Emergency stops, and all that jazz

[JDMFanYo]

Saturday morning I was returning from town on the A38, heading up a hill which was national speed limit. Picture below:



As you can see, in the middle of the road is a turning lane, where there was a silver 406 estate positioned (facing me) waiting to cross my path.

There is no traffic in front of me and I can see the car waiting to turn, as I'm approaching it's apparent there now won't be enough time for it to cross my path so I'm no longer seeing it as a 'hazard'.

Cue the dumbfk pulling out when I'm practically the same distance as in the photo above, I slam on the brakes and will 100% hit them if I don't do something, wrongly enough my natural reaction was to then swerve... Had I swerved left, I would have taken out around 10 cyclists waiting to join the A38. Had I hit the 406, that car would have probably hit the cyclists... For whatever reason I swerved right onto oncoming traffic, which is NSL down the hill.

Someone must have been watching over me..

At this exact point, everything fell into place. Driving position was correct, both hands on the wheel, I wasn't playing with the radio etc.

Brake pedal went to the floor, thought I was going to hit so steered (skidded) right (into oncoming traffic), missed the car waiting behind the 406 to turn, oversteer, back end shot out now facing the N/S kerb and miss an oncoming Mini by a matter of inches and manage to pull into the bus lane.

My instinct took over and I got out of my car and ran back to the junction because I actually wanted to do some damage to the 406 driver. Luckily (for me) they had already driven off as there was a large number of cyclists who would have been witnesses to assault.

I sat by the side of the road for 15 minutes contemplating what had just happened.. I wanted the mini driver to come back to apologise to them, they (as was I) were following the highway code and could have both been killed due to one fking idiot.

Sadly no-one got the numberplate, I guess there is nothing I can do to inform the police without this information?

Edited by JDMFanYo on Monday 7th June 11:15

I'm not really sure why I posted this. I suppose it goes to show that the correct driving position can indeed make all the difference. Had I had one hand on the wheel and one out the window or something (it was a nice morning), I'd have had no chance and wouldn't be here to warn others.

Edited by JDMFanYo on Monday 7th June 11:19

[Z.B]

JDMFanYo said:

There is no traffic in front of me and I can see the car waiting to turn, as I'm approaching it's apparent there now won't be enough time for it to cross my path so I'm no longer seeing it as a 'hazard'.

Cue the dumbfk pulling out when I'm practically the same distance as in the photo above,

Without wanting to sound pious, you can't do much about other people's driving but you can control your own.

Clearly the offending vehicle was still a hazard, so perhaps you shouldn't have discounted it. Indeed, it's those few seconds after you think 'they can't possibly go now' that are the most dangerous.

How fast were you going? It may be NSL but this is the kind of situation where losing some speed for just a few seconds can greatly reduce the risks without much compromising progress.


What was traffic like at the time? The longer people wait the more likely they are to take a chance, hence extra caution on your part.

What was the gap between you and the car ahead of you? If you're close behind it's unlikely this will happen, and if you are far enough back it is won't be a problem when it does. However, there is a 'tempting gap' scenario, especially at high speeds, where you are encouraging the driver to make boarderline decisions, and this is best avoided or approached with extra care.

[JDMFanYo]

Z.B said:

JDMFanYo said:

There is no traffic in front of me and I can see the car waiting to turn, as I'm approaching it's apparent there now won't be enough time for it to cross my path so I'm no longer seeing it as a 'hazard'.

Cue the dumbfk pulling out when I'm practically the same distance as in the photo above,

Without wanting to sound pious, you can't do much about other people's driving but you can control your own.

Clearly the offending vehicle was still a hazard, so perhaps you shouldn't have discounted it. Indeed, it's those few seconds after you think 'they can't possibly go now' that are the most dangerous.

Indeed, I had never assumed someone can be blind to the point of not seeing a car which was heading directly towards them, it's not like they were waiting to pull out of a junction and having to look left/right. I just never knew someone could be that stupid!

How fast were you going? It may be NSL but this is the kind of situation where losing some speed for just a few seconds can greatly reduce the risks without much compromising progress.

Between 50-60mph up hill

What was traffic like at the time? The longer people wait the more likely they are to take a chance, hence extra caution on your part.

There was no traffic in front of me, though oncoming traffic was a little more (heading into Bristol)

What was the gap between you and the car ahead of you? If you're close behind it's unlikely this will happen, and if you are far enough back it is won't be a problem when it does. However, there is a 'tempting gap' scenario, especially at high speeds, where you are encouraging the driver to make boarderline decisions, and this is best avoided or approached with extra care.

The gap was large enough for me to say there was no car in front of me. I had come from the front of a set of traffic lights around 400metres before hand.

Thanks

Thinking of all the "what if's", I was extremely lucky, I know that.

I also 'know' that you shouldn't swerve, unless safe to do so, I suppose I'm wondering how I can train my 'instinct' to follow the correct procedure.

In this instance, had I braked and not swerved (thus hitting the car), there's a very good possibility it would have gone into the group of cyclists.

It's really shaken me up and changed my perception on driving.

