Anyone just watched Watchdog??
Discussion
The majority of them really, something to do with the throttle control, which on most models shut the car down to 'limp' mode without warning.
(V70, S80, S60 ETC ETC)
Apparently most later volvo's are affected, including the S60 which has given Mrs silverback the heebiegeebies as she quite frequently does long motorway trips.
They had a few owners on there detailing the fact that one minute they were barrelling along in lane three, next minute, the car died to 30mph without warning causing possible carnage behind them.
Volvo allegedly will not change the part or recall, or even cover them. And apparently it's about a £700 fix. However the main bugbear was that volvo north america had the parts covered for 10 years or 200,000 miles. Still, fat lot of good if you cream in on lane three going from normal motorway speeds to 30mph.
Apparently Volvo are well aware of the problem, but will not do anything about it.
Must admit, It has somewhat tarnished my view, and don't particularly fancy the mini silverbacks being in a car that may potentially cause a major incident.
Wish I hadn't watched the programme.
(V70, S80, S60 ETC ETC)
Apparently most later volvo's are affected, including the S60 which has given Mrs silverback the heebiegeebies as she quite frequently does long motorway trips.
They had a few owners on there detailing the fact that one minute they were barrelling along in lane three, next minute, the car died to 30mph without warning causing possible carnage behind them.
Volvo allegedly will not change the part or recall, or even cover them. And apparently it's about a £700 fix. However the main bugbear was that volvo north america had the parts covered for 10 years or 200,000 miles. Still, fat lot of good if you cream in on lane three going from normal motorway speeds to 30mph. Apparently Volvo are well aware of the problem, but will not do anything about it.
Must admit, It has somewhat tarnished my view, and don't particularly fancy the mini silverbacks being in a car that may potentially cause a major incident.
Wish I hadn't watched the programme.
I have a Volvo S60 bi-fuel and twice this the engine has cut out on me, luckily not in dangerous place. But, my other half borrowed the car last week and he was just going up a steep incline, which is a notorious accident black spot, when the revs cut and he had to pull over. He thought it was something to do with it being a duel-fuel, so he switched the engine to petrol and revved the engine and luckily the revs came back. (A lucky escape is what I say!)
After seeing the Watchdog programme last night he rang the Volvo helpline and after waiting 20 mins he spoke to a really nice chap who asked what problems he had and he is going to book the car it into our local dealer for a complete check.
Hopefully, this will be at no cost to ourselves? I will keep you posted as to what happens!
After seeing the Watchdog programme last night he rang the Volvo helpline and after waiting 20 mins he spoke to a really nice chap who asked what problems he had and he is going to book the car it into our local dealer for a complete check.
Hopefully, this will be at no cost to ourselves? I will keep you posted as to what happens!
volvos70t5 said:
Mike
It is even more of a shame given that I was seriously looking at an S60 as my next car.
It is a shame, and probably prior to this one of the only cars I would have seriously contemplated keeping for a long time, it really is marvellous. But......spending a lot of time on the motorway with an 8 yr and 3 yr old in it, I don't want ANY safety issues, potential or not.
Damn shame.Katie F said:
I have a Volvo S60 bi-fuel and twice this the engine has cut out on me, luckily not in dangerous place. But, my other half borrowed the car last week and he was just going up a steep incline, which is a notorious accident black spot, when the revs cut and he had to pull over. He thought it was something to do with it being a duel-fuel, so he switched the engine to petrol and revved the engine and luckily the revs came back. (A lucky escape is what I say!)
After seeing the Watchdog programme last night he rang the Volvo helpline and after waiting 20 mins he spoke to a really nice chap who asked what problems he had and he is going to book the car it into our local dealer for a complete check.
Hopefully, this will be at no cost to ourselves? I will keep you posted as to what happens!
Lets hope so Katie, if volvo had any sense of self worth they should replace them. Mine has showed no symptoms at all, and as a consequence Volvo won't touch it.
silverback mike said:As the "expert" on the programme said, if it's not displaying the symptoms how the hell would Volvo detect a defect in the component. In truth they only had two blokes on the programme and whilst it's a valid complaint it's probably less likely to occure than a bow-out. Rich...
