Traffic Cops BBC1 on now

[Scooby72]

Is anybody watching this ?

One of the officers had a 'POLAC' whilst on a call, which he was admitting no liability at all.

Now I'm not here to bash the Police, as my father was once an Class 1 Police driving instructor.

But as far as I'm concerned the officer concerned was at least 25% to blame for allowing this accident to happen.

There is no doubt the root cause of the accident was the other driver moving across into his path, the guy was stupid, careless, and also uninsured.

But surely this is what advanced driving is all about ANTICIPATION, people do stupid things, are unobservant, and often seem oblivious to what's going on around them, so the job of the Class 1 driver is to allow for this, and bear in mind you are coming up behind people at well over the speed limit. Personally I think this guy was relying too much on the 'Two & Blues'

Anybody got any idea how many weeks long the Class 1 course is these days, and should it be longer ?

I know in years gone by the Mets advanced course was something like 12 weeks.

[Shaw Tarse]

I watched that, might be due to a different view on TV, but I was braking before he did!

[anonymous-user]

Think his local knowledge got the better of him there, all of the junctions on that bit of road are 'No Right Turn' for some distance, so he was right that with no traffic around there was no "need" for the Clio to change lanes. While its easy to pick people apart on tv, he did seem to react rather slowly.

Reminded me of that episode a few years ago where a very similar thing happened to another traffic officer, except it was on a motorway and the other driver was a lorry

[vonhosen]

Scooby72 said:

Is anybody watching this ?

One of the officers had a 'POLAC' whilst on a call, which he was admitting no liability at all.

Now I'm not here to bash the Police, as my father was once an Class 1 Police driving instructor.

But as far as I'm concerned the officer concerned was at least 25% to blame for allowing this accident to happen.

There is no doubt the root cause of the accident was the other driver moving across into his path, the guy was stupid, careless, and also uninsured.

But surely this is what advanced driving is all about ANTICIPATION, people do stupid things, are unobservant, and often seem oblivious to what's going on around them, so the job of the Class 1 driver is to allow for this, and bear in mind you are coming up behind people at well over the speed limit. Personally I think this guy was relying too much on the 'Two & Blues'

Anybody got any idea how many weeks long the Class 1 course is these days, and should it be longer ?

I know in years gone by the Mets advanced course was something like 12 weeks.

I've never known it to be twelve weeks.

They may have done several courses prior to their advanced course, but advanced courses are four weeks (used to be six weeks)

[Scooby72]

Shaw Tarse said:

I watched that, might be due to a different view on TV, but I was braking before he did!

Yeh so was I.

[Scooby72]

[/quote]

I've never known it to be twelve weeks.

They may have done several courses prior to their advanced course, but advanced courses are four weeks (used to be six weeks)
[/quote]

Yes maybe this was a total of 12 weeks including the standard course.

But then I am talking about as far back as the 70's, I think it has been gradually whittled down over many many years.

[GTIR]

I've noticed on a few episodes that this cop seems to get quite intense when he's on a shout and he has to force himself to breath calmly and control his "red mist" or whatever it's called.

I'm sure he's going over the incident over and over.

(hello Advanced forum)

[S. Gonzales Esq.]

(hello GTIR)

The Police car was visible in the Clio's mirrors for a good three or four seconds before the collision, so there was absolutely no excuse for the way the young guy moved across into lane two. Considering his window was down, he would have heard the siren too - even if his Mum had a monster stereo.

I can understand why the Police driver didn't slow down to pass. At those kinds of speeds his vision would have been as far up the road as possible, identifying the hazards as they appear and deciding how much of a threat they pose.

Given that the Clio was stable in lane one, there was no obstruction that would cause it to pull out and no available right turns, I wouldn't be surprised if it'd been classified as a low risk.

There's about a second between the indicator coming on and the Clio being across the line, and as far as I can tell the Police driver gets firmly on the brakes in that time. I don't see how he could have avoided it, given his need to get to an incident quickly.

Edited by S. Gonzales Esq. on Tuesday 12th October 23:29

[heebeegeetee]

Scooby72 said:

Is anybody watching this ?

One of the officers had a 'POLAC' whilst on a call, which he was admitting no liability at all.