Edited by JDMFanYo on Monday 7th June 12:02

[defblade]

Look on the bright side. You could have had the dozey bint in a Golf I met one day in a similar situation. She was stopped, indicating and had seen me, but somehow didn't have the patience to wait until my car had actually gone past before turning.

[MC Bodge]

dibbers006 said:

But these days people tend to give the one glance to ascertain your distance from them but don't bother with the cross reference double check for speed.

People now feel very safe in their cars. Driving is virtually a passive activity for the majority.

Why else would people consistently fail to indicate, pull-out in front of cars/lorries/motorbikes or run red lights?

Edited by MC Bodge on Monday 7th June 14:31

[gdaybruce]

JDMFanYo said:

I also 'know' that you shouldn't swerve, unless safe to do so, I suppose I'm wondering how I can train my 'instinct' to follow the correct procedure.

Actually, in cars fitted with electronic stability systems and ABS, simultaneously braking and swerving is something you can do and indeed something you should do if that's your best course to avoid an accident. I've been able to experiment with these things on a closed track and the best technique to avoid an object in your path is to absolutely stand on the brakes and not just to steer but to yank the wheel around pretty much as hard as possible. The management committee that resides in the car's brain then gets the message that this is for real and sorts everything out!

Trouble is, for those of us brought up to cadence brake or to modulate the pedal to avoid the wheels locking and absoultely never to swerve and brake at the same time, it's really counter intuitive to break the habits of a lifetime - especially at speed.

[onboard]

Hi,

A good idea to grab a copy of the book Mind Driving if you don't already have one and make the most of the time you are now reflecting on your driving.

Cheers,
Brian

[WhoseGeneration]

Treat this as a lesson, which is, never be ashamed of slowing for hazards.
You had a staggered cross roads, with previously, a sign indicating this, you saw approaching traffic and cyclists, this should have provided you with possible scenarios.
NSL, even so, I'd have been off the accelerator pedal, at about 45mph and probably covering the brake pedal.
Clear the hazard and positive acceleration will soon get you back to NSL, if appropriate.
It's the old maxim, as others have said, "never assume from any other".

Edit, spelling.

Edited by WhoseGeneration on Monday 7th June 20:26

[spoonoff]

WhoseGeneration said:

Treat this as a lesson, which is, never be ashamed of slowing for hazards.
You had a staggered cross roads, with previously, a sign indicating this, you saw approaching traffic and cyclists, this should have provided you with possible scenarios.
NSL, even so, I'd have been off the accelerator pedal, at about 45mph and probably covering the brake pedal.
Clear the hazard and positive acceleration will soon get you back to NSL, if appropriate.
It's the old maxim, as others have said, "never assume from any other".

Edit, spelling.

Edited by WhoseGeneration on Monday 7th June 20:26

Totally agree with this. In that circumstance I would also have been covering the brake just in case. Not fond of the 'treat everyone like an idiot' mentality, but you have to protect yourself and your car from the legions of zombies out there.

[brillomaster]

i take a fairly pessimistic view of this kind of thing and its treated me well so far... i assume everyone else is a pill**k, and they're GOING to pull out or change lanes or go straight on while indicating left at a roundabout etc.

Basically, always be prepared for the worst - defensive driving i believe its called.

also, believe in stereotypes... old people are 90% terrible - if you see a beat up old corsa assume it could do anything at any point and steer well clear.

[Trabant]

brillomaster said:

i assume everyone else is a pill**k, and they're GOING to pull out or change lanes or go straight on while indicating left at a roundabout etc.

This ^^^

[philoldsmobile]

treat everyone around you as a complete idiot until they prove themselves otherwise, this is not just for driving, just life in general!

I'd echo what was said above, there were a number of things to suggest this wasn't the best stretch of road, the crossroads, an upcoming hazard sign, hazard lines, a doube turn lane (one each way) the relatively narrow section (in the picture at least) the cyclists and the fact that and nothing is ever going to cease to be a hazard until you have passed it. what if his clutch cable suddenly snapped? the road even has the word SLOW on it.

I understand your anger toward the 406 driver, but you should always have a back up plan, even if its just backing off a bit. not wanting to sound like a pr**k, but i do believe you were going considerably too fast, perhaps as suggested 40 - 45 would have been a lot better.

Edited by philoldsmobile on Thursday 15th July 18:18

[Dr.Moreau]

Sometimes on the bike you want to just stop in situations like this, literally just stop an walk away, cause on NSL roads you can't slow to 20mph, but going any quicker and they pull out you could easily die. And if you slow down they seem to wildly pull out as they get impatiant!

This isn't a go at car drivers, but as said a lot of them feel too safe, even more extream with range rover, x5 etc drivers.
I know saftey is good for cars but when you know you have 46 air bags and a crash at 103mph is something you can just buff out you don't even think about the dangers of driving anymore.

[WhoseGeneration]

Dr.Moreau said:

you don't even think about the dangers of driving anymore.

Many have never ever thought, beyond that required for passing their test.
"Advanced Driving" is merely an attempt to ask them to consider a thinking approach to their driving.
As those many are required to do in their occupations and often assessed upon for career progression.