Mine has showed no symptoms at all, and as a consequence Volvo won't touch it.
richb said:
Mine has showed no symptoms at all, and as a consequence Volvo won't touch it.
I would agree Rich, you can't detect a fault if it isn't there, so potentially yes, it is as likely to happen as a blow out, but to sow the seeds of doubt, it IS a potential problem and COULD occur when it shouldn't.
And yes, I have phoned volvo who have said without the car showing a problem there is nothing they can do - I can understand this, but with a known weakspot, in my view it should be recalled and new part fitted, sod the cost. It's a known safety compromise that MAY happen. That's good enough for me.
The 'expert's views are not his own, since the programme I have done some digging, and it's been a known problem for a while.
Can I just clear one thing up here, cars upto 2001 and some in 2002 are affected.
The only S60/V70's that are affected are the bi-fuels NONE of the others are affected.
In 8 months in a main dealer ive seen 2 cars have ETM's replaced, it is one of the least common faults on UK Volvo's, it IS ONLY an issue in the US and Sweden where the parts are different hence why Volvo isnt commiting to anything in the UK as there is hardly any problem there to deal with.
The only reason this whole non existant issue has appeared is because of the ruling in the US where Volvo has provided the extended warranty on the parts.
Unfortunately with the internet and forums it only takes 2 or 3 people right across the country to come on and say 'its happened to me' and then everyone suddenly believes its a national epidemic!
The only S60/V70's that are affected are the bi-fuels NONE of the others are affected.
In 8 months in a main dealer ive seen 2 cars have ETM's replaced, it is one of the least common faults on UK Volvo's, it IS ONLY an issue in the US and Sweden where the parts are different hence why Volvo isnt commiting to anything in the UK as there is hardly any problem there to deal with.
The only reason this whole non existant issue has appeared is because of the ruling in the US where Volvo has provided the extended warranty on the parts.
Unfortunately with the internet and forums it only takes 2 or 3 people right across the country to come on and say 'its happened to me' and then everyone suddenly believes its a national epidemic!
after_shock said:
Can I just clear one thing up here, cars upto 2001 and some in 2002 are affected.
The only S60/V70's that are affected are the bi-fuels NONE of the others are affected.
In 8 months in a main dealer ive seen 2 cars have ETM's replaced, it is one of the least common faults on UK Volvo's, it IS ONLY an issue in the US and Sweden where the parts are different hence why Volvo isnt commiting to anything in the UK as there is hardly any problem there to deal with.
The only reason this whole non existant issue has appeared is because of the ruling in the US where Volvo has provided the extended warranty on the parts.
Unfortunately with the internet and forums it only takes 2 or 3 people right across the country to come on and say 'its happened to me' and then everyone suddenly believes its a national epidemic!
More sense in a few paragraphs there than out of my dealer. Thanks after shock, much appreciated.
after_shock said:
Can I just clear one thing up here, cars upto 2001 and some in 2002 are affected.
The only S60/V70's that are affected are the bi-fuels NONE of the others are affected.
In 8 months in a main dealer ive seen 2 cars have ETM's replaced, it is one of the least common faults on UK Volvo's, it IS ONLY an issue in the US and Sweden where the parts are different hence why Volvo isnt commiting to anything in the UK as there is hardly any problem there to deal with.
The only reason this whole non existant issue has appeared is because of the ruling in the US where Volvo has provided the extended warranty on the parts.
Unfortunately with the internet and forums it only takes 2 or 3 people right across the country to come on and say 'its happened to me' and then everyone suddenly believes its a national epidemic!
I hate to say it but I sense a troll here and feel the need to question some of the statements. I apologise if your intentions were honorable.
Your second statement is to my knowledge UNTRUE. I understand that all petrol V70 models built between 1999-2001 are affected. Also S60,S80, C70 and XC70s.
In 8 months, you've seen only 2 ETMs replaced. Fair enough, I'll take you on your word but how many owners have been fobbed off with cleaning the throttle body or with 'no fault codes logged'? My ETM has not failed yet but my car is exhibiting intermittent startup/idle problems similar to those reported by US owners who subsequently suffered ETM failure. My dealer has fobbed me off twice with 'no fault codes logged' excuse.