Now I'm not here to bash the Police, as my father was once an Class 1 Police driving instructor.

But as far as I'm concerned the officer concerned was at least 25% to blame for allowing this accident to happen.

There is no doubt the root cause of the accident was the other driver moving across into his path, the guy was stupid, careless, and also uninsured.

But surely this is what advanced driving is all about ANTICIPATION, people do stupid things, are unobservant, and often seem oblivious to what's going on around them, so the job of the Class 1 driver is to allow for this, and bear in mind you are coming up behind people at well over the speed limit. Personally I think this guy was relying too much on the 'Two & Blues'

Anybody got any idea how many weeks long the Class 1 course is these days, and should it be longer ?

I know in years gone by the Mets advanced course was something like 12 weeks.

I think for any accident there'll always be someone who would wqant to blame the police driver.

No one is perfect. The human being who doesn't make mistakes is yet to be born. No point in worrying about it.

[ScoobyChris]

S. Gonzales Esq. said:

I don't see how he could have avoided it, given his need to get to an incident quickly.

Although ultimately he just needs to get to the incident

Chris

[compocon]

The cop dealing with the Irish guy and his blown tyre needs a kick in the arse and anger management.

Clearly became a cop after being teased in school. Yes he was technically wrong to be driving, but made the cop look like an angry little man. And then the fat one made some ludicrous statements about tyre pressures.

I also liked the cop who hurt his knee and the cameraman just stands there filming him
His partner didnt seem too bothered either so he's obviously a bit of a girl as it soon stopped hurting!

[kwk]

To compocon, can I just say how absolutely spot on your observations are? I will say no more.

[JohnP68]

It's very hard to tell for certain on the telly but it appeared to me that the cop involved in the POLAC didn't ease off or brake when the guy's indicator came on. Either he didn't notice it or he chose to ignore it and took the risk of proceeding as planned and came unstuck when the guy continued to pull out. No doubt the other driver was to blame, but in my view the cop came across as a bit arrogant when he said all that stuff about his driver training etc. I hope this was only for effect on the telly and that he did actually learn from the incident. I've only done a day's Ride Drive training, but even I know that although it's important to look far ahead when making progress it's also important to look out for what's going on at short range and not just stare into the distance.

[Scooby72]

JohnP68 said:

It's very hard to tell for certain on the telly but it appeared to me that the cop involved in the POLAC didn't ease off or brake when the guy's indicator came on. Either he didn't notice it or he chose to ignore it and took the risk of proceeding as planned and came unstuck when the guy continued to pull out. No doubt the other driver was to blame, but in my view the cop came across as a bit arrogant when he said all that stuff about his driver training etc. I hope this was only for effect on the telly and that he did actually learn from the incident. I've only done a day's Ride Drive training, but even I know that although it's important to look far ahead when making progress it's also important to look out for what's going on at short range and not just stare into the distance.

Agreed it was definitely the other guys fault, and I understand that everybody has an off day or makes an error of judgement occasionally, we are only human.

But would have like to have heard the copper say "Well maybe I should have backed off a bit until I was past him"

Instead of "How dare he blame me I'm a grade 1 driver" as if he was some kind of 'driving god' whose skill & judgement should not be questioned EVER !!

[ipsg.glf]

I understand that response drivers need to wait for some sign that their presence has been noted by a vehicle they are trying to get passed, i.e. left hand signal, brake lights, change in road position. It doesn't look like any of those things occured.

[davepoth]

ipsg.glf said:

I understand that response drivers need to wait for some sign that their presence has been noted by a vehicle they are trying to get passed, i.e. left hand signal, brake lights, change in road position. It doesn't look like any of those things occured.

Would be the case if it was a single lane. If the lane ahead was clear he would have been (quite reasonably) expecting any competent road user to use their mirror before signalling and spot the fast moving car with all the flashing blue lights and sirens.

[ipsg.glf]

davepoth said:

ipsg.glf said:

I understand that response drivers need to wait for some sign that their presence has been noted by a vehicle they are trying to get passed, i.e. left hand signal, brake lights, change in road position. It doesn't look like any of those things occured.

