Anxious When Driven by Non Adv. Drivers...

[Speed_Demon]

Does anyone suffer from this? I have been into advanced driving and generally bettering my car control for about a year and a half now and the more I learn the more anxious I now am when being driven by other drivers. I can't help but thinking 'Oh christ I'm going to die' when they put the clutch fully in when cornering, or stuffing all braking, indication and gear change into one second when turning down a side road, or following far too close to the vehicle in front or straight lining a dual lane roundabout in traffic, etc etc. So this means I can't relax at all and am constantly on edge.

As well as this, they are constantly in the wrong gear, are not anticipating hazards, not taking a good view down the road, braking too often or too little, constantly stopping at roundabouts because of poor observation and planning skills etc and so on. So the drive is not at all comfortable either, this just makes the above feeling worse.

I know some may say 'Well why do you not make a few suggestions to them?', well we all know that drivers take it personally when you even recommend something (let alone outright criticise something), what makes it worse is I am 20 year old male, with frinds of the same age and sex, they would really take it badly if I said something.
I try to drive when I can, but it isn't always possible.

Can anyone relate or have any thoughts?

Thanks guys.

Edited by Speed_Demon on Sunday 11th January 01:21

[Hooli]

Speed_Demon said:

Can anyone relate?

totally. i'm a crap passenger for all the reasons you mention above. i know several people i wont get in a car with if their is any option to avoid it.
im a biker too & there is no way i'd ever get on the back of a bike as i just wouldnt feel safe to an even greater degree.
oddly enough this even applies with people i think ride/drive better than me. maybe its just a control thing?

[gazza_3]

Do you ever find yourself putting your feet on the floor as if you have a brake when your in the passenger seat?

[Speed_Demon]

gazza_3 said:

Do you ever find yourself putting your feet on the floor as if you have a brake when your in the passenger seat?

On more than one ocassion, yup.

[heebeegeetee]

I've longed believed that bad passengers make bad drivers. I've had some experience of this.

Anyone else think this, or is it just me?

[ADJimbo]

Speed_Demon said:

Can anyone relate or have any thoughts?

Thanks guys.

Edited by Speed_Demon on Sunday 11th January 01:21

I'm totally with you on this subject SD. I feel totally comfortable when passangering with someone who is either a) an accomplished Advanced Driver or someone willing to b) take tuition - anybody else, frequently the 'there is nothing wrong with my driving brigade' scare me to death...

But then, so do the people who come onto this forum and comment on Advanced Driving issues who have never heard of Roadcraft, let alone (not aimed at you SD) picked up a copy...

[Jungles]

heebeegeetee said:

I've longed believed that bad passengers make bad drivers. I've had some experience of this.

Anyone else think this, or is it just me?

Bad passengers generally have "guru driver" syndrome, which invariably leads to over-appreciation of their own driving, negative perception of alternative (but still safe) driving practices, which potentially indicates overconfidence and poor judgement.

Have I stirred up a nest?

Seriously, unless what the driver does is definitely and obviously dangerous, it's better to just shut up and let them drive. I have yet to see anyone who is so obviously dangerous. Plenty of somewhat dodgy drivers out there, but very few are truly menacing.

Two of my friends (driving in a convoy, one was my passenger, the other was a driver behind me) criticised me once for off-siding on a slow (30kph), open corner with clear visibility for around 200 metres and no traffic. One of them have taken quite a bit of advanced driving tuition.

Edited by Jungles on Sunday 11th January 06:59

[dilbert]

Jungles said:

heebeegeetee said:

I've longed believed that bad passengers make bad drivers. I've had some experience of this.

Anyone else think this, or is it just me?

Bad passengers generally have "guru driver" syndrome, which invariably leads to over-appreciation of their own driving, negative perception of alternative (but still safe) driving practices, which potentially indicates overconfidence and poor judgement.

Have I stirred up a nest?

Seriously, unless what the driver does is definitely and obviously dangerous, it's better to just shut up and let them drive. I have yet to see anyone who is so obviously dangerous. Plenty of somewhat dodgy drivers out there, but very few are truly menacing.

Two of my friends (driving in a convoy, one was my passenger, the other was a driver behind me) criticised me once for off-siding on a slow (30kph), open corner with clear visibility for around 200 metres and no traffic. One of them have taken quite a bit of advanced driving tuition.

Edited by Jungles on Sunday 11th January 06:59

Blimey. That was my first thought.

To the OP.....

Forget the advanced driving, till you've got a pipe and slippers, and get a proper hobby, like flying or something.

[CommanderJameson]

heebeegeetee said:

I've longed believed that bad passengers make bad drivers. I've had some experience of this.

Anyone else think this, or is it just me?

I think that bad passengers make impatient drivers, which, I suppose, is the same thing.

When I'm a passenger, the driving has to be egregiously bad for me to care.

[dilbert]

FWIW, I used to be a careless passenger, until I nearly died at the hands of a schoolmate just after he passed his test. He wasn't being stupid or anything, just not looking where he was going. We drove into a 300 year old oak tree (at about 30mph). Needless to say the tree didn't notice, but my mate broke his back.