I also understand that the same suspect part is used worldwide. Owners in Australia, UK, Japan have all reported problems. Can you PROVE that the part is different in the UK? Without this proof, no-one with one of the potentially affected cars should be complacent as Volvo North America was forced to report ETM failure rates of up to 94% before 100,000 miles (see this press report: www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0505/06/1auto-170127.htm). The NHTSA are currently investigating the issue and it is possible that it may become a safety recall issue if enough owners report potentially dangerous failure situations.
I appreciate that you may just be re-telling what Volvo UK has told you but if this is the case, you should have made this clear in your post. You also do not make clear what your position in the Volvo dealership is? Are you a Master Technician, Service Manager, Dealer Principal or what?
Please re-read my post, I said 'cars UPTO 2001 and some 2002 cars are affected' not that only 2001 and some 2002 cars have the problem.
Unfortunately Volvo dealers arent allowed to 'fob' people off as they will end up in more trouble than its worth and unfortunately if the ETM is faulty cleaning out the throttle body doesnt solve anything. If there is no fault logged on the computer what do you want the dealer to do? At the end of the day the service department is there to make money, if the part is faulty they want to replace it as its money for them, if theres nothing showing a fault they cant just start replacing parts for the sake of it as thats ripping people off.
Im not re-telling anything that Volvo has said im merely giving an observation of whats been seen in a dealership, personally I drive a car that is part of the affected years/batches, and am on my 3rd car of that generation, not one has had a problem with the ETM, however I do know of people online who have had the problem so im not denying there is one but its not anything like that seen in the US. As said the second a problem occurs everyone who has that problem or something similar comes on and says ive had that lets hate Volvo, you dont see the people who have not had the problem coming on saying ive not had it and defending them do you?
Unfortunately Volvo dealers arent allowed to 'fob' people off as they will end up in more trouble than its worth and unfortunately if the ETM is faulty cleaning out the throttle body doesnt solve anything. If there is no fault logged on the computer what do you want the dealer to do? At the end of the day the service department is there to make money, if the part is faulty they want to replace it as its money for them, if theres nothing showing a fault they cant just start replacing parts for the sake of it as thats ripping people off.
Im not re-telling anything that Volvo has said im merely giving an observation of whats been seen in a dealership, personally I drive a car that is part of the affected years/batches, and am on my 3rd car of that generation, not one has had a problem with the ETM, however I do know of people online who have had the problem so im not denying there is one but its not anything like that seen in the US. As said the second a problem occurs everyone who has that problem or something similar comes on and says ive had that lets hate Volvo, you dont see the people who have not had the problem coming on saying ive not had it and defending them do you?
I have just heard about the Watchdog programme and then read through this dialogue. I can't help but feel that there are Volvo agents adding to this string of messages!! I have a 2002 Volvo S80 (no not an S60 bifuel) and have had the engine cutting out only at 20mph just after start a couple of times but nothing to alarm me. Recently I have had warning lights coming on for which the Volvo dealer has run diagnostics and said that it is the EMT problem. They have reset the EMT and cleaned the throttle assembly. Two days later the lights comeback on. They have offered me a 20% discount to replace the EMT. I am selling the car anyway and now will avoid another Volvo (sadly) - does anyone know a cheaper alternative than Volvo replacing the EMT. Are there any alternative cheaper EMT's out there?
