wow, didn't see that one coming...
Discussion
I know it's hard to visualise a specific situation, but people have given me good insights into what might have been done better. Today's lesson...
Driving along a normal NSL SC road this evening (dark). Good visibility, all ok. Coming the other way, 3 or 4 cars in a train. The lead car is indicating left and is slowing to pull into a small entrance way. As I was coming up to it, it slows more and the car behind decides to pull out to pass it right onto my side of the road. Somehow we miss the head-on and I see a flash of a scared face (plus pax) and L plates.
I had definitely slowed some through instinct as I have seen the train, but had no conscious thought at all that I might face a car coming towards me on my side of the road.
Apart from being more cautious of that specific situation in future, any thoughts on anything I shouldve/couldve seen or done better?
Bert
Driving along a normal NSL SC road this evening (dark). Good visibility, all ok. Coming the other way, 3 or 4 cars in a train. The lead car is indicating left and is slowing to pull into a small entrance way. As I was coming up to it, it slows more and the car behind decides to pull out to pass it right onto my side of the road. Somehow we miss the head-on and I see a flash of a scared face (plus pax) and L plates.
I had definitely slowed some through instinct as I have seen the train, but had no conscious thought at all that I might face a car coming towards me on my side of the road.
Apart from being more cautious of that specific situation in future, any thoughts on anything I shouldve/couldve seen or done better?
Bert
The counsel of perfection is that you should have been considering the possibility of the followers pulling out, and looking for your options in advance - for example, looking for escape routes onto the verge. Also, you could have been ready with your finger on the light flasher, ready to apply main beam, as well as brake, the instant the follower pulled out.
Is it possible that your position made it look to the learner that there was room for three abreast, in which case a more dominant position, but still in your lane, might have made the learner more likely to wait?
But in the real world I think you were doing pretty well to be braking already, and to have avoided an accident. I hope the supervising driver has now raised their game.
Is it possible that your position made it look to the learner that there was room for three abreast, in which case a more dominant position, but still in your lane, might have made the learner more likely to wait?
But in the real world I think you were doing pretty well to be braking already, and to have avoided an accident. I hope the supervising driver has now raised their game.
Syndrome said:
waremark said:
Also, you could have been ready with your finger on the light flasher, ready to apply main beam, as well as brake, the instant the follower pulled out.
gdaybruce said:
And that's why even careful drivers need seat belts, air bags and crumple zones!
+1I had an accident a couple of weeks back and have been pulling it apart in my head ever since.
Unfortunately I cannot think of anything I would do differentely were I to rerun the drive again. Which means I would crash again
fadeaway said:
Syndrome said:
waremark said:
Also, you could have been ready with your finger on the light flasher, ready to apply main beam, as well as brake, the instant the follower pulled out.
Difficult to say without being there but sometimes these things just do come at you and there's nothing you can do about it. Did the learner just not react to the car slowing in front of them, and tried to escape into your path? Or was it more a case of slowing but not looking/seeing and pulling out anyway? In the first example a headlight flash would be pretty useless, in the second it could be useful.
I've had situations like this a lot around where I live with horses and bikes. It's not the horse or the bike that's the problem, but the car coming the other way that's overtaking with no clear line of sight!
Clearly though, even coming to a complete halt won't stop someone who can't focus beyond the end of their bonnet driving straight into you. As someone said above, this is why I wear a seatbelt!!
Clearly though, even coming to a complete halt won't stop someone who can't focus beyond the end of their bonnet driving straight into you. As someone said above, this is why I wear a seatbelt!!
People have been talking about my suggestion to 'flash'. I want first to clarify that if I use main beam as a warning, it is vital to show mains for too long to be interpreted as a flash which means 'you go first'.
It was the supervising driver's job to say a very firm 'STOP' or 'BRAKE' to the learner. The main beams might have woken them up to do their job. (One day this summer as my learner daughter was driving on an NSL A road someone was overtaking dangerously towards us. I did say STOP, she did brake firmly, and all was well. STOP was not literally right, but it was urgent and unambiguous. She said: 'I would have been dead if you hadn't been there'.
