Is 70 safe on UK Motorways?

[dom180]

Just wondered what the consensus is?

Try being in the left hand lane doing 70 and then try to overtake someone doing 65/67mph when it's fairly busy....Either way you seem to be dammed - either pull out and annoy a middle lane sticker who'll soom be tailgaiting you for doing 70, even if there was a large enough gap initially or don't pull out and get progressively slower and slower until people behind you get frustrated and then attempt dangerous overtaking manoevers on you, putting yourself in danger... And what about doing 70 with a junction coming up when its busy and you're coming up behind an elderly driver slowing for the turning with lorries behind....

By sticking to the limit you really seem to constrain what you can do to avoid dangerous situations and hazards....

I had a great drive through Germany on the Autobahns recently and the standard of driving there seemed to be far better than here - no bunching, less tailgaiting and proper lane disipline. And it was great to travel at over 100 mph, space and visibility permitting - it seemed far safer than trying to stick to 70 on a busy UK Motorways.

Is it fair that the Governement either criminalises motorists or forces them to drive dangerously....?

[vonhosen]

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

[dom180]

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Exactly, so you end up doing 50 with a queue of cars trying (dangerously) to pass you..

[Munter]

Can't say I have a problem. Set cruise to 70. If catch car in front pull in to lane 2 when there is space. If someone catches you while overtaking. They wait or use lane 3.

Job done. Not dead yet.

[vonhosen]

dom180 said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Exactly, so you end up doing 50 with a queue of cars trying (dangerously) to pass you..

If the vehicle in front is doing 50 you have a 20mph differential available to you. That's fine for overtaking.

[vonhosen]

Munter said:

Can't say I have a problem. Set cruise to 70. If catch car in front pull in to lane 2 when there is space. If someone catches you while overtaking. They wait or use lane 3.

Job done. Not dead yet.

Indeed.

[dom180]

vonhosen said:

dom180 said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Exactly, so you end up doing 50 with a queue of cars trying (dangerously) to pass you..

If the vehicle in front is doing 50 you have a 20mph differential available to you. That's fine for overtaking.

It just seems that in Germany, you can use speed to avoid hazards - here constrained by a low limit relative to the average speeds, it's a lot more difficult. Try getting from the left hand lane to the middle when its busy without a blue light...

[Munter]

dom180 said:

vonhosen said:

dom180 said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Exactly, so you end up doing 50 with a queue of cars trying (dangerously) to pass you..

If the vehicle in front is doing 50 you have a 20mph differential available to you. That's fine for overtaking.

It just seems that in Germany, you can use speed to avoid hazards - here constrained by a low limit relative to the average speeds, it's a lot more difficult. Try getting from the left hand lane to the middle when its busy without a blue light...

I manage it. Generally by looking well ahead and identifying a suitable gap coming up behind. Then when he last car before the gap comes past indicate and pull out.

Seriously I do 25 - 30k miles a year 90% of it on the motorways at 70mph. And I don't have issues like you describe.

[HRG.]

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Yup, traffic would flow far more smoothly if the limit was 100.

[vonhosen]

dom180 said:

vonhosen said:

dom180 said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Exactly, so you end up doing 50 with a queue of cars trying (dangerously) to pass you..

If the vehicle in front is doing 50 you have a 20mph differential available to you. That's fine for overtaking.

It just seems that in Germany, you can use speed to avoid hazards - here constrained by a low limit relative to the average speeds, it's a lot more difficult. Try getting from the left hand lane to the middle when its busy without a blue light...

I go from the left hand lane to the middle without problem when I need to (& without blue lights). It's easier in a car than an artic.

[forty-two]

Aren't all speedo readouts slightly over optimistic, so if you set your cruise at 75mph you could in reality be doing a real 70mph. Everyone else who is doing an indicated 70mph is really doing 65mph so you have a 5mph advantage. That should be enough for safe overtaking...

Or just follow the pack at 80mph and get on with it...

[vonhosen]

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Yup, traffic would flow far more smoothly if the limit was 100.

Yet in heavy traffic they find lowering the limit (with variable limits) is actually more effective than keeping it at 70 to aid a smooth consistent flow.

[HRG.]

vonhosen said:

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Yup, traffic would flow far more smoothly if the limit was 100.

Yet in heavy traffic they find lowering the limit (with variable limits) is actually more effective than keeping it at 70 to aid a smooth consistent flow.

It's never been tried in the UK. There would be less heavy traffic if we were to raise the limit.

[Munter]

forty-two said:

Aren't all speedo readouts slightly over optimistic, so if you set your cruise at 75mph you could in reality be doing a real 70mph. Everyone else who is doing an indicated 70mph is really doing 65mph so you have a 5mph advantage. That should be enough for safe overtaking...