That taught me more than any advanced driving course would have.

If you're anxious as a passenger, do like I do, just ask the driver to stop, get out and walk home.

Don't whinge in some holier than though fashion, because if you have something to worry about, the only way you're not going to die is to get out of the car, and let the accident happen somewhere you are not.

Edited by dilbert on Sunday 11th January 08:11

[p1esk]

I very much enjoy being driven by other people, because I like to see how they do things. It gives me opportunities to pick up a few things that might help me to progress towards the style(s) I wish to produce.

....and this may not have much to do with what is popularly regarded as advanced driving. I go my own way.

Very seldom do I feel seriously concerned by the performance of other drivers. I'm usually fairly laid back about the whole thing. Even with relatively poor drivers the risk of coming to harm on any one journey is statistically very small, so I don't worry about it. Que sera, and all that....

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[arryb]

Don't worry, I'm the same (1 year older than you), it's not the fact that they aren't advanced drivers, just not overly natural behind the wheel. One of my biggest annoyances is one you picked up on, the stopping at every junction/roundabout purely because they haven't got it in them to slow down, take a look and keep the car moving!! I've never said anything because my ex-girlfriend says I always comment on her driving so I'm trying to stop myself I think my mate can tell and gets very nervous when I'm in the passenger seat (I don't comment on his driving!!) but whenever he tries to park, it takes him millions of attempts and he also slips the clutch a LOT to get going, probably so he doesn't stall infront of me

[Dr Jekyll]

I was passengering a colleague the other day who never made me feel remotely unsafe, but seemed to make no attempt to match revs on downchanges.

So not dangerous in the circumstances (low powered FWD), but uncomfortable and certainly not good driving. Am I justified in finding it irritating?

[Speed_Demon]

I was expecting some may bring up the over-appreciation of my own driving. That is one thing I make sure never to happen as I am always trying to learn and recognise when I make mistakes. While I know that the chances of an accident are very unlikely, I'd still rather have the chances as low as possible!

[ChapppeRS]

I'm a bit like this, although i'm yet to take any advanced driving tuition. I suppose the bigger problem with me is first time being a passenger. Once I've got to know people I'm either very relaxed, a bit uneasy or I get bored because I'm sitting in a car and not driving myself!

I had experience with it from the other side on Friday however. Driving a collegue over to the other site (one car there, two back) he piped up and criticised me on a few things. On the way back I observed his driving as I followed him in the other car and it was some of the most agressive driving I've seen for a long while. So while he may have indicated a few more times than I did, the time he spent inches from peoples' bumpers and that impatient on/off braking I'm sure everyone has seen was FAR worse. Oh and how much time did he make up on me (hanging back, observing everything and taking it generally easy)? Well, none.

So really the moral is no matter how good you think you are, you're probably nowhere near and the person you're commenting on probably has just as many critisms about you!

[Farmboy UK]

I don't generally feel unsafe as a passenger in a car unless the driver is a lunatic. It's more things like driving too fast for the road conditions. I was with a mate the other day who was hammering along these frosty lanes at what would be a reasonable pace on a dry day. I just felt slightly on edge.

My problem of course is that I am NOT yet an advanced driver and I am happy to admit that. So I don't really have much right advising my friend how to drive. If I tell him that he'd make more progress if he slowed down a bit and made some better observations then why should he listen to me.

All the more incentive for me to keep learning!!!!

[waremark]

As Dave has said, even the worst driver is statistically unlikely to have an accident on any one particular journey. I am nearly always relaxed as a passenger; though I don't find myself being driven by young drivers, except by my own (well-trained!) children.

I think it is extremely difficult to criticise someone's driving in a way which will be taken constructively. One way to do it is to start a conversation based on something which they are doing well. Suppose your driver has been following too close: next time he is a reasonable distance behind the car in front you might say: 'I feel comfortable with this following distance. When we were behind the ??? I was wondering what would happen if he braked. What do you think?'

Perhaps a better approach is next time you are driving the person in question to point out just a couple of aspects of the way you are driving, and explain why you are doing what you are doing. If you then receive criticisms on some aspects of your driving, at least it has started a useful conversation.

[7db]

I've often noted that you can't change someone's driving from outside their car (by suggesting they make coffee or tooting or whatever), but you also can't change their driving from inside the car unless you have their permission.

That can be sought ought, or can be offered to you, but without it you might as well not bother.

Personally being driven by bad drivers scares the sh!t out of me, and I try focusing on everything else to manage my emotions. However, if push came to shove, and I felt in imminent danger, I would say something. Forcefully.

[WhoseGeneration]

I am rarely driven by others, sometimes by Mrs. WG or a good friend, both also ADs, so that's ok.
However, on the rare occasions I am driven by one not of the persuasion, I often feel a tad anxious.
Sort of observing without commenting!

[Don]

I am an IAM Observer. When driven by people with no AD training I simply shut up. If they wanted training they'd join the IAM/Rospa/GEM whatever - so I have to presume they don't.

Few are so devastatingly bad that I want to get out of the car. But some are. I avoid being driven by these people a second time...