It was the supervising driver's job to say a very firm 'STOP' or 'BRAKE' to the learner. The main beams might have woken them up to do their job. (One day this summer as my learner daughter was driving on an NSL A road someone was overtaking dangerously towards us. I did say STOP, she did brake firmly, and all was well. STOP was not literally right, but it was urgent and unambiguous. She said: 'I would have been dead if you hadn't been there'.
Anyone else observed that, when one is turning left, the follower, often very close, just pulls out to overtake?
With no concern for those oncoming.
Just another factor I consider.
There is no driving plan for most, just reaction.
For example, today, 30 limit, us driving on major road, junction on our right, bus stopped on major road at that junction, blocking view from that right junction.
L driver, under instruction, comes from that right junction, round back of bus into major road, across centreline.
Now, I don't know about others here but I treat buses with great caution, especially with regards to their pulling out and the just alighted stepping out.
"What's that instructor about", I said to Mrs. WG.
"Exactly", she replied.
Oh well, what do I know?
With no concern for those oncoming.
Just another factor I consider.
There is no driving plan for most, just reaction.
For example, today, 30 limit, us driving on major road, junction on our right, bus stopped on major road at that junction, blocking view from that right junction.
L driver, under instruction, comes from that right junction, round back of bus into major road, across centreline.
Now, I don't know about others here but I treat buses with great caution, especially with regards to their pulling out and the just alighted stepping out.
"What's that instructor about", I said to Mrs. WG.
"Exactly", she replied.
Oh well, what do I know?
Obviously it's not clear whether any of these learners are under professional instruction and therefore presumably with dual controls and trained instructors.
Sitting alongside a learner a while back I found that there seemed to have been far too much emphasis on "progress progress progress!" Well too much emphasis for my taste anyway.
Now I can understand why instructors do it, otherwise many pupils would bumble along in their comfort zone, but... hmmm.
At times it does mean that as supervising driver but without dual controls you do have to be forceful and issue a "FFS SLOW DOWN!" or similar command as there just isn't always time to discuss the niceties of observation link...> which means that... > therefore to prevent... > and give the possibility to... >plan to .... etc etc.
One long ago strangled utterance of "Stop!" to my Mrs is still the subject af family amusement.
Sitting alongside a learner a while back I found that there seemed to have been far too much emphasis on "progress progress progress!" Well too much emphasis for my taste anyway.
Now I can understand why instructors do it, otherwise many pupils would bumble along in their comfort zone, but... hmmm.
At times it does mean that as supervising driver but without dual controls you do have to be forceful and issue a "FFS SLOW DOWN!" or similar command as there just isn't always time to discuss the niceties of observation link...> which means that... > therefore to prevent... > and give the possibility to... >plan to .... etc etc.
One long ago strangled utterance of "Stop!" to my Mrs is still the subject af family amusement.
I'm always very wary of oncoming cars on single carriageways when there is >1 car (road train). Especially if the front vehicle is large - van or something like that, so the cars behind have limited visibility.
I try to make myself very visible - move on the road to make sure I've been in all of their line of sight, slow down (if appropriate) to give myself space but nto so much they see it as an invite to pull out, and keep a close eye on their body language while hovering over the horn.
Sounds like you did the right thing though
I try to make myself very visible - move on the road to make sure I've been in all of their line of sight, slow down (if appropriate) to give myself space but nto so much they see it as an invite to pull out, and keep a close eye on their body language while hovering over the horn.
Sounds like you did the right thing though
Thanks everyone for the thoughts. Also forgot to say that the road has double white lines as althoug it's straight it has some undulations.
There is little room to position specifically to take more command of the side of the road I was on. There is certainly no chance the oncoming car would be thinking there's room for three abreast. I think the learner just panicked at the increased slowing and reacting without thinking pulled out to avoid hitting it.
I think the key learning (hehe) from this is to regard a train of cars coming in the other direction as a higher risk hazard than I would have done before.
Bert
There is little room to position specifically to take more command of the side of the road I was on. There is certainly no chance the oncoming car would be thinking there's room for three abreast. I think the learner just panicked at the increased slowing and reacting without thinking pulled out to avoid hitting it.
I think the key learning (hehe) from this is to regard a train of cars coming in the other direction as a higher risk hazard than I would have done before.
Bert
They won't try that one again hopefully!Gassing Station | Advanced Driving | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff