1/72 Swastika decals going spare?

1/72 Swastika decals going spare?

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Discussion

Skii

Original Poster:

1,688 posts

198 months

Wednesday 22nd January 2020
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Hey all

I got an Airfix Fw190 in 1/72 as a stocking filler from my wife at Christmas, I don't suppose anyone has a pair of politically incorrect tail markings going spare from their stash ? Happy to PayPal for postage.


dr_gn

16,400 posts

191 months

Wednesday 22nd January 2020
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I’ve got some 1:72 Eduard FW190 ones if they’re any use?


Skii

Original Poster:

1,688 posts

198 months

Wednesday 22nd January 2020
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Perfect fella. I'll drop you a pm.

Eric Mc

122,853 posts

272 months

Wednesday 22nd January 2020
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You can buy dedicated sets of Swastikas in various styles and scales.

This is the Xtradecal set which is readilly available from Hannants -



https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/X72036?result-t...

I've accumulated a number of these sets over the years for my World War 2 Luftwaffe builds.

Simpo Two

87,022 posts

272 months

Wednesday 22nd January 2020
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Skii said:
I got an Airfix Fw190 in 1/72 as a stocking filler from my wife at Christmas, I don't suppose anyone has a pair of politically incorrect tail markings going spare from their stash ?
Have Airfix deleted swastikas from their German WW2 kits so as not to upset the liberals?

Eric Mc

122,853 posts

272 months

Wednesday 22nd January 2020
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Most manufacturers (with the odd exception) have not included Swastikas in their decal sheets for decades. It's not a new thing.

In some countries it's actually illegal to have Swastika images in products that might be purchased by children - and that includes scale models.

Separate decal sheets usually do not fall foul of these rules.

dr_gn

16,400 posts

191 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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Simpo Two said:
Skii said:
I got an Airfix Fw190 in 1/72 as a stocking filler from my wife at Christmas, I don't suppose anyone has a pair of politically incorrect tail markings going spare from their stash ?
Have Airfix deleted swastikas from their German WW2 kits so as not to upset the liberals?
I’m building a model of the Bismarck at the moment; the real thing had huge swastikas on the decks, which I’ve had to hand paint because the (German) manufacturer couldn’t print them. I’ve put the build on PH, on a paper modelling forum, and on FB, and some people have actually complained that they don’t like to see the symbol. I’ve now covered up the swastikas on the images I post. Utterly stupid, but there you go. I have no idea what the law is on posting pictures of models featuring swastikas on international forums that are accessible by people in countries where the swastika is banned. I’ve asked moderators but got no reply.

Eric Mc

122,853 posts

272 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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Different countries will have different laws. The general assumption I make (based on what is done in Germany) is that if a topic is being discussed as a historical topic - or the images have historical relevance - such as old photographs or modern photos of historic artifacts (and that includes newly built models of historic artifacts) , then depicting a Swastika is OK.

If the Swastika is being used in a modern political or propaganda context, it should not be shown.

The Swastika was not just a Nazi symbol. The air forces of Latvia and Finland had the Swastika as their air force insignia.

It's interesting how scale model magazines handle the issue. Generally, they won't place a Swastika on a picture of model on the front cover of the magazine, but within the magazine the same built model will feature the Swastika. The builder sometimes will comment that the Swastikas were sourced from a separate specialist decal sheet.


Simpo Two

87,022 posts

272 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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Thanks for the info, which I find quite astonishing. I don't think history should have certain parts Tipp-exed out; history is what has happened.

And so we are not allowed to see swastikas, yet every day on TV there are programmes about Nazis, and documentaries about the Holocaust are compulsory viewing...

dr_gn

16,400 posts

191 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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Simpo Two said:
Thanks for the info, which I find quite astonishing. I don't think history should have certain parts Tipp-exed out; history is what has happened.

And so we are not allowed to see swastikas, yet every day on TV there are programmes about Nazis, and documentaries about the Holocaust are compulsory viewing...
I went to the Airbus factory in Hamburg, and in reception they have a huge display case with historical aircraft, including those made by Messerschmitt (which is now owned by Airbus). All the swastikas were roughly painted over, even though they were historical representations.

If you look at box-top art for aircraft or AFV kits, over the years - particularly during the 70's and '80's, it got edited to remove things like swastikas, gunfire, bombing, or anything else that looked aggressive. What the ultimate point was I have no idea. Do a Google image search for "Matchbox Hanomag" and you can see the gradual elimination of any war-like images.

Edited by dr_gn on Thursday 23 January 11:57

generationx

7,494 posts

112 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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McLaren has done the same with the cigarette-branded cars in their collection. I find it a bit ridiculous as in my younger years I was never tempted to go and buy a packet of fags after watching the F1, so I'm unlikely to do so now.