Or just follow the pack at 80mph and get on with it...

If you believe my satnav. At 70 my speedo under reads by just 2 mph... However at 75 it over reads by 5...

The only reason I can see for this sudden change in calibration is the the needle is on the way down the "other" side of the dial at satnav 75.

Anyway IF you believe the old satnav it's not 5 mph all the time. But I'd think the differences in calibration are not going to get you pulled.

[vonhosen]

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Yup, traffic would flow far more smoothly if the limit was 100.

Yet in heavy traffic they find lowering the limit (with variable limits) is actually more effective than keeping it at 70 to aid a smooth consistent flow.

It's never been tried in the UK. There would be less heavy traffic if we were to raise the limit.

There'd be more noise too if we did & greater differentials.
It was tried in the early 60's & people failed to drive to the conditions, that's why the NSL limits were introduced.

Edited by vonhosen on Thursday 15th October 22:08

[vonhosen]

Munter said:

forty-two said:

Aren't all speedo readouts slightly over optimistic, so if you set your cruise at 75mph you could in reality be doing a real 70mph. Everyone else who is doing an indicated 70mph is really doing 65mph so you have a 5mph advantage. That should be enough for safe overtaking...

Or just follow the pack at 80mph and get on with it...

If you believe my satnav. At 70 my speedo under reads by just 2 mph... However at 75 it over reads by 5...

The only reason I can see for this sudden change in calibration is the the needle is on the way down the "other" side of the dial at satnav 75.

Anyway IF you believe the old satnav it's not 5 mph all the time. But I'd think the differences in calibration are not going to get you pulled.

Indeed they aren't.

I don't know of anyone being prosecuted for a true 75mph (indicated 80 ?) in a 70 on the motorway, do you ?

Edited by vonhosen on Thursday 15th October 22:08

[HRG.]

vonhosen said:

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Yup, traffic would flow far more smoothly if the limit was 100.

Yet in heavy traffic they find lowering the limit (with variable limits) is actually more effective than keeping it at 70 to aid a smooth consistent flow.

It's never been tried in the UK. There would be less heavy traffic if we were to raise the limit.

There's be more noise too if we did & greater differentials.
It was tried in the early 60's & people failed to drive to the conditions, that's why the NSL limits were introduced.

Noise isn't in the debate, congestion is and a higher limit would decrease it. Reduced congestion decreases the likelihood of a collision. A higher limit would allow greater vehicle spacing.

[vonhosen]

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

HRG. said:

vonhosen said:

What's the point in trying to overtake where you have a 3mph differential available ?

Yup, traffic would flow far more smoothly if the limit was 100.

Yet in heavy traffic they find lowering the limit (with variable limits) is actually more effective than keeping it at 70 to aid a smooth consistent flow.

It's never been tried in the UK. There would be less heavy traffic if we were to raise the limit.

There's be more noise too if we did & greater differentials.
It was tried in the early 60's & people failed to drive to the conditions, that's why the NSL limits were introduced.

Noise isn't in the debate, congestion is and a higher limit would decrease it. Reduced congestion decreases the likelihood of a collision. A higher limit would allow greater vehicle spacing.

Noise is in the debate, it's one of the reasons higher limits on the motorway have been rejected in the past.

In fact there was a thread about noise from motorways on here last week & how far away it could be heard.

[Munter]

vonhosen said:

I don't know of anyone being prosecuted for a true 75mph (indicated 80 ?) in a 70 on the motorway, do you ?

I can't say I do. But it's not the 1st thing I ask people I meet. I'd suspect you're more likely to have the data on that...

[dom180]

vonhosen said:

Munter said:

forty-two said:

Aren't all speedo readouts slightly over optimistic, so if you set your cruise at 75mph you could in reality be doing a real 70mph. Everyone else who is doing an indicated 70mph is really doing 65mph so you have a 5mph advantage. That should be enough for safe overtaking...

Or just follow the pack at 80mph and get on with it...

If you believe my satnav. At 70 my speedo under reads by just 2 mph... However at 75 it over reads by 5...

The only reason I can see for this sudden change in calibration is the the needle is on the way down the "other" side of the dial at satnav 75.

Anyway IF you believe the old satnav it's not 5 mph all the time. But I'd think the differences in calibration are not going to get you pulled.

Indeed they aren't.

I don't know of anyone being prosecuted for a true 75mph (indicated 80 ?) on the motorway, do you ?

Surely better to have a realistic limit - i.e 85 and then people know where they are - as it is most people assume 85 is ok and the few people who choose to stick to the letter of the law are disadvantaged as it takes more effort to stick to 70 then 80/85.