while and it seems to have cured the problem. Thanks for all of the comments, I might try a set of these NGK plugs once everything else is sorted but it seems to be back running well with the Bosch plugs for now.

[Alex_6n2]

Definitely recommend the proper spark plugs for the F4R Engine

I did a similar dance to yourself and eventually just replaced all 4 injectors with new items. They're only £40 from Euro car parts and mine ran fine after that.

The turbo Megane engine has the same issues too. No idea why Renault insist on speccing the same rubbish injectors, but oh well.

Did check the MOT history yesterday for my 182 and it's no longer on the road

[adamwri]

My issues were down to non-OEM spark plugs and the car is now driving much, much better. Perhaps worth whipping out the Bosch plugs and trying OEM?

[Krikkit]

As above chaps, the OP has sorted the issue.

FWIW I'd also recommend changing the plugs (at the next service) just for peace of mind - many tales of poor running on the non-specific plugs for that engine.

Interestingly I had an injector randomly die on my 172 as well, I've never had one go before. Unfortunately I needed a second, as when removing the rail one of the connectors snapped off another! Run sweet as since then though.

[docter fox]

I may have spoken too soon... As I mentioned earlier, I changed injector number 1 and it was running fine and pulling strongly throughout the rev range on the way to the MOT this morning. Possibly because it was left idling for a quite a long time (it's never liked that) but when they came to doing the fast idle test, it was misfiring and failed the fast idle test.

The lambda reading was 1.13 with a max allowed of 1.03. It was clearly misfiring when he drove it out the garage so when I went out to the car and plugged in the obd, it was misfiring on cylinder 1 again! Turned the car off an on and then it was running fine again! I think it would pass if it wasn't misfiring but as it also failed on headlight washers, I didn't need ask them to retry it there and then.

Has anyone else experienced this after leaving it to idle for a while? I've ordered a set of the NGK plugs from Renault as well as replacement headlight washers that should hopefully be there by tomorrow.

Any other ideas? I'm hoping to get it sorted tomorrow night, MOT'd on Saturday and on track at Silverstone on Sunday but I'm running it of wiggle room!

[Johnnytheboy]

Have you tried the little sensor that sticks into the left hand side of the engine block quite low down - air mass meter I think it's called?

Mine failed twice in three years on my Clio Trophy. First time fixed under warranty, second time by taping the wire over to the plug Seemed to be very exposed to the elements.

Caused it to idle very high and run rather thirsty.

[RickS37]

You could try getting the injectors ultrasonically cleaned out. Probably about the cost of a new injector.
What I have done in the past, is to buy a 2nd had set and get them serviced, cleaned and tested. Replace the existing ones with the cleaned ones. Notice the difference, so sit back and feel smug. Finally, get the ones that you've just just swapped out 'serviced, cleaned and tested'. Oil them up, rap them up and keep in a safe place until it all happens again. Repeat.

A lambda reading of 1.13 is well lean.

[JP__FOX]

Thanks for the suggestion. As it was around 4.5 years ago, it's all a bit vague but I think it was injector related.

I checked the MOT history and it seems it passed on the Saturday before my track day on the Sunday so all was well! I sold it about 4 years ago but good to see that it's still on the road!