You may want to search for this on the owners club forum, it's quite a hot topic, several threads, if there's not an answer I'd post the question.
www.volvoclub.org.uk/forum/index.php
this thread in particular
www.volvoclub.org.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=15538
Hopefully you had the software upgrade and clean for free. I spoke to Volvo UK Customer Services (0845 756 4636) - I was told their policy on replacement is 20% of the cost of the part. Though there has been a case (noted in that thread) of getting it all paid back via court action.
www.volvoclub.org.uk/forum/index.php
this thread in particular
www.volvoclub.org.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=15538
Hopefully you had the software upgrade and clean for free. I spoke to Volvo UK Customer Services (0845 756 4636) - I was told their policy on replacement is 20% of the cost of the part. Though there has been a case (noted in that thread) of getting it all paid back via court action.
jesus, i never knew about this problem i am always on the outside lane too! if i dropped down to 30mph i would defnitely be in a crash!
what do i do? just wait till it happens?
yesterday the car when i started it , the entire car was shaking and couldnt move, ..i thought 'jesus, this looks bad' switched the car off..turned it back on and it seem ok now
what do i do? just wait till it happens?
yesterday the car when i started it , the entire car was shaking and couldnt move, ..i thought 'jesus, this looks bad' switched the car off..turned it back on and it seem ok now
First check if yours is on the list :
C70 1999-2002
S70 1999-2000
S60 2001 all engine variants, 2002 non-turbo only
V70 1999-2001 all engine variants, 2002 non-turbo only
V70XC 1999-2000
XC70 2001
S80 1999-2001
Careful with the years - these are engine manufacture years not vehicle registration years. If unsure either the Volvo cust services guys (phone number above) or your Volvo garage can tell you.
Call up local Volvo garage (not an indie garage) - they should be aware of the problem and must clean ETM and install new software FOC whether your car is showing symptoms or not. If they quibble call up Volvo cust services and they will get you a job number and probably harass the garage. My local was fine (though tried to add some extra work...cheeky!!)
I wasn't going to get mine done (since it seemed to give better performance than it should) but then it died on me so I didn't have an option.
Now the turbo kicks in earlier, loadsawheelspin! Fuel consumption seems to have got worse but that might just be my driving.
From what I understand, if you have a RICA upgrade the Volvo software will overwrite it, but RICA will re-install FOC (call them first and check it out).
Symptoms on mine were that it seemed to misfire at any speed on a short run from Camberley to Uxbridge. On the way back I decided on the backroads for safety and it spluttered quite a bit, before dying at the petrol station opposite Maranello in Egham. Left it 5 minutes and it came back to life. Got just short of Camberley and it died again, once more a 5 minute wait and it restarted. The second time there was no limp mode - it simply died - would have been a disaster on the M25 / M3 outside lane because there was probably only a 50:50 chance I'd have got to the hard shoulder.
If you read through that thread above, it says there would be a recall and a new ETM fitted FOC if it was deemed dangerous, but so far no fatalities, so the free upgrade is as good as it gets.
C70 1999-2002
S70 1999-2000
S60 2001 all engine variants, 2002 non-turbo only
V70 1999-2001 all engine variants, 2002 non-turbo only
V70XC 1999-2000
XC70 2001
S80 1999-2001
Careful with the years - these are engine manufacture years not vehicle registration years. If unsure either the Volvo cust services guys (phone number above) or your Volvo garage can tell you.
Call up local Volvo garage (not an indie garage) - they should be aware of the problem and must clean ETM and install new software FOC whether your car is showing symptoms or not. If they quibble call up Volvo cust services and they will get you a job number and probably harass the garage. My local was fine (though tried to add some extra work...cheeky!!)
I wasn't going to get mine done (since it seemed to give better performance than it should) but then it died on me so I didn't have an option.
Now the turbo kicks in earlier, loadsawheelspin! Fuel consumption seems to have got worse but that might just be my driving.
From what I understand, if you have a RICA upgrade the Volvo software will overwrite it, but RICA will re-install FOC (call them first and check it out).
Symptoms on mine were that it seemed to misfire at any speed on a short run from Camberley to Uxbridge. On the way back I decided on the backroads for safety and it spluttered quite a bit, before dying at the petrol station opposite Maranello in Egham. Left it 5 minutes and it came back to life. Got just short of Camberley and it died again, once more a 5 minute wait and it restarted. The second time there was no limp mode - it simply died - would have been a disaster on the M25 / M3 outside lane because there was probably only a 50:50 chance I'd have got to the hard shoulder.
If you read through that thread above, it says there would be a recall and a new ETM fitted FOC if it was deemed dangerous, but so far no fatalities, so the free upgrade is as good as it gets.
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