Which fast Volvo?
Discussion
On my search for a new car (while looking among the standard 3 series...) I stumbled across the fact that I can buy and insure a very fast Volvo for not much money.
I don't know all that much about them, only that the 850 T5 is a rapid machine and that the T5 engine seems very reliable.
My shortlist would be a C70 T5, an 850 T5, an S60 T5, an S70 T5 , a V70 T5 or maybe an S40 T4.
My budget is around £2k, but the less money spent the better. Also it must be a manual! I am looking for comfort and performance, but I would think that all the cars above would give this as Volvo seem to have the best seats in the business.
I would really appreciate any help with this, thanks
I don't know all that much about them, only that the 850 T5 is a rapid machine and that the T5 engine seems very reliable.
My shortlist would be a C70 T5, an 850 T5, an S60 T5, an S70 T5 , a V70 T5 or maybe an S40 T4.
My budget is around £2k, but the less money spent the better. Also it must be a manual! I am looking for comfort and performance, but I would think that all the cars above would give this as Volvo seem to have the best seats in the business.
I would really appreciate any help with this, thanks
Edited by SD1992 on Sunday 8th May 10:34
You are, in my opinion, best advised to look into the later P2 cars, the S60 T5 and V70 T5.
I am not sure that many of these will come in under the £2000 mark, but they do represent a considerable improvement in all areas over the 850's and S/V70s that were basically facelifted 850s.
There have been many improvements in the line of T5s over the years, the 2.3l versions found in the post '98 cars have stronger rods than earlier versions, bigger turbos, different 2nd gear cluster, heads etc., gaining in durability and outputs with these improvements.
If, and its a big IF, you can stretch your budget then take a good hard look at the post MY '05 T5s, 2.4 litre engines with all the ancilleries of the concurremt 2.5l 'R' engines....their narrower bore giving none of the frailties of that R engine. You can incidently get 330bhp with just a basic software upgrade with those later T5 engines.
Regards, Don.
I am not sure that many of these will come in under the £2000 mark, but they do represent a considerable improvement in all areas over the 850's and S/V70s that were basically facelifted 850s.
There have been many improvements in the line of T5s over the years, the 2.3l versions found in the post '98 cars have stronger rods than earlier versions, bigger turbos, different 2nd gear cluster, heads etc., gaining in durability and outputs with these improvements.
If, and its a big IF, you can stretch your budget then take a good hard look at the post MY '05 T5s, 2.4 litre engines with all the ancilleries of the concurremt 2.5l 'R' engines....their narrower bore giving none of the frailties of that R engine. You can incidently get 330bhp with just a basic software upgrade with those later T5 engines.
Regards, Don.
Go for V70 if you need the room (V70 was an evolution of the 850 in real terms) but the S60's are marginally cheaper.
Google: T5, Volvo, Forum and the best 3 sites will pop up. These are full of experienced and helpful advice when selecting a T5.
To give you an insight - I have owned all variants of V70 inc Phase 3 (>2008) V70s but the magic of Phase 1 (approx 1997 thro 2000) T5's persists to the extent that the Phase 3 T6 car disappointed.
Make sure that you undertake the "mayo test" and ABS test but also check that all the suspension is in good fettle. Go to the forums with T5 in their names - good bunch and very well informed, who share.
Just saw Don's note - P2 V70's will be at least twice your budget but his comments over 2.4 are accurate.
Google: T5, Volvo, Forum and the best 3 sites will pop up. These are full of experienced and helpful advice when selecting a T5.
To give you an insight - I have owned all variants of V70 inc Phase 3 (>2008) V70s but the magic of Phase 1 (approx 1997 thro 2000) T5's persists to the extent that the Phase 3 T6 car disappointed.
Make sure that you undertake the "mayo test" and ABS test but also check that all the suspension is in good fettle. Go to the forums with T5 in their names - good bunch and very well informed, who share.
Just saw Don's note - P2 V70's will be at least twice your budget but his comments over 2.4 are accurate.
Edited by T5R+ on Sunday 8th May 18:55
after having both an S40 T4 and V70 T5 i would go for the T4, they are cheaper,lighter and more agile,but at the same time very comfortable. mine is being turned into a track toy so if you do buy one without leather interior i have a full interior with heated seats.
Mines pushing about 235bhp, but one bit of advice, if you do get a volvo and want to put more power through her,invest in a quaife diff,mine spins up like crazy as it is
Mines pushing about 235bhp, but one bit of advice, if you do get a volvo and want to put more power through her,invest in a quaife diff,mine spins up like crazy as it is
I am now very tempted! They look very comfortable, and I would love a car with a nice leather interior.
Performance wise, is there much in it between a T4 and a T5? I would imagine there isn't as the S40 weighs less and there is not that big a difference in power.
Also, does the T4 engine share the same excellent reliability as the T5?
Performance wise, is there much in it between a T4 and a T5? I would imagine there isn't as the S40 weighs less and there is not that big a difference in power.