Would be the case if it was a single lane. If the lane ahead was clear he would have been (quite reasonably) expecting any competent road user to use their mirror before signalling and spot the fast moving car with all the flashing blue lights and sirens.

The Clio driver made an error by moving over without looking and the Police driver failed to anticipate this. Maybe his speed differential was excessive. Clearly he couldn't stop in the distance he could see to be clear OR reasonably expect to remain clear.

[vonhosen]

ipsg.glf said:

davepoth said:

ipsg.glf said:

I understand that response drivers need to wait for some sign that their presence has been noted by a vehicle they are trying to get passed, i.e. left hand signal, brake lights, change in road position. It doesn't look like any of those things occured.

Would be the case if it was a single lane. If the lane ahead was clear he would have been (quite reasonably) expecting any competent road user to use their mirror before signalling and spot the fast moving car with all the flashing blue lights and sirens.

The Clio driver made an error by moving over without looking and the Police driver failed to anticipate this. Maybe his speed differential was excessive. Clearly he couldn't stop in the distance he could see to be clear OR reasonably expect to remain clear.

I disagree. There was nothing in the video that would have made it reasonable to anticipate that move from the Clio. If there was something emerging from a junction/entrance on the left ahead of them, then anticipating that move may have been reasonable. If there was a roundabout coming up, anticipating a move to the offside lane may have been reasonable. But in this case there wasn't anything to lead you to believe that the vehicle would move to lane 2 until the indicator came on (& that was too late for the driver to do anything about it).

[heebeegeetee]

vonhosen said:

ipsg.glf said:

davepoth said:

ipsg.glf said:

I understand that response drivers need to wait for some sign that their presence has been noted by a vehicle they are trying to get passed, i.e. left hand signal, brake lights, change in road position. It doesn't look like any of those things occured.

Would be the case if it was a single lane. If the lane ahead was clear he would have been (quite reasonably) expecting any competent road user to use their mirror before signalling and spot the fast moving car with all the flashing blue lights and sirens.

The Clio driver made an error by moving over without looking and the Police driver failed to anticipate this. Maybe his speed differential was excessive. Clearly he couldn't stop in the distance he could see to be clear OR reasonably expect to remain clear.

I disagree. There was nothing in the video that would have made it reasonable to anticipate that move from the Clio. If there was something emerging from a junction/entrance on the left ahead of them, then anticipating that move may have been reasonable. If there was a roundabout coming up, anticipating a move to the offside lane may have been reasonable. But in this case there wasn't anything to lead you to believe that the vehicle would move to lane 2 until the indicator came on (& that was too late for the driver to do anything about it).

I agree. Ipsg, are you saying that it is the task of all police drivers to predict the future, and must never be wrong?

I'd suggest they'd all be lottery winners by now if so.

[vonhosen]

heebeegeetee said:

vonhosen said:

ipsg.glf said:

davepoth said:

ipsg.glf said:

I understand that response drivers need to wait for some sign that their presence has been noted by a vehicle they are trying to get passed, i.e. left hand signal, brake lights, change in road position. It doesn't look like any of those things occured.

Would be the case if it was a single lane. If the lane ahead was clear he would have been (quite reasonably) expecting any competent road user to use their mirror before signalling and spot the fast moving car with all the flashing blue lights and sirens.

The Clio driver made an error by moving over without looking and the Police driver failed to anticipate this. Maybe his speed differential was excessive. Clearly he couldn't stop in the distance he could see to be clear OR reasonably expect to remain clear.

I disagree. There was nothing in the video that would have made it reasonable to anticipate that move from the Clio. If there was something emerging from a junction/entrance on the left ahead of them, then anticipating that move may have been reasonable. If there was a roundabout coming up, anticipating a move to the offside lane may have been reasonable. But in this case there wasn't anything to lead you to believe that the vehicle would move to lane 2 until the indicator came on (& that was too late for the driver to do anything about it).

I agree. Ipsg, are you saying that it is the task of all police drivers to predict the future, and must never be wrong?

I'd suggest they'd all be lottery winners by now if so.

Forget Police drivers, if nobody can pass another until there is absolutely no chance they can change lanes into your path then overtaking really is finished. We may as well go back to trams.