Positive reinforcement of aggressive driving?

[julianm]

Having had a couple of unpleasant experiences this week on dual carrigeway & A roads where I`ve basically had to GET OUT OF THE WAY of someone exceeding limits by a good margin & approaching very close to my back bumper:
I recalled my limited understanding of B.F. Skinner`s theory of positive reinforcement which seemed to suggest that I`ve just made them both much more likely to continue in their tailgating/charging approach to force their way to wherever they want to be.
Is there anything that will make it less likely they will keep on driving like this?
I`m honestly not a trundling inattentive driver......

[7db]

You could martyr yourself or your licence on his front bumper.

Otherwise your best bet is to keep out of their way, and wait for the lesson to get dished out by someone worse than them.

[Martin A]

Hi All

One more reinforcement or disappointment won't affect them either way as the behaviour is already so ingrained.

Hope this helps

Best regards

Martin A

[CivicMan]

I always let them pass and keep my fingers crossed that I'll find them further down the road wrapped around a large tree, preferably without taking any other road user out. A fireball would be an added bonus.

[7db]

Do bear in mind that others will wish the same for you when they observe your driving and perceive it to be dangerous or antisocial.

[EvilChap]

I wonder if you could get out of the way easily, suggesting you were in an overtaking lane but not making much progress, if it isn't people doing things like that which frustrates other road users enough to feel the need to pressure them out of the way.

My understanding is you keep left unless overtaking, so I am never in anybodies way. I drive an AX diesel every day, which I know is slow and awful, but I do not hold people up.

My weekend car being a 200SX I understand about wanting to make progress perhaps more urgently than other people in AX's!

Try driving in France for an idea of this, they dont get upset if they see people coming up behind them, they positively move out of the way for you on their motorways, and it's a pleasure to drive there with this attitude! Over hear people seem to get angry at the prospect of being overtaken, even to the extent of putting their foot down when they move over, which begs the question why didn't they do that before, so nobody would be overtaking them anyways?

[BertBert]

EvilChap said:

I wonder if you could get out of the way easily, suggesting you were in an overtaking lane but not making much progress, if it isn't people doing things like that which frustrates other road users enough to feel the need to pressure them out of the way.

It's interesting that you could glean such a detailed situational analysis from the the OP said.

EvilChap said:

My understanding is you keep left unless overtaking, so I am never in anybodies way. I drive an AX diesel every day, which I know is slow and awful, but I do not hold people up.

Then go on with the wonderful "never" word.

EvilChap said:

Try driving in France for an idea of this, they dont get upset if they see people coming up behind them, they positively move out of the way for you on their motorways, and it's a pleasure to drive there with this attitude! Over hear people seem to get angry at the prospect of being overtaken, even to the extent of putting their foot down when they move over, which begs the question why didn't they do that before, so nobody would be overtaking them anyways?

Yep, that works very well for the standard French 2-lane DCs. It quickly degrades on the 3 or 4 lane parts and looks very "English".

Bert

[julianm]

Hello & well it`s funny how you should mention France, as though I don`t get to drve there as often as I would like, I too just enjoy the way trafic flows as they all just stick to the system. I`ve no problem with pulling over for a faster car - indeed on the Autoroute it`s almost fun waiting for the eventual arrival of the big Merc or 911 in the mirror (indicating constantly of course) when you are overaking a string of HGV`s @ ???kph.
As for over here - 8 cars in front of me on D/C, HGV`s @ 56mph - if I dive into the small gap between them I`m not going to get out at all easily. When I do get `out of the way`, the `last` car gets the same treatment I did. When there is a suitable gap I tend to accelerate @ pull in out of the way to lane 1, leaving them to pass by. They can go anyway - I don`t need them a yard off my bumper. Citroen AX? - high performance (!) compared to my old 2CV, which did teach you the skill of looking beyond the front of the bonnet to anticipate & plan for that rare overtaking moment.
I`ll keep an eye open for you -

[Mr_annie_vxr]

Never get dragged into someone elses bad driving. Never allow yourself to get annoyed or angered by it as then your driving is affected,

I just let people get on with it and get out their way.

I have been lucky to have a lot of training at your expense though.

[7mike]

Mr_annie_vxr said:

Never get dragged into someone elses bad driving. Never allow yourself to get annoyed or angered by it as then your driving is affected,

I just let people get on with it and get out their way.

I have been lucky to have a lot of training at your expense though.

Good advice, thanks for sharing......





.......seeing as how we have paid so much for it

[Mr_annie_vxr]

7mike said:

Mr_annie_vxr said:

Never get dragged into someone elses bad driving. Never allow yourself to get annoyed or angered by it as then your driving is affected,

I just let people get on with it and get out their way.

I have been lucky to have a lot of training at your expense though.

Good advice, thanks for sharing......





.......seeing as how we have paid so much for it

I think its good value... but then I get to use it.

[The Black Flash]

julianm said:

Hello & well it`s funny how you should mention France, as though I don`t get to drve there as often as I would like, I too just enjoy the way trafic flows as they all just stick to the system.

This is a very rose-tinted view, in my experience. When it's quiet on DCs, yes its all very polite. On busier motorways, I would say it is far more pushy (and dangerous) than it is in the UK. People will force their way into tiny gaps without indicating or looking, tailgating is "just normal", and driving seems very much on a par with the french queueing philosophy - elbows out and force your way along.

I think it's more to do with how busy a place is than anything else. Drive in italy around naples/sorrento area and it's all horns and frenetic weaving about. Drive in the dolemites and it's a happy place of relaxed politeness.

[Monkey on a bike]

Fit a tow bar and carry on consentrating on driving your car - dont make allowances for them, if they go into the back of you, their car will most likely be a write off.

Will they care - probably not.

When some pr1ck is tail-gating me on an A road I just sit at the same speed and relax. They arent going to make me go any faster, I am a trained and educated driver and will adjust my speed and distance to the car infront accordingly - I never tail-gate, 2 second rule always applys. If the car behind thinks its okay to travel faster - they can overtake at the right opportunity and do so,.

Edited by Monkey on a bike on Thursday 2nd April 16:20

[Odie]

Try to drive like an adult (Sensibly and clear headed)

Instead of like a child (Inconsiderately) or a Parent (controllingly)


Acting like a parent in that situation would most likely make them more aggressive.

[CommanderJameson]

I try very hard to avoid becoming emotionally involved in my driving or that of others - which is a poncy way of saying I try not to get wound up by knobheads.

I drive a lot for work and pleasure, and if I allow myself to get cranked up by every blind, stupid or aggressive idiot I see, I'll be on the way to a nice big ulcer or a heart attack.

[Romanymagic]

If someone is travelling behind me and clearly wants to go faster than me then I don't see why I should hold them up and will allow them through as soon as it is safe to do so. This includes sides roads. I will pull into the kerb, allow them past and then pull out again.

I don't see the point of holding other road users up because I think (believe) that the other driver is driving inapropriately. If anything, if you believe the other driver to be driving inappropriately then you have even more reason to get out of the other person's way.