Also, does the T4 engine share the same excellent reliability as the T5?
don kalmar union said:
You are, in my opinion, best advised to look into the later P2 cars, the S60 T5 and V70 T5.
I am not sure that many of these will come in under the £2000 mark, but they do represent a considerable improvement in all areas over the 850's and S/V70s that were basically facelifted 850s.
There have been many improvements in the line of T5s over the years, the 2.3l versions found in the post '98 cars have stronger rods than earlier versions, bigger turbos, different 2nd gear cluster, heads etc., gaining in durability and outputs with these improvements.
If, and its a big IF, you can stretch your budget then take a good hard look at the post MY '05 T5s, 2.4 litre engines with all the ancilleries of the concurremt 2.5l 'R' engines....their narrower bore giving none of the frailties of that R engine. You can incidently get 330bhp with just a basic software upgrade with those later T5 engines.
Regards, Don.
I disagree that the s60 is a far better car than an 850. The 850 was volvo's swan song and represents the best compromise between clever engineering and simplicity. Yes there may have been improvements to the t5 engine over the years but the early ones are far from unreliable. My main gripe with The s60 stem from the fact that Many of the electronic control systems on the car (the lights for a kick off) are overly complex and expensive to repair. Even comparing the early "classic" v70 (which incidentally I now own) to an 850 you can see the complex and ultimately poorer quality components creeping in. S60s are not bad cars - far from it and they are still well made, but for me the 850 is the best car Volvo has ever made. After the abomination that was the 400series in the 80's the 850 (the t5 especially) got Volvo back on track and moved them into the premium sector of the Market. I am not sure that many of these will come in under the £2000 mark, but they do represent a considerable improvement in all areas over the 850's and S/V70s that were basically facelifted 850s.
There have been many improvements in the line of T5s over the years, the 2.3l versions found in the post '98 cars have stronger rods than earlier versions, bigger turbos, different 2nd gear cluster, heads etc., gaining in durability and outputs with these improvements.
If, and its a big IF, you can stretch your budget then take a good hard look at the post MY '05 T5s, 2.4 litre engines with all the ancilleries of the concurremt 2.5l 'R' engines....their narrower bore giving none of the frailties of that R engine. You can incidently get 330bhp with just a basic software upgrade with those later T5 engines.
Regards, Don.
morgrp said:
don kalmar union said:
You are, in my opinion, best advised to look into the later P2 cars, the S60 T5 and V70 T5.
I am not sure that many of these will come in under the £2000 mark, but they do represent a considerable improvement in all areas over the 850's and S/V70s that were basically facelifted 850s.
There have been many improvements in the line of T5s over the years, the 2.3l versions found in the post '98 cars have stronger rods than earlier versions, bigger turbos, different 2nd gear cluster, heads etc., gaining in durability and outputs with these improvements.
If, and its a big IF, you can stretch your budget then take a good hard look at the post MY '05 T5s, 2.4 litre engines with all the ancilleries of the concurremt 2.5l 'R' engines....their narrower bore giving none of the frailties of that R engine. You can incidently get 330bhp with just a basic software upgrade with those later T5 engines.
Regards, Don.
I disagree that the s60 is a far better car than an 850. The 850 was volvo's swan song and represents the best compromise between clever engineering and simplicity. Yes there may have been improvements to the t5 engine over the years but the early ones are far from unreliable. My main gripe with The s60 stem from the fact that Many of the electronic control systems on the car (the lights for a kick off) are overly complex and expensive to repair. Even comparing the early "classic" v70 (which incidentally I now own) to an 850 you can see the complex and ultimately poorer quality components creeping in. S60s are not bad cars - far from it and they are still well made, but for me the 850 is the best car Volvo has ever made. After the abomination that was the 400series in the 80's the 850 (the t5 especially) got Volvo back on track and moved them into the premium sector of the Market. I am not sure that many of these will come in under the £2000 mark, but they do represent a considerable improvement in all areas over the 850's and S/V70s that were basically facelifted 850s.
There have been many improvements in the line of T5s over the years, the 2.3l versions found in the post '98 cars have stronger rods than earlier versions, bigger turbos, different 2nd gear cluster, heads etc., gaining in durability and outputs with these improvements.
If, and its a big IF, you can stretch your budget then take a good hard look at the post MY '05 T5s, 2.4 litre engines with all the ancilleries of the concurremt 2.5l 'R' engines....their narrower bore giving none of the frailties of that R engine. You can incidently get 330bhp with just a basic software upgrade with those later T5 engines.
Regards, Don.
don't gt me wrong, I loved my 850 T5
I am leaning more towards the 850 T5 and the S40 T4 at the moment - purely because they are going to be the cheapest to buy and insure. I really would like some more "disposable" cash in my back pocket for my second year of uni!
Any advice on which of these two would be the most reliable / fun / comfortable / tuneable?
And how much difference is there between the standard 850 T5 and the T5-R? I have read that a remap of the standard one can take it to almost 300 bhp...
Any advice on which of these two would be the most reliable / fun / comfortable / tuneable?