The Swastika thing is a bit inconsistent, certainly in printed media. Airfix Magazine stated a few years ago that they would censor all model images which showed the symbol, but their photo editing team are not very good at their jobs as many seem to slip through the net.

Funnily enough I haven't been inspired to join the Third Reich either.

Eric Mc

122,853 posts

272 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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There certainly was a move to sanitise model box art in the late 1970s and 1980s. In more recent years, the art work has returned a bit to what we used to see - with lots of action, explosions etc. Although it will never return to the dramatic scenes depicted by artists like Roy Cross and Brian Knight.

My favourite Roy Cross box art -



Adam Tooby's art work for the new Airfix Wellington is pretty dramatic, in my opinion -



I think this box art for the current Revell Lancaster model is pretty thought provoking too - especially since the model was designed and manufactured in Germany -






Dr Jekyll

23,820 posts

268 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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Eric Mc said:
There certainly was a move to sanitise model box art in the late 1970s and 1980s. In more recent years, the art work has returned a bit to what we used to see - with lots of action, explosions etc. Although it will never return to the dramatic scenes depicted by artists like Roy Cross and Brian Knight.

My favourite Roy Cross box art -

I remember the endless debates on ATC nights about whether the Wellington might actually make it home it that scenario. Either by taking out the 109s or surviving till they ran out of fuel.

dr_gn

16,400 posts

191 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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Dr Jekyll said:
Eric Mc said:
There certainly was a move to sanitise model box art in the late 1970s and 1980s. In more recent years, the art work has returned a bit to what we used to see - with lots of action, explosions etc. Although it will never return to the dramatic scenes depicted by artists like Roy Cross and Brian Knight.

My favourite Roy Cross box art -

I remember the endless debates on ATC nights about whether the Wellington might actually make it home it that scenario. Either by taking out the 109s or surviving till they ran out of fuel.
I'd have thought with one engine out, if the '109's attacked from the side, the Wellington would be dead in very quick time.

Skii

Original Poster:

1,688 posts

198 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
You can buy dedicated sets of Swastikas in various styles and scales.

This is the Xtradecal set which is readilly available from Hannants -



https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/X72036?result-t...

I've accumulated a number of these sets over the years for my World War 2 Luftwaffe builds.
Thanks Eric, I'm aware you can buy them in sheets of 100 but I only need 2 from someone's spares box.

All sorted now, thanks Doc.

Eric Mc

122,853 posts

272 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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You never know. You might build another Luftwaffe subject.

Or even a pre-war civvie subject, like this -






Simpo Two

87,022 posts

272 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
quotequote all
I was a prolific builder of plastic models as a youngster, mostly aeroplanes and mostly military. But on reflection they were all British or American, not a single Jerry among 'em.

Funny thing is, if there was ever going to be a 'We must hide all references of swastikas!' you'd expect it to have been straight after the war - not 30+ years later. Sometimes I think we're heading back to Victorian days where 'legs' were so taboo they'd cover up piano legs...

Edited by Simpo Two on Thursday 23 January 19:29

Dont like rolls

3,798 posts

61 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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The company that imported Tamiya, Hasegawa etc into Germany had one guy who's job it was to open new boxes and cut the offending decal from the sheet, close and shrink the box

Eric Mc

122,853 posts

272 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
quotequote all
Simpo Two said:
I was a prolific builder of plastic models as a youngster, mostly aeroplanes and mostly military. But on reflection they were all British or American, not a single Jerry among 'em.

Funny thing is, if there was ever going to be a 'We must hide all references of swastikas!' you'd expect it to have been straight after the war - not 30+ years later. Sometimes I think we're heading back to Victorian days where 'legs' were so taboo they'd cover up piano legs...

Edited by Simpo Two on Thursday 23 January 19:29
Don’t panic. Nothing is happening of that nature. The situation hasn’t changed for the best part of 40 years.

MBBlat

1,835 posts

156 months

Thursday 23rd January 2020
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The first time I saw a box-art without the swastika was in the states in the early 80's in the US, so this is not something new.
AFAIK most of the kits in the UK are imported into the EU via Germany, and the Germans are fairly strict about displaying the symbol, and have been for decades. They also regard anything that may appeal to children as only appealing to children, so any computer games like Wolfstein had to change the graphics for Germany, this is nothing new and in fact the German state seems to be easing up on it a little, from what I recall games with an 18 rating are now allowed to show swastikas in a historical setting etc.

Not built anything German from Airfix in decades so not sure what their policy is. Got a Tamiya 109 in the stash, swastikas cut from the decals and not shown in the instructions, including fairly crudely blanking them out from a historic photo.

TLDR blame Germany, not the lefty snowflakes.