And how much difference is there between the standard 850 T5 and the T5-R? I have read that a remap of the standard one can take it to almost 300 bhp...
a remap will NOT give you 300bhp even if it was widely believed to do so a few years ago.
either the 850 T5 or the S40 T4 will give you a good buzz with quite a bit of potential to get a lot more out of it.
somebody above mentioned the 850R had a stronger engine, not true.
the T-5R has the exact same engine but allows for a 30 sec overboost, at least i think its 30 seconds, this gives it the 240bhp as opposed to the 225bhp of the standard T5.
if i was getting one again i'd be looking for a manual 850R. same engine, viscous diff, slightly bigger turbo and injectors which give it 250bhp. has to be manual though as the auto 850R doesnt have the above.
i've owned a modified T5, driven both T4s and T5s, standard and modified, been a passenger on both road and track, choosing between them is a tough one. I'd say if you dont need the room maybe the T4 makes more sense but ultimately i think it comes down to what you fancy.
either the 850 T5 or the S40 T4 will give you a good buzz with quite a bit of potential to get a lot more out of it.
somebody above mentioned the 850R had a stronger engine, not true.
the T-5R has the exact same engine but allows for a 30 sec overboost, at least i think its 30 seconds, this gives it the 240bhp as opposed to the 225bhp of the standard T5.
if i was getting one again i'd be looking for a manual 850R. same engine, viscous diff, slightly bigger turbo and injectors which give it 250bhp. has to be manual though as the auto 850R doesnt have the above.
i've owned a modified T5, driven both T4s and T5s, standard and modified, been a passenger on both road and track, choosing between them is a tough one. I'd say if you dont need the room maybe the T4 makes more sense but ultimately i think it comes down to what you fancy.
Edited by irf on Tuesday 10th May 20:48
y2blade said:
I agree with Don tbh Rob...I don't think I'd go back to a 850 now I've owned a S60
don't gt me wrong, I loved my 850 T5
It's a fair point and to be honest I prefer my v70 to my 850 I changed it from as it is a far smoother machine but I have to say it's not as sharp or raw to drive. Really my point is that I'm looking at from an engineering point of view as aposed to driving experience. I think the 850 has some engineering design touches that are a work of pure geniusdon't gt me wrong, I loved my 850 T5
Out of interest, what sort of power outputs would a remap (and / or chip) give for both engines?
Also, what is the difference between the 1.9 T4 and the 2.0 T4 in the S40s?
I would love a V70 or S60 T5, but they are quite expensive to insure (in comparison with the S40 and 850) and I am not keen on more moden cars with lots of expensive things to go wrong.
Also, am I right in thinking that the S70 is basically an 850?
Also, what is the difference between the 1.9 T4 and the 2.0 T4 in the S40s?
I would love a V70 or S60 T5, but they are quite expensive to insure (in comparison with the S40 and 850) and I am not keen on more moden cars with lots of expensive things to go wrong.
Also, am I right in thinking that the S70 is basically an 850?
SD1992 said:
Also, am I right in thinking that the S70 is basically an 850?
The S/V70 is a facelifted 850, yes. Some styling changes, interior changes, different engine management, other updates too.The S denotes 'saloon', V denotes 'versatile' (read:estate/wagon).
(more info here: http://www.volvoclub.org.uk/information-70.shtml )
I have no experience of the 850, or the later 'phase 2' cars (S60/V70) but I do own a 1997 V70T5 auto and a 1998 S70R manual. Great cars, solid, quite easy to work on, surprisingly quick but not too nimble, a bit thirsty though.
As already stated, remap alone probably puts you in the 270 hp region.
the early T4's ahd the 1.9T engine from 97-2000.after that they used the 2.0T. on the volvo forum they say that the 1.9T engine is a better engine and is stronger.
As for tuning on the T4 here is a link to a bloke who has done a build, he put a T5 turbo and downpipe on his T4 with uporated injectors and remap, somthing like 330BHP and stupid amounts of torque.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
My step mum actually test drove for volvo in sweden when they were developing the 850 T5-R, she had one of two prototypes pushing over 300bhp.She told me that the german and scandanavian T5-R's had more power than other markets.
As for tuning on the T4 here is a link to a bloke who has done a build, he put a T5 turbo and downpipe on his T4 with uporated injectors and remap, somthing like 330BHP and stupid amounts of torque.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
My step mum actually test drove for volvo in sweden when they were developing the 850 T5-R, she had one of two prototypes pushing over 300bhp.She told me that the german and scandanavian T5-R's had more power than other markets.
Keep in mind, the t4 is nothing like the other volvo's, the engine is from renault, same for the gearbox and most of the chassis, that's why nothing from the engine or body is a straight swap, from the other cars.
Traction is awful.
Not saying they are a bad car, far from it, but having driven both, i have a C70 parked outside.
Go for the v70, or S70.
Traction is awful.
Not saying they are a bad car, far from it, but having driven both, i have a C70 parked outside.
Go for the v70, or S70.
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